Looked at an '82 240D today - Engine issue - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Austin85 · #1 04-26-2013, 05:44 PM

Looked at an '82 240D today. Nice interior , good AC . Body has like 240K on it and had an engine replaced in like 2004. I do not know yet how many miles are on this engine but I have to assume it is at least the same....

Car is at owner's mechanic ( an Indy MB Master tech who has owned diesels and seems to know his old diesels .) The car starts & runs . Mechanic says it needs a new engine because he thinks the head is warped and doesn't have the compression it should ( I think ) . He tells me the 4 cyl 240D's had weaker engines that were not as durable as the 5 cyl from 300Ds. he has not removed the head and the gasket is fine.

I like the 240D enough to buy it but looking for any forum input on the '82 240D engine & any issues ...with what may be causing lack of (all 68hp) compression ..Thanks.

....

47dodge · #2 04-26-2013, 06:09 PM

weaker? Yes less power but still very durable. 300,000 -400,000+ miles seems typical.

Head gasket as well as warped head all would allow coolant to leak into the cylinders, so there would be noticable coolant loss. Also white smoke on start up if really bad. I do not think this is the problem. Even if the head really is warped then it just needs to be milled not replaced let alone replacing the engine. sounds like the guy has no clue.

Compression, how much does it really have? Was it checked through the injector holes, or the glow plugs, did he actually check it or just guess it is low? Post numbers if you can.

Left Coast · #3 04-26-2013, 06:31 PM

Has anyone vouched for this indy's honesty? A dealer's service writer once told me that I needed a ring job on a '71 Valiant that was worth maybe $400 at the time. I declined. I never even bothered to do a compression test. Sold the car 40K later to a guy who drove it for another 85K, and his widow sold the car to someone else.

My dealer was just looking to rip me off. Your guy probably wants to pick the car up cheap.

Stevo · #4 04-26-2013, 06:43 PM

I would be suspect of anyone that said a 616 (240D engine) was "weaker" than the 5 cylinder engine. That just doesn't fit. Needing a valve adjustment could be the cause of low compression, hard to tell without a leak down test. How does he know the gasket is fine if he has not removed the head? Its pretty hard to warp one of those heads, it can be done but its not a common problem, they are pretty tough. If the car is nice the engine is the easiest thing to fix or swap as opposed to trying to fix a rusty body or a trashed interior. That is if you can get the car cheap and do the work yourself that would be a good way to wind up with a nice car. If its an automatic that would be a deal breaker for me however.

TheDon · #5 04-26-2013, 06:45 PM

If the valves were never adjusted they could have gotten burned and then they would not seal properly and then you get lower compression.

Plus you have to try very hard to warp the iron head.

ruchase · #6 04-26-2013, 06:50 PM

I think if I'm understanding the OP correctly, he looked at the car which was at the owner's mechanic. If that's the case, I don't see what the concern is - it seems like the mechanic is being forthcoming with what he suspects to be the issues on the engine.

If you're seriously considering it and can get it cheap, you might consider doing a valve adjustment and a compression check to see if it helps at all. Have you driven it around? I'm guessing if the head is seriously wrapped, then it would exhibit classic head gasket signs.

littlehandegan · #7 04-26-2013, 07:29 PM

Well I will say this.

If that gentlemen has gone through 2 engines in 240,000 miles. I would hate to know what else has been neglected on the vehicle

Austin85 · #8 04-26-2013, 07:53 PM

Nah The vehicle is nice. There is some rust - but not terrible. Jack holes & some under the fender corner which I can do POR 15 etc myself .

Yes this is the owner's mechanic and a nice enough guy too. I do not think he neglected it at all. The interior is excellent less a few minor dash cracks.
Seats solid and firm!

There is no coolant in the engine or visa versa and
I did drive it just a block or two and there is no white smoke.

I never heard of the 240 4 cyl engines being less durable than the 5 cyl 300D engines ..that seems not to be the case by much.

Sounds like a compression test for those #s and maybe a valve job would be in order... ( It is an automatic but for the price I can live with that. )

Will try to post a pic tonite .

A

junqueyardjim · #9 04-26-2013, 08:16 PM

Well there are two primary causes for no engine compression. First of all, this engine has some compression or you couldn't have driven it. Seems to me the indy is saying, looks like very poor compression on one or two cylinders. It could have blown a hose in the past year and was seriously over heated. That will wreck, pistons, rings, cylinder walls and in short order will ruin the engine, yet not blow a head gasket. They put on a new hose, the evidence is gone and you are scratching your head. So, no or low compression. Either it is leaking out from a blown head gasket or the cylinders are worn out or in some way ruined and can't pump the compression up. Don't be in a big hurry to buy it. If you can't buy it for $500.00 if it has an automatic, pass on it. If it has a four speed, with the rust you see, (and there will be more) go $750.00 tops. If you don't buy it, that car will be there next year.

Austin85 · #10 04-26-2013, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by junqueyardjim

Well there are two primary causes for no engine compression. First of all, this engine has some compression or you couldn't have driven it. Seems to me the indy is saying, looks like very poor compression on one or two cylinders. It could have blown a hose in the past year and was seriously over heated. That will wreck, pistons, rings, cylinder walls and in short order will ruin the engine, yet not blow a head gasket. They put on a new hose, the evidence is gone and you are scratching your head. So, no or low compression. Either it is leaking out from a blown head gasket or the cylinders are worn out or in some way ruined and can't pump the compression up. Don't be in a big hurry to buy it. If you can't buy it for $500.00 if it has an automatic, pass on it. If it has a four speed, with the rust you see, (and there will be more) go $750.00 tops. If you don't buy it, that car will be there next year.

Hi Jim,

I was thinking $500. too. He was originally looking for $1,500. but is now at $1,000. Yes it has compression. It did drive and stayed running at a steady idle for a good 15 minutes or so. It was slow but since this is my first time behind a 240 ( VS 300's ) I just don't know if this is normal "slow" or not.

I don't see it going anywhere fast since it is advertised by him and his mechanic as needing a new engine. They purchased it up in MASS from a Mercedes dealer back in '87 and it was garaged up there in the winters until they brought it down to Florida in like '04 for the wife to drive to the mall , etc..... He has a set of good records in the glove box of what was done so I think he did keep things maintained by a good MB tech. This adds to why I can't figure out what caused what may ( or may not) be wrong .

....AA

Junkman · #11 04-26-2013, 11:18 PM

I would offer $500 and be ready to spend another $1,000 on parts. Someone here will have an engine or you can find one for a few hundred. You have a car & don't need this one to run immediately. It should be worth $300 as scrap. Go for it - but don't over pay.

Zacharias · #12 04-26-2013, 11:43 PM

I have to take the side of the mechanic in what he said, though I suspect he didn't put it quite as I might.

What he may mean is that he has seen more 240Ds with motor problems, than five-cylinders. That has been my experience in shopping, and I think it's due to owners who beat relentlessly on the OM616 trying to get the get up and go of five pots out of four.

I have seen numerous 240Ds with the motors trashed well before 300k. Blanket statements that they typically last that long are no more accurate than saying all diesels get 50 mpg. It all depends on maintenance, driving patterns and driving style.

Question to OP: What was the oil pressure showing? If it had decent oil pressure, I would go for it.

As to the 240D 'slow' -- when you drive it, it should feel like it has pickup, albeit very leisurely pickup. If you are hitting the go pedal and it more or less just continues on its way, then you have an issue (though you should never conclude it's a compression issue until the throttle linkage adjustment has been checked).

funola · #13 04-27-2013, 08:15 AM

Time it. I had a 240D 5 speed that would do 0 to 60 in 17 seconds. a good running automatic I guess somewhere between 20 to 22 seconds.

aieeegrunt · #14 04-27-2013, 08:27 AM

how hard is it to put the 5 cylinder engine from a 300D into a 240D?

t walgamuth · #15 04-27-2013, 09:13 AM

Its some work but I would never do it to a car with a good 240 motor.

Just a comment to the OP, I am surprised the mechanic let you drive the car around with no coolant in it. First thing I'd do is fill it and run it and see what happens then report back here.

Head or head gasket problems are rare in a 616 or 617 motor. Maybe they ran it without coolant.