Garret Turbo Rebuild on 617..need help - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

bsdguy · #1 01-11-2014, 03:19 PM

Hello All,

I rebuilt my Garret turbo on my 617 (1985 300D). It needed it. All went well. I gave the car a test ride and I am now getting oil leaking out between the turbine housing and the center section. The leak happened after I started to drive the car. When I first let the car idle everything looked fine.

I have been thinking through this problem and remember that I had to let the engine run about 20 minutes to warm up the turbo so it would be easier to ge the bolts out. When metal is heated it expands.

So I was thinking I need to warm up to turbo and tighten those bolts. I can post pics if needed.

Thanks in advance for all of your help.

bsdguy,

whunter · #2 01-11-2014, 06:42 PM

It sounds like the shaft seals may be leaking..

turbocharger leaking oil
https://www.google.com/search?q=turbocharger+leaking+oil&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US

fficial&client=firefox-a

How did you balance the impellers ??
https://www.google.com/search?q=turbocharger+balance&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US

fficial&client=firefox-a

If they where not balanced, the oscillation will ruin your new bearings / seals.
https://www.google.com/search?q=turbocharger+balance&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US

fficial&client=firefox-a

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mikeyfev1 · #3 01-11-2014, 08:40 PM

I didn't do any heating/tightening cycles on my 1985 300D turbo rebuild and its not leaking.

bsdguy · #4 01-11-2014, 11:34 PM

Hello All,

Thanks for the responses so far. I checked over my work and found that the bolts for the oil tubes going in and out of the center housing were loose. I tighten them down and don't have any leaks there.

As I test drove the car I would stop and inspect for leaks. I saw a drip from the drain tube that feeds back into the oil pan. I replaced the o-ring that's on the tube that connects to the oil pan during the rebuild. As far as I can tell it was seated good. I will try to push it down if I can.

So I consider that progress. I will read the links posted by whunter to see if I can gets some pointers.

Thanks Again,

bsdguy

Diesel911 · #5 01-11-2014, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bsdguy

Hello All,

Thanks for the responses so far. I checked over my work and found that the bolts for the oil tubes going in and out of the center housing were loose. I tighten them down and don't have any leaks there. Unless for some reason the Bearing Housing has a Crack or Hole in it and that would be extremely rare.

As I test drove the car I would stop and inspect for leaks. I saw a drip from the drain tube that feeds back into the oil pan. I replaced the o-ring that's on the tube that connects to the oil pan during the rebuild. As far as I can tell it was seated good. I will try to push it down if I can.

So I consider that progress. I will read the links posted by whunter to see if I can gets some pointers.

Thanks Again,

bsdguy

??? The only place that can leak Oil on the Turbine end is the Seal Ring and the Ring Groove around the Turbine Shaft (is on the Exhaust side).

The Exhaust Housing to Bearing Housing interface is not designed to seal off any Oil and after it runs a while Carbon deposits seal any little gaps (as you likely noticed when you took the Turbo apart).

Other issues: Besides the Piston Ring Seal wearing the groove that the Piston Ring seal rides in also need to be with in spec for it to not leak Oil.

When someone does an actual rebuild on a Turbo Charger they check that Ring Groove and they measure the Bearing Bores, the Turbine Shaft Journals and have the Turbine and Compressor Wheel Balanced. And, other details.

It is also possible to crack the Piston Ring Seal or pinch one of the Piston Ring ends between the Seal Bore and the Turbine Housing but with the Pinching issue you would feel it when you rotate it by hand.
It is also possible to do sort of a 1/2 pinch and scratch the Seal Bore but have the Piston Ring Seal end up where it is supposed to be.

mikeyfev1 · #6 01-11-2014, 11:56 PM

Ok, now I will confess. I have no leaks of the sort that you initially described, but I do have a leak where the oil return tube halves join. I also replaced the o-ring at that point.

I don't really understand why it is leaking there. I know, there are 7000 posts about this issue, and I've reviewed most of them, but I still don't understand why it is leaking. Like I said, I replaced the o-ring at that joint, and I have attached hose clamps to the lower section, gotten under the car and used a long rod and hammered upward on the lower tube to try and get it to seat better into the upper one. Still leaking.

Is it possible that the bottom of the lower tube (which I think has some sort of valve in it) is not draining quickly enough into the oil pan which causes the oil to back up in the tube and them leak out the joint? I must admit that I did not change any bottom o-rings or seals because I did not remove the lower tube when I removed/rebuilt the turbo.

I have wiped/checked the lower tube carefully and it is not leaking from the bottom, only from the middle joint.

bsdguy · #7 02-15-2014, 09:45 PM

I referrenced the links from whunter to repair the turbo drain seal that sits on top of the oil pan housing. Those new gaskets made the difference. The original was brittle and came out in pieces. I was some work getting the old parts out and the new ones in.

I also put a hole in one of my transmission oil cooler lines. I found a post on a repair for that. I have no leaks after the test drive today.

Thank you guys for all of your help and advice.

Diesel911 · #8 02-15-2014, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeyfev1

Ok, now I will confess. I have no leaks of the sort that you initially described, but I do have a leak where the oil return tube halves join. I also replaced the o-ring at that point.

I don't really understand why it is leaking there. I know, there are 7000 posts about this issue, and I've reviewed most of them, but I still don't understand why it is leaking. Like I said, I replaced the o-ring at that joint, and I have attached hose clamps to the lower section, gotten under the car and used a long rod and hammered upward on the lower tube to try and get it to seat better into the upper one. Still leaking.

Is it possible that the bottom of the lower tube (which I think has some sort of valve in it) is not draining quickly enough into the oil pan which causes the oil to back up in the tube and them leak out the joint? I must admit that I did not change any bottom o-rings or seals because I did not remove the lower tube when I removed/rebuilt the turbo.

I have wiped/checked the lower tube carefully and it is not leaking from the bottom, only from the middle joint.

There is no valve on the Tube. It needs to have an open drain. The Valve you are speaking of is part of the Breather that is in the Air Filter Housing and the Oil Return Tube for that.

This is not a common problem; not like the more frequent Oil leaks from the Bottom Grommet.
As for you Leak. Is the Oil coming from above and running down the Tube?

Tubes can develop cracks from vibration and it is possible that the O-ring got a piece cut out of it during assembly or the O-ring was not fat enough to Seal.

You did not say if you replaced either of the Metal Tubes. I have read where people complained that the Tubes were not well formed where the O-rings go on replacement tubes.

whunter · #9 02-16-2014, 01:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel911

There is no valve on the Tube. It needs to have an open drain. The Valve you are speaking of is part of the Breather that is in the Air Filter Housing and the Oil Return Tube for that.

This is not a common problem; not like the more frequent Oil leaks from the Bottom Grommet.
As for you Leak. Is the Oil coming from above and running down the Tube?

Tubes can develop cracks from vibration and it is possible that the O-ring got a piece cut out of it during assembly or the O-ring was not fat enough to Seal.

You did not say if you replaced either of the Metal Tubes. I have read where people complained that the Tubes were not well formed where the O-rings go on replacement tubes.

Here is the DIY and pictures.
PeachPartsWiki: Replacing the Turbo Drain Tube

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Diesel911 · #10 02-16-2014, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whunter

Here is the DIY and pictures.
PeachPartsWiki: Replacing the Turbo Drain Tube

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When I change My Turbo Drain Gromet there was no Valve under the Drain but there is a Valve at the bottom of the Breather Drain Tubing.

If I got the pics in the right order the first pic is of an Engine that has no Breather Drain; only the Turbo Drain and no Valve is present in the diagram.

In the next pic is an Engine that has the Breather drain and #7 is the Breather Drain Valve

whunter · #11 02-16-2014, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel911

When I change My Turbo Drain Grommet there was no Valve under the Drain but there is a Valve at the bottom of the Breather Drain Tubing.

If I got the pics in the right order the first pic is of an Engine that has no Breather Drain; only the Turbo Drain and no Valve is present in the diagram.

In the next pic is an Engine that has the Breather drain and #7 is the Breather Drain Valve

This is correct.
The Breather Drain Valve prevents crankcase pressure from blowing engine oil backward into the breather.

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mikeyfev1 · #12 02-17-2014, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel911

...Is the Oil coming from above and running down the Tube?

The oil is coming out in the middle of the tube. I did put a new o-ring there.

Quote:

Tubes can develop cracks from vibration and it is possible that the O-ring got a piece cut out of it during assembly or the O-ring was not fat enough to Seal.

You did not say if you replaced either of the Metal Tubes. I have read where people complained that the Tubes were not well formed where the O-rings go on replacement tubes.

I did not replace any metal tubes.

compress ignite · #13 02-17-2014, 10:33 PM

Turbo self-reman

Thanks!

Diesel911 · #14 02-17-2014, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeyfev1

The oil is coming out in the middle of the tube. I did put a new o-ring there.

I did not replace any metal tubes.

Not your specific O-ring but Members have recieve O-rings that were not the correct size.

I persnaly have installed O-rings and managed to take a nick out of the side or had the O-ring come out of the Groove on one side and get pinched.

In your particular Case the lower Tube can be slid up and down. Perhaps the lower Tube got pushed down too far.

But, it sounds like you are going to need to pull one or both ot the Tubes to fix it.

Something else I forgot to mention is that if the Oil Level is too high Turbos do not drain easily.

Not on a Mercedes but I have seen where Crancase Oil on Truck was high enough that the Oil would not drain out of the Turbocharger Housing and it caused the Seals to leak.

I have seen the leak for that reason on Rebuilt Turbos.

whunter · #15 02-17-2014, 11:12 PM

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