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timing chain replacement
I just turned 320,000 miles and was thinking how good my car has been running. Does not burn or leak a drop of oil. I started to think about the timing chain and related parts. I have TONS of service records but none related to the replacement of timing chain. I adjusted my valves around 280,000 miles and the chain seemed fine then. I just wanted to be proactive.
What is the replacement interval for the chain and guides?
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'85 300SD (formerly california emissions) '08 Chevy Tahoe '93 Ducati 900 SS '79 Kawasaki KZ 650 '86 Kawasaki KX 250 '88 Kawasaki KDX200 '71 Hodaka Ace 100 '72 Triumph T100R |
#2
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Timing chain replacement is generally determined by the amount of stretch. If your chain is original then I would imagine it is overdue for replacement...general consensus seems to be around 200k until the stretch becomes worrisome.
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TC Current stable: - 2004 Mazda RALLYWANKEL - 2007 Saturn sky redline - 2004 Explorer...under surgery. Past: 135i, GTI, 300E, 300SD, 300SD, Stealth |
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What is the symptom of a stretched timing belt? How can I tell it is due for a replacement?
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300SDL project car |
#4
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No belt, it is a chain. Belts simply fail. You measure the stretch of the cam. A quick version is to pop the cam cover and line up the marks, then check the balancer to see how many degrees out you are at the moment.
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I'm not a doctor, but I'll have a look. '85 300SD 245k '87 300SDL 251k '90 300SEL 326k Six others from BMW, GM, and Ford. Liberty will not descend to a people; a people must raise themselves to liberty.[/IMG] |
#5
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There is no mileage interval for replacing the chain. They can last 200k or 500k.
The only MB approved method of checking timing chain stretch is here: http://www.peachparts.com/Wikka/OM617TimingChainStretch At 200k I would be more worried about the tensioner & guides. Danny
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1984 300SD Turbo Diesel 150,000 miles OBK member #23 (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your (")_(") signature to help him gain world domination |
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Timing chain "stretch" is a misnomer; the lengthening of the timing chain is due to the cumulative wear of the moving parts of the chain. The steel of the chain parts do not lengthen in any way. Over time and mileage the opening in the chain plates enlarge and the circumference of the chain pins decrease due to wear against each other. There are 136 links in a 61X engine and even very minor wear is multiplied 136 times and the result is cumulative. The elongation of the chain is in situ somewhat compensated by the tensioner and the timing can be adjusted incrementally with an offset Woodruff key.
The real question is a question! Do you have a reasonable understanding of the history of the engine's maintenance throughout the life of that chain? The chain wear is directly related to the quality and frequency of oil changes, frequent oil changes with correct oil lessens the cumulative wear on chain parts and less frequent oil changes and incorrect oil accelerates chain part wear. In diesel engines particularly, the carbon soot suspended in the oil acts as an abrasive, albeit very fine but abrasive none the less. I'm of the opinion that with 320,000 miles on possibly the original chain with an unconfirmed oil change schedule/quality it would be penny wise and pound foolish to choose an offset key to adjust timing rather than rolling in a new quality chain and replacing the tensioner for $250. If you plan on keeping and driving the car and you don't have a good reason to risk your investment in it, $250 is pretty inexpensive insurance to avoid what a catastrophe a failed timing chain can be! Good Luck! |
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When I asked a question of what the members thought caused theit Timing Chain to fail many indicated the believed the Vacuum Pump Failed and the parts fell into it.
When I as why they thought the Vacuum Pump Failed 2 interesting things came up. One was that if you have a Vacuum Leak and do not fix it for a long time your VP is working harder. Ther other was too much end play in the Fuel Injection Pump Timer (that drives the Vacuum Pump) caused by wear on the Intermediate Gear Shaft Bushings. New Vacuum Pump Ruined due to too much Timer Shaft End Play (the title from my notes). second vacuum pump, help! on a trip-Toronto
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84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel |
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#9
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I ask the question as to why the Timing Chains failed because I was interested to know why and have only recent experience with Mercedes. I would like to hear all of those numerous reasons why timing chains fail. Becaues, if we know them we might be able to prevent a failure. In one of the threads or posts on this Forum I also read that it is not uncommon for a new Timing Chain to fail within 100,000 miles. This leads me to suspect there is either a issue installing the Chain or there is a cause that thus far is not understood. I think one of those causes might be that too much Timer end pay that kills the Vacuum Pump which intern kills the new Timing Chain Job. But, I am speculating on that. I thought it would be helpful to the OP if he knew the other things that could have an effect on his old or new Timing Chain. In any event the OP can disregard the info he is not interested in.
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84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel |
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Just so it's on here, who makes quality chains....dealer item, aftermarket?
Any brands you should stay away from?
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----Adam 1985 300SD 322,000 |
#11
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IIRC, buy the IWIS chain and use the proper finishing tool to mash the connecting pins.
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RRGrassi 70's Southern Pacific #5608 Fairmont A-4 MOW car 13 VW JSW 2.0 TDI 193K, Tuned with DPF and EGR Delete. 91 W124 300D Turbo replaced, Pressure W/G actuator installed. 210K 90 Dodge D250 5.9 Cummins/5 speed. 400K |
#12
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Here are some pics of the the difference from this thread. IWIS vs. Beck/Arnley - Pics And as rrgrassi stated, use the correct crimping tool to make sure you master link is secured properly. .
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1983 123.133 California - GreaseCar Veg System |
#13
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My car has had meticulous maintenance including oil changes. However, due to the mileage and no documented timing chain replacement I feel compelled to change it ASAP.
Anywhere I can get the kit with chain, rails and tensioner?
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'85 300SD (formerly california emissions) '08 Chevy Tahoe '93 Ducati 900 SS '79 Kawasaki KZ 650 '86 Kawasaki KX 250 '88 Kawasaki KDX200 '71 Hodaka Ace 100 '72 Triumph T100R |
#14
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IWIS is usually the best chain available in the US, Wippermann is another very high quality chain made in Germany but usually only available in Europe.
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#15
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You need to decide what parts you want to replaceand and order them. Even if I had decided to change the Chain I would want to know what the Chain stretch was before I started.
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84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel |
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