Going to look at an 1987 300D later this week

[renaissanceman]

With 120k on the clock (low mileage?), single owner (90 year old man, friend of my grandparents). He wants $2750 for it, and says the only problem is the A/C does not work (common I read, but somewhat of a PITA). New tires.

I am somewhat familiar with the earlier 190D cars (have a buddy with 3 of them) but am unsure of the value of the later vehicles. I have read the buyer's guide here: (http://www.w124performance.com/docs/mb/articles/124.1x3_buying_tips.txt), so I am aware of the common issues. How's that price sound?

I've had it in the back of my mind to get into MB diesels for about 4 years now, but have never actually done it. Should I just stay away for my own sake, or are they worth it? I'm not in need of a vehicle at the moment, but it seems like an interesting ride.

Thanks!

[PARSHOOT1]

I'd have a couple more questions:

#1-Does the current owner have a stack of repair/maintenance invoices ?

#2--Where did he have it serviced or was he a DIYer?

#3--Have you thought about getting it inspected?

As a negotiating strategy, if you decide to make an offer, given that you know the a/c doesn't work, I'd print out the cost of the various parts to repair the a/c from Pelican, then get a labor estimate, and say let's say those add up to $750. I'd then take that information along with you plus $2M grand in $100 bills ($2750 - $750) and I'll bet you'll drive home a car. Nothing speaks stronger than information and cash. And you will have both.

[treetops]

$2750 is a pretty good starting price. Not sure where your at, but in my local area they run a bit higher in $$, but I would not have paid more than 3200 for a 92 model with 130K. Seller got nostalgic and kept it. My gain I paid a bit more for a 99 e300 with the same mileage.

[dieselbenz1]

Check the head and one is fairly prone to problems you may or may not have an issue at least do some reading about heads on the 603 engines.

[vstech]

It's the only year the 6cylinder turbo diesel was put in the w124... If it's a one owner under 200K, in good maintenance and rust free, don't negotiate, buy it. Keep in mind, it'll likely need 2K in suspension parts soon.
VERY powerful vehicle. If you like it, and you inspect the issues on the list, get it.

[renaissanceman]

Originally Posted by vstech

It's the only year the 6cylinder turbo diesel was put in the w124... If it's a one owner under 200K, in good maintenance and rust free, don't negotiate, buy it. Keep in mind, it'll likely need 2K in suspension parts soon.
VERY powerful vehicle. If you like it, and you inspect the issues on the list, get it.

The list says a few things about suspension, but none of it in the 2k range -- what exactly is so expensive to replace? I have rebuilt the entire suspension on my Saturn sedan (current daily driver, and great car, BTW). I always repair my vehicles myself. Is it the labor that is the killer on that one?

Also, how are these cars on fuel cruising on the highway at 65-75? I read the 4-speed is a non-lockup automatic, which I'm not too crazy about. Lockup saves a lot of fuel.

[Shortsguy1]

At the speeds you mentioned, I would bet that a decently running 87 300D will get 30-35 mpg. There have been a few threads which survey folks regarding their fuel economy, and those numbers are my best recollection. I used to own a 1987 Honda Civic which had a locking auto during highway cruising, so I also was disappointed to learn that MB wasn't doing the same thing at the same time.

[shertex]

Agreed....buy it.

[dieselbenz1]

Anyone who derives pleasure from fixing a Saturn will love working on a Benz. Make the 90 year old a happy man and yourself too even if you overpay slightly.

[w123fanman]

Originally Posted by renaissanceman

The list says a few things about suspension, but none of it in the 2k range -- what exactly is so expensive to replace? I have rebuilt the entire suspension on my Saturn sedan (current daily driver, and great car, BTW). I always repair my vehicles myself. Is it the labor that is the killer on that one?

Also, how are these cars on fuel cruising on the highway at 65-75? I read the 4-speed is a non-lockup automatic, which I'm not too crazy about. Lockup saves a lot of fuel.

It's probably not quite that bad if you do all the work yourself with good quality parts (there is much information on this site and others about good brands) but it is a lot of work, especially if there is corrosion or rust. The cost is higher than that of a Saturn because the multilink set up of the rear suspension has many more parts than the set up of the Saturn, in fact, multilink suspension is not found in many if not most mainstream cars being produced now because of the cost.

I spent over $2k so far on the suspension on my 190D to refresh it but the majority of that came from when I had my mechanic do some of the work so I had to pay labor for him to remove bits that were original with over 300K miles on them, plus corrosion and rust. I am almost done with the suspension work and the car rides better than most modern automobiles I have been in (usually economy cars anyway).

[renaissanceman]

When I look at the car, I will check for rust and the condition of the rubber pieces. The climate of western Oregon is very good for preserving vehicles -- very little rust (no salt) and the cool temperatures/lack of sunlight help with the rubber bits, so hopefully I can get it up to 200k without too much maintenance.

I have heard it is prudent to replace the vacuum pump ASAP before it grenades, taking the engine with it? I will also check how fast the engine shuts off to judge vacuum leaks/lack thereof.

Do properly operating auto transmission in these cars tend to shift very smoothly, or is it more of a "crisp" shift (like a slight bump)?

How's the non-lockup treat you guys? I have a Suzuki Sidekick with an all mechanical auto transmission of the same era (GM TH180 with TCC lockup), and before I fixed TCC lockup, the throttle response was a little lacking (granted, 80hp gasser in an aerodynamic brick...). Seems like these things would get 40 mpg with lockup...

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The guy's wife is in failing health and he's a farmer trying to get ready for the big freeze coming this week, so I'm in a holding pattern for looking at the car. They have not advertised it anywhere yet, so I'm not too concerned about it at this point.

My gut tells me that it would easily go for $2750 on CL around these parts -- I see quite a few of the older ones selling for 3-5k with over 200k on the clock. (such as this one: 1985 Mercedes 300D) A 1978 240D just moved for $3300 in a couple days.

In your guy's opinion, are the late 80's cars with the 6 cylinder superior to the older ones with the 5 cylinder diesel?

[vstech]

Originally Posted by Shortsguy1

At the speeds you mentioned, I would bet that a decently running 87 300D will get 30-35 mpg. There have been a few threads which survey folks regarding their fuel economy, and those numbers are my best recollection. I used to own a 1987 Honda Civic which had a locking auto during highway cruising, so I also was disappointed to learn that MB wasn't doing the same thing at the same time.

30mpg is unlikely... expect 27-30mpg below 70... in perfect tune, the car will REALLY move.

as for expense, yeah, the subframe and suspension links, the diff and driveshaft, and motor mounts, and well... you get the idea. figure NOTHING will be needed immediately, but for a perfect ride, you will want to replace all the rubber parts. it's fairly easy to do all the work, but some special tools are needed to complete the work.

[vstech]

be lucky you are not considering a wagon...

add another grand for the lift stuff...

you simply cannot imagine the quality of the ride when the parts are all new.

I drive corvettes, to dump trucks, and I know rides... the 124 is just simply awe inspiring to drive. I'd love to have an E430...

[BillGrissom]

Welcome. A lot of people are here just out of love of unique diesel cars. I am less enthusiastic, still awaiting the day when diesel becomes dirt cheap so I can strut proudly.

Check the engine for blow-by (see you-tube). If the engine has worn rings & cylinders, the car has almost negative value other than for parting out.

[Zulfiqar]

as vstech said - the ride quality is extremely good with new parts under it. honestly speaking nothing quite drives like it