New accessory available
 

http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k1...DSCF0007-2.jpg

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/356684-f-s-accessory-c-compressor-clutch-condenser-fan-run-together.html#post3350203

I purchase a 1982 300tdt with the 617 engine from MTUpower that has this kit installed. The belt tensioner has come off, and the bolt that holds it on has come a bit loose. I tried to reinstall the tensioner, but there isn't enough room to get a spanner on the bolt because of its proximity to the oil cooler hard lines only

Any help on getting this tensioner back on would be appreciated.

P M with photos please....Rich

I have a definite answer for you on the lock nut. last week, I noticed that the belt for the compressor was squealing more than I have ever heard before. I had to shut off the A/C and pull over to inspect it. I noticed the nut was missing and the bolt had backed out. Upon further inspection, I noticed the last inch of the bolt was missing as well. I'm going to say that I bet it is still in the nut...

I went to the local depot and picked up a 1/2" x 8" #8 bolt and two nuts. I got home, chopped off 1" of the bolt, beveled the end at 45 degrees and hammered it through the bracket's bolt holes. I had to loosen the bracket a little to drive the new bolt through. I applied plenty of locktite and double nutted the bolt. I need to check if the nuts are still on the bolt, though - I have not popped the hood in a week.

Maybe a cause of the broken bolt but the supplemental mounting bracket on the upper oil pan is cracked at the 90 bend. It's not doing anything right now.

Once vibration starts, the engine will try to loose anything and everything bolted to it. If any one bolt got loose, it starts a chain reaction and does not stop until the entire compressor and bracket is dragging on the ground. It is very important to periodically inspect and tighten the fasteners on this system. I hate to say it, but if you had to pound in the 1/2" bolt, it will never come out if it breaks again. If you can source another factory (12mm X ?) bolt and all metal lock nut, that would be best. If the plate brace is broken at the bend, I suggest you either get it welded SOON, or remove the belt until you get a replacement. The brace has to be there, and be intact or the same thing will happen again (or worse). The best way to remove the belt (actually relocating it intact) is to rout it around the crank pulley and up to and around the PS pump. You can just zip tie it so it does not rub on anything. When you are ready to use the belt again, just cut the ties and rout the belt back down around the crank pulley and on the compressor.....Rich

I didn't have to hit the bolt very hard to get it in the bracket. It was more along the lines of getting past the misalignment of the bracket and engine because the bolt was not there to keep the two aligned. Once I loosened the bracket, the bolt slid through pretty easily.

I will look into repairing the supporting bracket. I have a co-worker/buddy who does welding on the side. Maybe he can fix it up for me.

Between this thread and the spring special thread, there have been so many posts I'm not confident I understand what the entire kit consists of and what the upgrades have been. Could you possibly put together a new post which describes the whole thing and explains what, if anything, else is needed to convert to the Sanden compressor with the barrier hose setup?

Sorry to be thick, I was hit in the head with an ax at an early age. And I don't mean a guitar.

As far as hoses, my hose kit comes with the 2 hoses connected to the compressor. The only hoses remaining are the 2 that run into the cabin. I have a replacement hose for the low side (larger diameter), and the high side (small blue hose) is made of a completely different material that normally does not need replacing. I will eventually have complete installation instructions published both here and in printed form with each kit. The instructions for modifying the low side hard pipe are here somewhere, but I would have to look for them. PM me for any specific details needed. Thanks, Rich

Installation tips and plate update:
 

I had a couple customers mention that the belt alignment was not quite right on their installation. I recently installed a kit on a friends car, and the misalignment was very noticeable. I have done several perviously without any alignment problems. I decided to make a change to the remaining 11 plates I have in stock, and will change the new batch of plates I have made, moving the compressor forward by 1/4". I added a 1/4" spacer on the 2 compressor mounting tabs, and the adjustment bar tab. I also included longer bolts in the hardware bag. Doing this has made a change to how the bolts are oriented. This photo shows the orientation (pay no attention to the belt being in the wrong groove of the pulley :D):
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k1...7/DSCF0013.jpg
Before, I had the nuts inboard of the compressor ears (facing each other), but now they need to be on the outboard side. The adjustment bar bolt also needs to have the nut on the left side.

Installation tips:
At first, I installed the plate and then mounted the compressor on the plate. I find that now to be the hard way. I now mount the compressor on the plate on the workbench, and then install the plate and compressor as a unit:
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k1...DSCF0008-2.jpg
Tighten the 2 bolts snug enough so that it takes a bar to rotate the compressor. No further tightening should be required. Start with the compressor as close to the plate as possible for easiest belt installation. Be sure to insert the plate mounting bolt in it's hole before mounting the compressor. It is very difficult to get it in afterward. Also, insert the plate brace bolt in the hole before mounting the compressor as well (unlike the photo that shows an empty hole :(). It is best to install the oil cooler line bracket before mounting the compressor/plate:
http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k1...DSCF0011-2.jpg
Another tip: When building the adjustment system, it is best to insert but not fully tighten the bolts so it is easier to install the adjustment bolt sleeve. I used to tighten the "banana" bracket bolts, and then have a hard time getting the adjustment bar and sleeves in between the brackets. Having the banana brackets loose makes it easier to install the rest of the system. Once all the parts are in place, all the bolts can be tightened.....Rich

Aside from the broken bolt and bracket issue I had, I must add that the power lead to the compressor clutch has broken internally. If I bump it or move it, the clutch engages. It seems to stop working randomly and needs to be touched to kick on again. I have determined the break is at or near the wire fastener; leaving little to no room to attach a new wire. Currently, my A/C is inoperable because the clutch does not engage.

Latest revision to the plate
 

The latest revision to the plate makes it a little different than the last batch (Gen 2.0), and I am calling this revision the Gen 2.2. The identifier is that it is painted silver instead of black (the next 50 kits will have the silver plate). There is only a slight difference than the previous units, and may not be noticeable to most people. The belt alignment problem was solved (moved the compressor mounting tabs 1/4 forward), and the adjustment bolt is further away from the adjustment bar for easier turning of the bolt (a socket will fit without rubbing on the bar). Also the adjustment bar tab is the full 1/2" instead of two 1/4" pieces welded together. I just thought I would let everyone know so you are not surprised when you get a silver plate instead of black!.....Rich

http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k1...DSCF0001-7.jpg

I wish I had v2.2. The issue with the adjuster bolt is a little annoying but it's not like I have to deal with it daily. Glad you fixed the issue.

Nice kit!
 

I dig the continuous improvement of this product. I installed Rollguy's Gen 2.0 kit a couple of months ago on my 240D and it turned out well. Fitting the bracket with the new compressor was a breeze, and Rich quickly answered the few questions I had about the installation.

I wound up using a 15360 size belt and could probably go the next size smaller for my application, though I have not had any issues with slippage. The hardest part for me was learning how to properly braze the fitting on the low side line.

Thank you. I believe that there is nothing more needed in the design, so this may be the last revision. I have 49 kits to get through before thinking about changing anything (adding maybe, changing- NO). Yes the 616 takes a different size belt, and until now I did not know what size to use. I normally send the 15375 with the kit, as 99% of the kits I sell are for the turbo. I may order some belts for the 616 once I know the exact size needed......Rich

I have installed several of the 2.0 kits, and a open end wrench works just fine to turn the bolt. I decided to make the change on this batch because it was fairly easy to do. However, all these changes mean the bolts have to be oriented differently (5 posts ago).

Rich, spring is right around the corner. Any early bird specials this year?

Not really. There has not been a price increase on the bracket kit since the Gen 2 came out (a couple years ago), and everything costs more now. I am going to raise the price on July first to $200. for the kit, so I guess that will be my Spring Special= Orders received before July first get the bracket kit for $180. I am also basically out of compressors, so I will not be able to offer them unless I can get another source.....Rich

Rich,

Summer's heat is not too far away here in Texas. I would like to connect with you about buying a kit. What is the best way?

Michael

Mounting kit for sale
 

..

Possible plate problem
 

In welding the last batch of plates, I noticed that a shim was missing on my fixture for the compressor mount tabs. If you are attaching the compressor to the plate before mounting it as a unit on the engine, please verify that there is no space between the compressor alloy ear and the steel mounting tab. You might have gotten a plate that was made without the shim in place, thereby making a space that shouldn't be there. If left that way, tightening the bolts will break the compressor ear. Please check this before using the compressor. It is fairly easy to fix by using two adjustable wrenches on the tabs to bend them slightly apart. There is a tolerance in the Sanden manual (link in my installation guide page 9 "mounting ear deflection"), but is not that much. Sorry that this might have happened to yours, but I want to make sure before it is used and it break an ear off the compressor. I think there is no more than 3 out there that have been sold recently that may be affected. Please let me know. Thanks, Rich

I have not heard from anyone who made a recent order, other than the one I contacted personally. It seems that the one plate I checked and installed was the only one affected. My fixture has been repaired (no shim needed now), and all is good. I am ready for the barrage of orders :D.....Rich

Is there a thread detailing the flexible oil cooler line mod? I would like to run flex lines back to the filter housing. Thanks.

iI you start reading my build thread at about post #180 you will find how I modified my cooler, cooler lines and fabbed the lines themselves.

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/308791-380sl-diesel-conversion-project.html

Rollguy,
Have you considered putting a spring loaded idler wheel in the design to eliminate any problem with belts stretching ? It would also allow more degrees of contact wherever it is needed... to provide the friction needed without the need for excessive tension on the belt/s which I assume is the reason for the stretching problem....

The original design had an adjustable idler pulley, but turned out to be problematic. Also, I have never seen a spring loaded V-belt idler pulley, so I doubt that design would be cost effective. The current design seems to work great, with the exception of having to adjust the belt a couple times. I could provide a top quality belt, but that would increase the price. If the end user wants to put a more quality belt on, then they are free to do so....Rich

People want a turn key dependable unit.... you are SO close.... you have not really checked on the cost of these items ?... I don't understand .... have you given up on the dream ?

There are MANY dependable units out there already, and I don't want to reinvent the wheel. I have enough parts to make 40 more kits, so I see no reason to redesign anything until all (or most) of the kits are sold....Rich

Price increase
 

I thought I posted the price increase that was effective July first 2015, but it seems I did not. It was talked about in post 117. The currant prices are: $200 for the bracket kit, $200 for a 7 cyl Sanden, $180 for a 5 cyl, $100 for the hose kit, $20 for the drier, $25 for the relay kit, and $45 for the shipping/Handling/Insurance on a complete kit.

There is the problem... elude means to avoid or escape...
you meant to Allude to the price increase....

Rich,
I complement you on being one of the most responsive and attentive manufacturers out there. Most who deal with the public rely on phone spoolers and such to frustrate customers who have questions.

My Gen 2.0 Sanden bracket is still working fine. I used a shorter H13 Sanden so had to add spacers anyway. All Sandens have the front bracket and pulley in the same place, so any adjustments are at the rear mount. The only bracket problems I had were from the later bracket2 that bolts to the upper oil pan. One mounting bolt was too long and knocked my crank indicator pin off (not used in my 1985 anyway). Bracket2 didn't reach the main bracket so I had to add washer spacers, but hard because the surfaces weren't exactly parallel. I kept finding the bolt & washers missing. I think I finally secured it by using a self-jamming nut plus a backup nut (my son has car).

My hoses caused some problems. I had to bend the factory hoses to fit my Sanden (w/ GM Pad head). I did this w/ hoses on car and had to use a big pipe wrench, working under the car on ramps. I later got a refrigerant leak right in the middle of the factory HP tube at the compressor. You couldn't even see the hole, but my pipe had nicked the tube too much. Fortunately, I had a spare set of AC fittings and hose material, so fixed it quick. Bending the tubes on the bench was much easier and I used round bars to not nick them. So I suggest anyone just rebuild your hoses and bend the tubes as needed then. I ran the HP hose straight over to the condenser, bending the factory fitting there to angle correctly. I like that much better than the run up the side of the engine that the factory used. My 1984's fitting was easier to angle down than my 1985 CA.

Thanks, I fixed it.

Rollguy,
Could you PM me?
I'd like to order one of your kits, but I need some details first.
Thanks,
Rotorbudd

Hey Rich, are you still requiring cash? I am still bothered from loosing the $300 in the mail is why asking; don't have family out there so not an option. However, the R4 clutch is not engaging without jumping 5 and 7, plus pressing and once engaged with engine running, made a HORRIFIC noise. I much rather buy from an individual, especially a Peach member. :beerchug:

Have a good day! :D

I found my Sanden bracket cracked, after ~3 years. I had wondered where a rattling sound was coming from, just off idle, and finally found it got much quieter when I turned the AC compressor off. I had wondered why I had to turn the adjuster bolt all the way in, indeed had to move the lock nut to the other side and still got the belt barely tight.

As best I can tell, the crack runs all the way across, under the top tube. I can see the 2 parts of the bracket move as I push on the belt. Sorry for the poorly focused photo. I'll try to get the camera to focus correctly next time I have it up on ramps. Since summer is ending, I removed the belt for now to avoid any catastrophe. I'll remove the bracket when I have my spare vehicle running, and finish other priorities, maybe before next Spring.

One exacerbating condition is that originally I didn't have the extra support bracket to the upper oil pan that Rollguy later added. That was to stop shaking, which could cause such fatigue cracks. Even when I added it, there was a large un-parallel gap and I kept finding the washers & bolt I installed gone, and don't know how long since my son had the car out of town some years. I finally got some jam nuts that held. Thus, no telling how long the main bracket might have been shaking too much.

In my experience, bracket cracks are common. Indeed, it is hard to design one for infinite fatigue life. Since steel, I should be able to effect a weld repair, and beef up that area. Others should watch this are on their bracket and report, so Rollguy can make any needed design changes for the next customers.

I'm finally getting around to an install on a kit I bought two years ago. Did you all run the low side hose between the compressor and condenser under the engine? Where does the schrader valve end up?
Thanks!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks for sharing your experience, it does help to make a better product. Although I have had to replace a couple brackets from the original batch, I believe they all broke because of loose fasteners. If one fastener is loose, it allows the bracket to vibrate and crack. There is a lot of leverage on the compressor pulley, and it takes a solidly mounted compressor to keep parts from breaking. The newest batch of brackets seem to be working just fine. They are painted silver instead of black. Another thing that has helped keep everything together is the all metal lock nuts. The nylon lock nuts that came with the first batch of kits proved to be problematic. I have gotten complaints that the all metal lock nuts are hard to tighten on the bolts, but I have to stress how important they are because of the constant vibration these engines produce. Even though the latest batch of plates seem to be holding up pretty good, I have thought of welding a piece of angle iron on the back side of the plate across the area that has the tendency to break. I also have plans to make the next batch of plates out of 3/8 material instead of 5/16 (I still have a bunch left, so it may be a while). My desire is to continually improve this product. Things like this only help to do so, and I desire continue to provide quality products to this small part of the automotive world.......Rich

Disqo, It is the high-pressure hose that departs the compressor underneath and runs to the condenser, following a convoluted path up the passenger side of the engine, then down to the condenser. As many, I re-routed mine straight across in both my 1985 (Sanden) and 1984 (R4). I secured the new hose in the middle w/ screw clamp to bottom of radiator support (thru existing slot) w/ larger hose piece between to avoid cutting into it. I didn't bother installing a HP port, since I figured I would someday re-plumb w/ a modern condenser, plus I fill refrigerant more based on volume (3 cans) and judge more by the low-side pressure. I did install a tiny PRV in the Sanden to vent if >290 psig (?). Technically illegal to vent any refrigerant per EPA's often bizarre thinking, but I use hydrocarbon which isn't an environmental concern (I sleep well).

Yes, I recall reports of early users finding the nylon lock nuts on the two lower pivot ears had unscrewed. Reading that, I used metal lock nuts from Ace, I recall on the initial install (don't recall ever removing compressor). I also substituted an allen bolt on one since those pivot bolts proved challenging to get a wrench on. I always loosened, then retightened the pivot bolts when adjusting belt tension. No way to know when the crack started, and once started they almost always slowly grow. The belt seeming too loose started ~1 yr ago, so it was probably mostly cracked thru by then.

The block mounting points make a bracket design challenging, since the belt force is cantilevered way out (think of a person on a diving board). Max force probably acts on that upper, front bracket tube where mine cracked. That is why M-B had to make the R4 aluminum bracket so large w/ big webs. I agree w/ welding an L or U angle on the backside to add "webbing", and is what I will try. In engineering, you want a large "moment of intertia" for the cross-section (about the bending axis), which is why I-beams have their shape. Of course, making the plate thicker is one way, but at the cost of much more weight. Anyway, should be an easy repair once I get around to it. This isn't like the cracks in the new Oakland Bay Bridge (NorCal people know that story). It is in the 80's this week and next here, so I'm not suffering.

I couldn't wait until Spring to remove the Sanden bracket since shaking too much at idle. Turns out it was worse than I thought, w/ multiple cracks, as shown, plus the bracket to the upper oil pump broken in two. Had I left as is, the compressor might have totally fallen off and caused damage. I had removed the AC belt, but that wasn't enough. Notice that one crack went thru the large hole I drilled to save weight. That hole might have precipitated the failure, so others may have different experiences. I assumed that region would have no effect since the lower right region is just unsupported hanging weight. As most know, a crack anywhere can escalate to cause more failures, like ripping a phone book in two by staggering the pages to fail one at a time.

I decided it would be too hard to repair the bracket, w/ high risk it wouldn't fit since I don't have a fixture to keep the parts aligned while welding.

I decided to return to the R-4 compressor for several reasons - have a new one on the shelf, factory bracket is a proven design, easy bolt-up since I kept the factory "GM Pad" hose, but will lose refrigerant, R-4 works fine in my 1984, can use the Sanden on one of my 60's Mopar's. Indeed, I may be able to cut the Rollguy bracket and re-use on one of the those cars via their York bracket.

Finally about to charge my system. Anyone have any thoughts on how much freon with the conversion and a parallel flow condenser? Thanks!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

In my 300D's, I start w/ 2 cans, which are 16 oz ea for R12 or 6 oz for the Duracool I use. I usually end up adding a 3rd can to get the pressures right. Whether R4 or Sanden shouldn't matter since no liquid refrigerant is in the compressor.

Have you made any 3/8" mounting plates yet?

They are 5/16 now, and I have about 25 left. When those run out, I will tool up for 3/8.

Rollguy, I tried sending you a PM but it does not show up in my sent folder. so I thought I would just ask here. Feel free to email me an answer to von@vonsmog.com if you like.

I am interested in your Sanden compressor mounting kit, and have a few questions. What is the price and can I use paypal to pay. Hate sending cash in the mail. Also I see there has been some cracking issues with some of them, is there any kind of warranty with the kit?
Thanks, Von

RG is in Europe right now. He does not do paypal.

any idea when he will be back? Would like to get my AC up and running soon for a cross country road trip coming up.

Reading thru his thread he has been posting for the last week or so it sounds like he is headed home today.

Yes sir, just left the airport headed home. I may be sleeping for the next few days, this traveling takes a lot out of me......Rich

Sent you a pm rollguy regarding my situation with my W116.

For everyone that has installed the Sanden compressor with the stock condenser what did you find was the optimum refrigerant charge?