This is more of an opinion thing.

I have a car that I enjoy driving, don't really want to take it apart and not have it available (also use it for hauling "stuff" when I buy "stuff") for an indeterminate length of time. It is (mostly) stock but runs well.

However, with 200k on the car, and original head etc., I have the bug to install several upgrade parts that I have for the car (head, turbo, IP, timing chain and tensioner parts, oil pump and chain, windage tray, injectors, cam, mounts, etc., etc.) and gain a freshened engiine and likely about 50hp.

Tearing into the existing engine means that I might or might not finish it, ... ever?

So, I also have a nice OM603.960 on a stand, 247,000miles and perfect cylinder walls, that I could build. The car would of course no longer have the original block, and having the engine out gives me more time to never complete the process, which means that I'll likely also be buying seals, bearings, possibly rings and/or pistons, ... who knows what else escalating the cost for little or no reason and pushing completion further into oblivion. Then of course I need to do the swap, ... which could also delay completion.

So presuming that I will actually complete this project, which would you prefer: Pull the existing engine and upgrade it so that you have an original block still in the car (knowing that the '87 300TD is a fairly limited-production car, especially rust-free ones), ... or rebuild/upgrade the spare engine and stuff it in when ready?

Also for consideration is I could sell the spare engine and transmission to finance some/all of the parts in the upgrade, faster than selling the pulled engine when the project is finished (no longer an unlimited budget guy).

Oh, forgot to mention that the spare is also still mated to the spare transmission, ... might as well freshen that too in case there's any money left.

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Gone to the dark side

- Jeff

If I were you I'd do what you want to the separate engine and gear box, and if you run out of cash at least you'll still have an operational car.

This reminds me a little bit of moving into a house and then doing up the kitchen and the bathroom - it will be hell. In my opinion it is always better to do the kitchen and bathroom and THEN move in - if you see what I mean.

So I vote take your time with the conversions on the spare engine and gearbox

{Signature withheld - especially for you!}

Are you active on Superturbodiesel.com?

If I were in your shoes, I would rebuild the extra engine however much you wanted with however much time you need. A turbo isn't going to give you any more power unless your IP is putting out more fuel...the process of which is being developed by "DervTuning" from said forum. Otherwise you are stuck spending $2k+ from Myna.

I am trying to do the same things to mine but with 275-300HP as my goal:
http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/1987-300tdt-project-goal-275hp-daily-driver-pics-t-1603.html

After that, you will have a good engine on standby in case of "issues".

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1987 300TDT - 195,000 (Original #14 head)
1993 190E 2.3 - 105,000
1981 300D - 250,000

Good points on having the car while the project is underway.

The only reservation that I have is knowing the oil useage (none) of the current engine, vs not knowing on the spare as well. I know it can all be measured and new parts can be fitted, but I don't really want to spend the money if I don't need to.

I'd like to have 300hp jonbob.., but the turbo I have and the IP are probably going to limit me to 200, no smoking tires. I'm just after a little more punch without dependability issues or significant smoke. I already have the parts, have had the IP turned up a bit to allow a little more fuel to match the turbo, really need to design an aftercooler and plumbing so that I can use a bit more pressure and fuel.

__________________

Gone to the dark side

- Jeff

If you think the matching numbers will ever have relevance in the car's resale value (based on your impressions of the car) it may be worth the extra attention.

I wouldn't be re-sleeving it since you have a good one waiting, but maybe a few extended oil change intervals where you get the oil analyzed could tell you if the pistons and bores are worth holding onto. Couple this with a few compression tests and you could probably make a really good guess about whether its worth arranging to rebuild the matching block.

If you are just sentimental.... rebuild the good block you have waiting, and hold onto the matching block.

But I do think its an excellent point that rarely comes up around here. These cars are creeping towards that age where original parts could start to be big factors someday.

If you are planning to do these sorts of modifications surely you'd be stripping and measuring each part of whichever engine you choose to use? I personally don't see the point in building a fancy house on unknown foundations - sorry for yet another building analogy...

...good point about matching numbers though...

... matching numbers are important on corvettes, and cuda's. I can't imagine it would matter in a station wagon, but even if it does... you still have the original engine, and you could offer it WITH the car to the next buyer of your "limited production" rust free car.

Yup, especially with this model. I doubt very many people purchase an 87 300TD by happenstance. They are usually specifically sought after. When I got mine, a rust free example was get around 10k. I saw one go for 10k, and one for 11.5k and they had 220,000 miles and 280,000 miles respectively. At the time mine only had 155k and was in as good if not better condition!

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1987 300TDT - 195,000 (Original #14 head)
1993 190E 2.3 - 105,000
1981 300D - 250,000

anybody got 11.5K they wanna spend on my rust free full maintenance record TD?

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John HAUL AWAY, OR CRUSHED CARS!!! HELP ME keep the cars out of the crusher! A/C Thread
"as I ride with my a/c on... I have fond memories of sweaty oily saturdays and spewing R12 into the air. THANKS for all you do!

My drivers:
1987 190D 2.5Turbo
1987 190D 2.5Turbo
1987 190D 2.5-5SPEED!!!

1987 300TD
1987 300TD
1994GMC 2500 6.5Turbo truck... I had to put the ladder somewhere!

Don't Jest...I am being dead serious! Obviously they are no longer getting that much but at one time, this was the case!

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1987 300TDT - 195,000 (Original #14 head)
1993 190E 2.3 - 105,000
1981 300D - 250,000

I saw them going into the mid-teens on ebay, didn't buy one, ... the ones I usually see for sale are either a color I don't want, beat and neglected, or rust-belt cars. It was hard to find an original decent car (although it still needed a lot of freshening) and I hate to create something less desirable, ... but I'm starting to go the route of the "resto-rod" anyway. It already has non-factory dash and wood, sills, wheels, steering wheel, console, alternator, etc., etc. as I update/freshen it. I'm still planning on '94-up front brakes, body cladding, updated leather interior including door cards, and the engine mods. So I guess that I kind of made up my mind, just bouncing it across the forum to see if anyone cries foul, or if there's something that I haven't thought of, sounds like a lot of nothing to worry about.

So it's on, the spare engine goes to the machine shop for measurements and checks (stopped there this morning to schedule it in), the engine will start to go together and be re-sealed so that I can make the swap (hopefully over the Thanksgiving week). I think I'll sell the original engine after, I'm tired of storing spare parts. I haven't decides yet whether to mess with the transmission or leave it alone until it has problems.

Now I just have to hope for enough dry weather this winter that I can enjoy it for a while before putting it away (you lucky southerners!).

Thanks for the input, I guess that if I really want a "numbers matching" piece I'll look for another, ... they made more.

It's kind of funny to me, how much $$ it will cost for a mild power increase, as much as I had into the entire car, and it will still fall short of the M104 slightly. Worth it because it's diesel though, ... and I'm waiting for a turbo 606 for next time, ...

__________________

Gone to the dark side

- Jeff

I would be happy with 225hp from a 603. I already know what a high HP w124 feels like. I would rather stay lower on the HP and keep reliability and mpg's at a more comfortable level. 300+ hp om603 would be fun though.

I want a w124 wagon to replace my w123 wagon... I had a crazy thought yesterday when driving my 300d... Part of me wants a 603 and the 400e side of me wants a m103.. well I have a spare 5spd setup here... does anyone think a 5spd w124 wagon would be cool?

First off I still need to purge off some cars.. just sent the SD to Detroit to get it out of my hair for a while. Still leaves 3 cars laying around here.

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08 R320 CDI current

Past
95 E420
87 300D Turbo 5spd
90 300TE
83 300SD
85 300TD
92 400E
85 190D

An M104 wagon will do everything you want, gets mileage near the 300TD, but will leave your diesel soul feeling empty. BTDT sold all of my E320s in the past year.

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Gone to the dark side

- Jeff