W124 Rearview Mirror fits W123 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

BillGrissom · #1 11-28-2015, 09:11 PM

The rearview mirror in my 1984 300D self-destructed. I wasn't even flipping the high-beam shade, just barely touched it and the bottom fell out. I expect cars in other "evil sun" locations will eventually experience similar.

The best link I found:
www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/368781-mirror-removal-technique.html

Would have been smart to search that before I went to PickNPull. I couldn't find a hidden cover to get at the mirror post screws on a W123. They don't exist. The post is secured by two spring-loaded side cones. You tilt it sideways to pop it out of the bracket's rectangular hole (bracket bolts to roof thru head-liner). At PickNPull, I had no insight, so pried the mirror off the post sphere. That broke some of the mirror's securing tabs (old & brittle), so I looked for another mirror that would work, and learned about the various designs. A Jag mirror looked like it would work except electronic and the wires route thru the sphere. Finally, I found a W124 (recall 94 300D) that looked identical so pried its mirror off the post w/ no harm.

While trying to pop the W124 mirror on at home, the post in my car broke free and I then saw how it is secured. The W124 mirror was too tight to pop on the sphere by hand, so I used my shop press. The mirrors look almost identical, but PN's differ:

1984 300D: IE1 0010 059, Ie102*10059

W124 (1994?): IE1 0110 050, Ie102*10050

The only difference I noted is that the later mirror has a small rubber bumper on each side, perhaps for windshield contact. Otherwise, the advantage is that a W124 mirror is newer and hopefully less brittle. In the distant future when none are available, you could remove the post and use a "glue to windshield" type, though my 1996 Voyager has one and it has fallen off 3 times so far (why auto parts sell the super-glue).

vstech · #2 11-29-2015, 05:19 AM

I'm fairly certain all MB mirror base are the same... but it's best to take the entire mirror not just the lens. Most will break pulling off or putting on the ball.

Mxfrank · #3 11-29-2015, 09:33 AM

Are you saying that the mirror pops off the ball? I have a Gentex electronic mirror that I would love to install on the 190, but I need to separate the mirror and mount to do it.

vstech · #4 11-29-2015, 09:58 AM

Yes. It can pop off the ball... but it more often will shatter the socket if you do.

BillGrissom · #5 11-30-2015, 02:41 PM

Yes, it can pop on & off the post ball. But, when I popped the mirror off the ball on the PickNPull W123 (1984?), some of the plastic socket broke (brittle). It would still have worked, but seemed it wasn't in much better shape than mine, so I left it. The W124 one popped off & on w/ no such failure so probably less sun damaged. If I ever do again, I will take the whole mirror & post now that I understand how the post attaches to the roof.

BTW, the W124 was a gasser. I see many more of those than diesels at PickNPull. Might be their tricky Jetronic fuel controls are costly to maintain.

A Jag mirror was the only one I saw nearby that appeared it might fit the M-B ball. That was from a quick look at some import cars and Fords. You would have to re-wire so the wires run outside the post, but many cars do this (my 2002 T&C, uses expanded plastic sheath). An electronic dimmer mirror might give a cool look, but not worth the effort for me.

Maxbumpo · #6 11-30-2015, 04:18 PM

I recently was looking for a "new" 124 mirror at the local LKQ, and I compared a 123 mirror with a 124, and although the two spring-points looked correct for size and distance, the bases are different. My impression was that the 123 base is bigger and won't fit a 124 receptacle.

MBeige · #7 12-02-2015, 04:55 AM

I once tried to reinstall the mirror back on the neck of a unit I pulled from a W123 and could not put it back together. Were you able to use a W124 mirror on a W123 base to install in a W123? The differences between the bases won't allow a direct interchange.

mannys9130 · #8 12-02-2015, 05:43 AM

To remove the entire base, you don't need to pry or tilt. Just grab the gooseneck of the base (NOT the mirror itself) and give it a nice, quick, firm tug toward you. The mirror was made that way so that if an occupant hits it in a collision, it will break away from the roof harmlessly. Just grab it and yank and it'll pop right out.

jay_bob · #9 12-02-2015, 06:59 AM

Yep that is one of those things that you swear you are going to break it if you do it that way.

Grab firmly on the stem (not the mirror) and give it good sharp tug straight down.

Now getting it back in is another story. You will need a tool to compress the points back into the barrel so you can insert the bracket back into the pocket in the roof. They helpfully give you a hole to insert a thin piece of metal that will hold the springs compressed while you insert it. Unfortunately you need something really thin and strong and with a grip to be able to pull it out once the mirror is in place.

I was able to modify the tip of a DIN radio removal key, but I think there is a MB specific tool for the job.

JimFreeh · #10 12-02-2015, 08:23 AM

I like to smear a little bit of grease on the balls before I insert.......

jim

Maxbumpo · #11 12-02-2015, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jay_bob

Now getting it back in is another story. You will need a tool to compress the points back into the barrel so you can insert the bracket back into the pocket in the roof. They helpfully give you a hole to insert a thin piece of metal that will hold the springs compressed while you insert it. Unfortunately you need something really thin and strong and with a grip to be able to pull it out once the mirror is in place.

I was able to modify the tip of a DIN radio removal key, but I think there is a MB specific tool for the job.

I've installed the inside mirror twice on 124 cars, following advice from my favorite independent mechanic: Put one side of the base (right or left) into position, put the handle of a hammer on the other (high) side of the base and hold in place, and carefully smack the head of the hammer with your free hand (the wooden hammer handle is used as a drift). Don't slip, you could easily break the windshield!

This is not easy, but when you smack the hammer just right, the mirror pops right in. The first time took multiple attempts and I almost gave up and took the car to Hans, but the second time it went much faster.

Incidentally, the only place I see in the FSM that applies is procedure 68-400 (124 cars), and no mention is made of any tool or procedure other than "remove" and the for installation "proceed vice versa".

charmalu · #12 12-02-2015, 11:07 AM

Interesting you mentioned using a hammer to reinstall the mirror.

Probably 10 years back or longer I knocked off the mirror or took it off so the glass shop could replace the window.
Too many yrs ago to remember.

Getting it back on, I tried everything and was pulling my hair out for a solution.
Then thought of using two hammers. Had Wife sit on the drivers side and hold the mirror in tight.
Then from the pass side I used two HF Dead Blow hammers. Set the handle against the Mirror base,
and whacked the head with another Dead Blow. She popped right in....
well after a few failed attempts, I final gave it a shot of WD-40 or Kroil to help snap her home.

I have had the same failed attempts popping off mirrors at PNP, and have the Ball Socket break.
The plastic cracks, and then the mirror doesn`t hold tight to the ball.

Charlie

sent from my pos computer

BillGrissom · #13 12-02-2015, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBeige

... Were you able to use a W124 mirror on a W123 base to install in a W123? ...

Exactly, like I said in posts 1 & 5.
As I said, I resorted to a shop press to slowly press the W124 mirror onto my W123 post ball. I might have beat it on, but this seemed less likely to damage it. Of course, I supported the mirror on plywood to spread the force. It popped on fairly easily. The W124 plastic socket was undamaged.

Maxbumpo · #14 12-15-2015, 02:21 PM

I finally replaced the mirror in my '95 124 this past weekend, found a decent mirror in my spare parts pile. The old mirror plastic was brittle and finally just fell apart at the bottom at the day/night switch.

For grins, I decided to see if I could separate the mirror from the arm, popping the ball out of the socket, without damaging the socket. I heated up the plastic socket with a hair drier, and popped it out with no problem. I suspect it would be quite easy to swap a 123 and a 124 mirror from one base to the other, using a hair drier to heat up the plastic socket.

BillGrissom · #15 12-16-2015, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maxbumpo

... The old mirror plastic was brittle and finally just fell apart at the bottom at the day/night switch. ...

Not encouraging for us W123 owners hoping for better stock from a later model. I can't blame M-B for a 1984 mirror in sunny CA failing, but 1994 in SC is more troubling. But my 1984 apparently spent a lot of time under a pine tree since the trunk gutters were clogged and the trunk filled w/ water, causing black mildew and smell in the whole interior (cleaned up fine w/ soap & water). Of course, worse case would be to just pop the mirror & post off and use a "glue to windshield" mirror like most later cars use.