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  #1  
Old 01-22-2010, 10:17 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2008
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My "new" 240D, joy and sadness

Hi All,

I decided to buy an old MB diesel and found a lovely 82 240D 4-speed. It is a perfect specimen, with maintenance records going all the way back. I cannot emphasize this enough. It is a lovely car. That is the good news.

The bad news is that it does not start well when cold. But we are not talking real cold, this AM is was 36F. I now learn the PO regularly plugged it in when cold, but 36F is not cold, and that is not acceptable, so things need to change. I have read every cold start link, so I know there are many options.

But there are also a few things I would like to get some feedback on. I will point out that although it is perfectly kept, it is due for all routine maintenance (180K miles)

- I guess I need a compression test, but I am scared. The car runs like a top after about a minute after starting btw.
- I'll certainly adjust the valves, but I need to fashion some wrenches first.
- The battery is old, 12/21/2000, but only 25K miles. I suppose I should just get one, though I am sure the issue is older than the battery Recommendations r.e. the batt?
- PO uses 20w50. I suppose a lighter weight oil would help. I ordered an oil filter on line but this cannot wait till next week I guess. No idea where to get Mahle filters locally - dealer? ($$$$)
- I checked the glow plug relay. Resistance to all plugs is ~1ohm. Plugs were replaced 11/11/2006, but this was only 3K miles ago.
- primary fuel filter is black. I ordered these online too but maybe should go get one this AM (if it ever starts).
- No idea how to check the fuel itself, again, it runs fine when it gets going.
- At this point, she turns over too slow to get anything going, and without jumpers, I sit and let the block heater/charger do the work. This lovely, perfectly waxed, immaculate 28 year old survivor...and she can't make it out of the driveway on a 35 degree day.

A bit sad...could use some feedback.


Last edited by Sulawesi; 01-22-2010 at 10:24 AM.
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  #2  
Old 01-22-2010, 10:21 AM
toomany MBZ's Avatar
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Once it's started take it to an auto parts store that will diagnose your system for free.
I had a similar problem, it turned out to be the starter.
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  #3  
Old 01-22-2010, 10:34 AM
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It sounds like it might not have been driven much...3k miles in 3 years.

Where are you? You might be able to go to a lighter synthetic oil (perhaps 5w40), to aid in cold starting. However, the thinner oil may cause temperamental seals to leak (perhaps aggravated by the synthetic cleaning out deposits that were keeping them sealed).

I'd change both filters (primary and secondary) as a precaution. Any water in the secondary, combined with cold weather, can't help the process. With a new primary, you'll be able to see how quickly it clogs (or if it does), and make a determination if there's an "algae" problem.

Have a local parts store (autozone, etc) load test the battery (and starting system). You're going to want sufficient CCA (cold cranking amps). If it's insufficient, the starter won't spin as fast as it need be, and that will make it more difficult to start. Also, check the battery grounds and the connection at the starter. Can't hurt. In a pinch, you can increase the output of the battery by bringing it inside and letting it warm up to room temperature. Make sure it's fully charged, too. Also, you can let the glow plugs run until the relay kicks off audibly.

Some forum members have replaced the 616 starter with the turbo 617 version for the faster spinning of the engine.

Some of these things are quick and cheap, others are not. You shouldn't have trouble starting the car at 35F. I would hope that compression would not be a problem with 180k miles...
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  #4  
Old 01-22-2010, 10:46 AM
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I'd change the oil first. I run 15w-40 in mine. Maybe just enough difference. I'd check the voltage of the battery. As suggeted, just run it over to a parts store. The Fram filters for tihs car, if made in Turkey have a good reputation. I have used a NAPA filter too.
What brand of glow plugs were replaced with? Only Bosch or Beru. I had problems starting. I went through all the ohm meassurements. It showed no problems. I took out the glow plugs, and hooked them up to a battery charger. THe #1 cylinder plug was bad. After replacing it, it started a lot better. Also, might look into reaming out the carbon in the glow plug holes.
Tom
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  #5  
Old 01-22-2010, 12:20 PM
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After a reluctant start (and much smoke), she settled in a drove like a dream over to get a state inspection...I asked them to make sure she can crank (batt/starter) and that I would do the rest.

I just ordered some Bosch GPs and filters all around, and we'll see what happens when the valves are adjusted as well. In the meantime, I will admire her but not trust her.
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  #6  
Old 01-22-2010, 12:32 PM
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You need revs to start. 15W40 or 5W40 will help a lot. If the battery sat a lot in may not put out much. Freezing when discharged will damage it. Charge it, get it load checked. Replace if bad.

Check the ground strap. Clean battery contacts, a wire v@gina is a buck or 2 at harbor freight.

Not sure how much valve overlap there is on the 616, but if valves are hanging open you may get blowback in your face if you open the air cleaner, and you won't feel a sharp pop pop pop out of the exhaust pipe at idle.
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  #7  
Old 01-22-2010, 07:24 PM
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The battery is a no brainer it should be well sulphated by your description. Have it properly checked out.It has sat around far too much over the years. Valve adjustment if no records of one in the last few years. Or at least a valve clearance check.

Establish there is enough fuel pressure in the injection pump supply to enable overflow into the return line. Very low injection pump supply pressure will hinder easy starts to some extent. In fact if you like the car you should get a liquid filled gauge and get a running pressure of at least fourteen pounds present in there.Around 18-19 pounds is even better.

Read the extensive thread on the relief valve. It may be very important on the 616 engines in my opinion.
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  #8  
Old 01-22-2010, 10:18 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2008
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Thanks...

There are some excellent ideas here.

I now have a new battery...
15w40 oil, fuel filters, and a valve adjustment is next.
The fuel pressure/injection pump is a new topic for me, thanks!

I am not sure the brand of GPs, but they check out fine...

Thanks again, I'll get some pics up.
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  #9  
Old 01-23-2010, 01:48 AM
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Yeah.. I was gonna say replace the battery. Basically nothing that didn't get covered already.

It sounds like you got a real winner... 180K? That's insane.
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  #10  
Old 01-23-2010, 07:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dantheman67 View Post
Yeah.. I was gonna say replace the battery. Basically nothing that didn't get covered already.

It sounds like you got a real winner... 180K? That's insane.
I agree.
Everything on the original maintenance list on post #1 contributes to the hard starting with the exception of worries about the fuel.
Proper oil, strong battery, good starter and good glow plugs are needed for reliable starts. A valve adjustment is also a very good idea.
A few weeks ago, we had more than a one foor snow fall. I made a video of that first start at about 20 degrees F and the entire car buried on snow. It was a perfectly typical start. Cranked for about 5 seconds before it fired, and then ran roughly for a few more before settling down to a stable idle. These diesels can and will start in the winter.
Get those items up to snuff and you'll be able to enjoy all year driving!
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  #11  
Old 01-23-2010, 11:29 AM
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Post Black Fuel

This means you definately have a fugus problem , algae cannot grow in the dark tank .

Don't panic , just continue the routine maitenance procedures and get some Startron , it's a liquid you add 3 Oz. to each full tank of fuel and it'll kill and disolve the resultant crud so it passes through the engne and is burned , the alternative is removing the fuel tank and having it cleaned , mucho labor and some $ , Startron (boat stores) will allow you to drive it clean ~ really it will .

Enjoy your new (old) Mercedes ! she sounds like a pip .
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  #12  
Old 01-23-2010, 11:38 AM
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Definitely replace the battery.

In for pics!!
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  #13  
Old 01-23-2010, 11:43 AM
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Hi, Years ago I had a Ford xr4i that had a starting problem.

The engine would turn slow and just about catch and then run (2.8 v6 petrol).

New battery and check all earths etc and no difference.

So I thought I would pull the starter off and see if the brushes were shot.

Once removed and opened up the brushes were like new,so at this point I connected it to a battery to check the solenoid operation well it worked ok.

Eventually I dismantled the complete starter and found it had been damp inside and had rusted up inside the main motor.

Twenty minutes with a wire brush and re assembled and working perfectly with at least a 60% increase in engine cranking speed.

As you say yours once running is fine so it may be your starter just needs looking at.

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