Could I have done any serious damage? - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

haromaster87 · #1 10-04-2012, 02:02 PM

Hey guys,

So last week I replaced my valve cover gasket. During the installation, I hadn't noticed that one of the support post on the front right, that the bolt goes through, had cracked. These post prevent the valve cover from being tightened up so much that it pinches and cuts the gasket. Since mine had cracked, it was able to spread out around the spacer, and press much lower. This caused it to cut into the gasket. At first, it wasn't noticeable.

I had gone to a friends house, and took a drive to the fuels tation, on that drive, I noticed my oil pressure wasn't going any higher then a little over 2 bar. I immediately knew something was wrong. I carefully drove the car to the fuel station, and opened the hood to find that the valve cover gasket had indeed split on the front side of it. This of course was pouring oil.

I didn't have the option to tow at that point. I went in and got 2 quarts of oil, poured them in, and made the 15min drive home. I drove slowly and carefully. At first, the car was able to maintain 3 bar without issue, but as it lost oil, it was running more at 2.5 bar and would go up to 3 if I was careful. Then it was between 1.5 and 2. It never got below 1 bar, and only ever went below 1.5 for a few sec, usually at idle. I never let the engine get passed 2,500rpms, and really rarely exceeded 2,000rpms.

I got it home, and shut it down. It was a mess. I gave it a quick hose off, just to get a lot of the settled oil off of the engine.

The next day I got a new gasket, and pulled the valve cover. That's when I discovered the damaged post. I was able to set up a washer that prevented the valve cover from going lower then it should, but still allowed it to go as low as it did before. Even then, I lightly tightened the bolts, just to be safe. As of right now, I can tell the valve cover is not oil tight, but I have a new one on the way, so I'm just trying to avoid the same gasket situation until I receive the new one.

I've been really monitoring things under the hood since then, I changed the gasket out on Monday and drove it to work Tuesday, and Wednesday. The only thing I noticed was a few drips of oil on the ground, which I figure is from the valve cover not being really tight. My oil pressure has been great, engine has seemed strong, no new noises, all seemed well.

Today, I had to make an extended highway drive, which involved about 25-30min of steady 65mph, which was about a steady 3000rpms. I did that there and back, so about 50-60min total, with a break in the middle. The car ran fine, no issues. Even felt quite strong. I got to work and went to check things under the hood, and before I opened it, I noticed that the spots on the hood above the headlights had oil on them, which had streaked up the hood a bit. As if oil was trying to force its way out, and settled on that spot of the hood. It wasn't an excessive amount, but it was there. I checked the blow by real quick, it was there, but it didn't seem any more prominent then before.

Anyone got any ideas? I looked around and didn't notice an excessive amount of oil around any particular components or anything. Is there any components I could've damaged in the drive home with the low oil pressure that would be causing this now?

Thanks guys!

-Tony

Junkman · #2 10-04-2012, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haromaster87

Hey guys,

I immediately knew something was wrong. I carefully drove the car to the fuel station, and opened the hood to find that the valve cover gasket had indeed split on the front side of it. This of course was pouring oil.

I didn't have the option to tow at that point. I went in and got 2 quarts of oil, poured them in, and made the 15min drive home. I drove slowly and carefully.

It never got below 1 bar, and only ever went below 1.5 for a few sec, usually at idle. I never let the engine get passed 2,500rpms, and really rarely exceeded 2,000rpms.

As of right now, I can tell the valve cover is not oil tight, but I have a new one on the way, so I'm just trying to avoid the same gasket situation until I receive the new one.

I've been really monitoring things under the hood since then, I changed the gasket out on Monday and drove it to work Tuesday, and Wednesday. The only thing I noticed was a few drips of oil on the ground, which I figure is from the valve cover not being really tight. My oil pressure has been great, engine has seemed strong, no new noises, all seemed well.

Today, I had to make an extended highway drive, which involved about 25-30min of steady 65mph, which was about a steady 3000rpms. I did that there and back, so about 50-60min total, with a break in the middle. The car ran fine, no issues. Even felt quite strong. I got to work and went to check things under the hood, and before I opened it, I noticed that the spots on the hood above the headlights had oil on them, which had streaked up the hood a bit. As if oil was trying to force its way out, and settled on that spot of the hood. It wasn't an excessive amount, but it was there. I checked the blow by real quick, it was there, but it didn't seem any more prominent then before.

I Anyone got any ideas?looked around and didn't notice an excessive amount of oil around any particular components or anything. Is there any components I could've damaged in the drive home with the low oil pressure that would be causing this now?

Thanks guys!

-Tony

You always have a choice. What will you do if engine locks because you didn't turn it off? Next time, do that OR continue to run it which is what you CHOSE this time.

The preventive decision point is past. Whatever damage there is has been done. Finish the repair and drive it. Deal with any damage if/when it becomes apparent.

Diesel911 · #3 10-04-2012, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Junkman

You always have a choice. What will you do if engine locks because you didn't turn it off? Next time, do that OR continue to run it which is what you CHOSE this time.

The preventive decision point is past. Whatever damage there is has been done. Finish the repair and drive it. Deal with any damage if/when it becomes apparent.

And to add to that become a member of one of the Auto Clubs that has some free Towing so that you have a better choice.
Only time will tell if there was any damage done.

I am curious why knowing that it was gushing Oil you did not buy more quarts of Oil then you did so that you could pull over mid trip and add some more; decreasing you chances of damage?

haromaster87 · #4 10-04-2012, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Junkman

You always have a choice. What will you do if engine locks because you didn't turn it off? Next time, do that OR continue to run it which is what you CHOSE this time.

The preventive decision point is past. Whatever damage there is has been done. Finish the repair and drive it. Deal with any damage if/when it becomes apparent.

With all due respect, if I had wanted a lecture on what I should have done, I would have out right asked for one. I did what I did for my own reasons, that's honestly not what I was hear to discuss. I was hear to ask about what components I may have jeopardized, if any. In dealing with the previous cars I've owned before, I was usually told in a situation like that, as long as oil pressure doesn't go to naught, and your careful, you should be okay. It was a rather desparate situation. Thank you though for what I hope you perceived as useful input.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel911

And to add to that become a member of one of the Auto Clubs that has some free Towing so that you have a better choice.
Only time will tell if there was any damage done.

I am curious why knowing that it was gushing Oil you did not buy more quarts of Oil then you did so that you could pull over mid trip and add some more; decreasing you chances of damage?

I was rather frustrated and not thinking clearly. In retrospect, yeah, terrific idea. Again, I made sure to at least not use oil pressure. I was always under the impression that was enough. Maybe for this engine, I was wrong.

I'm sorry if my reply seems moody, it's just been one of those months where if there was a market for these cars right now, I'd sell it. I love it to death but it's trying my patience. So to receive two replies giving me a hard time about the obvious things I could have done to not be in this situation just didn't help much.

Skippy · #5 10-04-2012, 04:09 PM

If the pressure stayed over 1 bar the whole time, you probably didn't hurt the internals. What you're probably seeing is oil that spilled during the gusher phase and collected somewhere getting pushed around by moving air. You'll get it all cleaned up eventually, but it will probably take several rounds of washing and driving.

psaboic · #6 10-04-2012, 05:38 PM

+1 for Skippy. As long as it runs well, does not make any funky noises and as you said, the pressure never went below one bar above idle speed, I think you are ok. Just monitor for a bit until you are comfortable things are ok.

haromaster87 · #7 10-04-2012, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skippy

If the pressure stayed over 1 bar the whole time, you probably didn't hurt the internals. What you're probably seeing is oil that spilled during the gusher phase and collected somewhere getting pushed around by moving air. You'll get it all cleaned up eventually, but it will probably take several rounds of washing and driving.

Quote:

Originally Posted by psaboic

+1 for Skippy. As long as it runs well, does not make any funky noises and as you said, the pressure never went below one bar above idle speed, I think you are ok. Just monitor for a bit until you are comfortable things are ok.

Thanks guys. That's what I had suspected, but I wanted to clarify. I figured if I had messed something up, it would've made itself apparent during the drive. Thanks again!

Junkman · #8 10-04-2012, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haromaster87

With all due respect, if I had wanted a lecture on what I should have done, I would have out right asked for one. I did what I did for my own reasons, that's honestly not what I was hear to discuss. I was hear to ask about what components I may have jeopardized, if any. In dealing with the previous cars I've owned before, I was usually told in a situation like that, as long as oil pressure doesn't go to naught, and your careful, you should be okay. It was a rather desparate situation. Thank you though for what I hope you perceived as useful input.

I was rather frustrated and not thinking clearly. In retrospect, yeah, terrific idea. Again, I made sure to at least not use oil pressure. I was always under the impression that was enough. Maybe for this engine, I was wrong.

I'm sorry if my reply seems moody, it's just been one of those months where if there was a market for these cars right now, I'd sell it. I love it to death but it's trying my patience. So to receive two replies giving me a hard time about the obvious things I could have done to not be in this situation just didn't help much.

I was responding as much to your tone as anything. Obviously, you wanted reassurance that you didn't damage anything by knowingly driving it when lubrication was in doubt disregarding the car's warning system.

Unfortunately, we (forum members and you) don't know exactly what took place, how low oil pressure was, prior wear, measured current wear etc. It is also unlikely that we have documented measurement on the minimum oil pressure that will keep the engine healthy for a given time.

Individual engine components don't matter because IF the damage is significant, it will be less expensive to simply replace the engine with a good used one rather than change wear components like bearings. Should you decide to consider rebuild for whatever reason, you will need to take measurements at that point.

It always amazes me when people say things like "I didn't have a choice" when they explicitly made a potentially damaging choice in exchange for convenience in this case, convenience of not towing or repairing.

Or "this inanimate object is making me mad" or"it's trying my patience" as if the engine/car can try anything. Ask it to try and drive to my house. I'll fix it if it gets here (or is it hear?). Or perhaps if i hear it try to drive here, I'll fix it.

haromaster87 · #9 10-05-2012, 05:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Junkman

I was responding as much to your tone as anything. Obviously, you wanted reassurance that you didn't damage anything by knowingly driving it when lubrication was in doubt disregarding the car's warning system.

Unfortunately, we (forum members and you) don't know exactly what took place, how low oil pressure was, prior wear, measured current wear etc. It is also unlikely that we have documented measurement on the minimum oil pressure that will keep the engine healthy for a given time.

Individual engine components don't matter because IF the damage is significant, it will be less expensive to simply replace the engine with a good used one rather than change wear components like bearings. Should you decide to consider rebuild for whatever reason, you will need to take measurements at that point.

It always amazes me when people say things like "I didn't have a choice" when they explicitly made a potentially damaging choice in exchange for convenience in this case, convenience of not towing or repairing.

Or "this inanimate object is making me mad" or"it's trying my patience" as if the engine/car can try anything. Ask it to try and drive to my house. I'll fix it if it gets here (or is it hear?). Or perhaps if i hear it try to drive here, I'll fix it.

Ok.

layback40 · #10 10-05-2012, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haromaster87

Ok.

Probably worth realizing that Junkman & Diesel911 are 2 of the more competent & experienced members on this forum.
They have probably both dealt with more incidents like yours than you have had birthdays !
If you feel that their comments make you feel like your decision to keep driving may have been foolhardy then that is probably a good thing.

Those of us with some experience around MB diesels know, if you see the oil pressure drop during normal operation, put the car in neutral, turn it off (dont turn the key that far as to lock the steering) & pull over. Investigate the problem before proceeding further or starting the car. Thats what they have emergency stopping lanes for.
To just drive a few miles further to your brothers home is not the right decision unless you wish to make a bad situation worse.

t walgamuth · #11 10-05-2012, 09:32 AM

I'll respond to the op. yes, good possibility of damage.

And a general comment. I would not drive any vehicle with wavering or low oil pressure unless personal safety was such an issue that losing the engine bearings was worth risking over it.;

vstech · #12 10-05-2012, 09:53 AM

in today's world MOST drivers on the road look at gauges and lights as a warning to bring up at the next scheduled maintenance or when the mechanic gets called for an appointment.

the fact that the OP is asking the question shows that he is wondering if that was wise, and if a mechanic's opinion could be fair if they recommend major repairs.
many of us fail to realize that everybody isn't aware of every single feature and frailty of a vehicle.

psaboic · #13 10-05-2012, 12:26 PM

Well said vstech!

Diesel911 · #14 10-05-2012, 02:56 PM

For Myself If I had decided to drive the Car in the condition described I would have done so expecting the Engine to be damaged.
It does sound like the haromaster87 got away with it.

I had an issue on a Gasser where I had tried to re-solder a seam on a Radiator.

I was in the 2nd lane on a 4 lane Freeway in somewhat heavy traffic when I suddenly overheated (the seam on the Radiator had opened).
I was not going to stop the Car dead in the Middle of the Freeway even though I knew I was not going to be able to get off of the Freeway fast enough to avoid serious damage; I actually managed to get off of the Freeway before the Engine started knocking.

I had plenty of Oil but overheated Oil does not lubricate well.
When I took the Engine apart there were melted Rod and Main Bearings and Cylinder scouring.

Part of the reason for some of the critical comments is that other people read these threads.
The critical comments might give some people some prior though on what to do in these sort of situations.

haromaster87 · #15 10-05-2012, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel911

For Myself If I had decided to drive the Car in the condition described I would have done so expecting the Engine to be damaged.
It does sound like the haromaster87 got away with it.

I had an issue on a Gasser where I had tried to re-solder a seam on a Radiator.

I was in the 2nd lane on a 4 lane Freeway in somewhat heavy traffic when I suddenly overheated (the seam on the Radiator had opened).
I was not going to stop the Car dead in the Middle of the Freeway even though I knew I was not going to be able to get off of the Freeway fast enough to avoid serious damage; I actually managed to get off of the Freeway before the Engine started knocking.

I had plenty of Oil but overheated Oil does not lubricate well.
When I took the Engine apart there were melted Rod and Main Bearings and Cylinder scouring.

Part of the reason for some of the critical comments is that other people read these threads.
The critical comments might give some people some prior though on what to do in these sort of situations.

I see now. I apologize for my attitude earlier. I think lately I've just been burned out on owning an old car. I know that by there nature, it's always something. Now I know how crucial things are. I honestly believed that as long as there was some oil pressure, it wouldn't cause harm. I did what I did under that beleif. Now that I realize it's not exactly as cut and dry as that, I will keep that in mind in the event I ever have a similar situation.

At this point, after really looking/listening, I think I may have gotten lucky and not damaged anything. As I said, the engine has been running terrific since I repaired the gasket. I gave it a really good check over yesterday, no new noises, starts/revs just as well as before, the blow by is deifintelly the same. However, now I realized that my result was a lucky one and I know not to try that again. Again, I really beleived that as long as there was oil pressure, I was okay. Life is made up of lessons. Thanks to everyone for their input in this thread. Even if i may not have been happy with your attitude, I realize people were just trying to help me see what I had done wrong.