Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Tech Information and Support > Diesel Discussion

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-08-2016, 01:53 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 320
Hi Revs before tranny kicks in & hard to put in reverseW123

Finally got the linkage sorted out, on my 1985 300D, and have all the gears, tho it is hard to shift from neutral to reverse. It will easily go from park to reverse however.

I read several threads about hard to put in reverse, could be something internal, but wondering why it goes into reverse just fine from park.

No matter what gear, the tranny will not kick in without a relatively high RPM compared to other 300D's i've driven. And sometimes makes a whirring noise until it does kick in. Once it kicks in it drives fairly well on the road. I drained the fluid, it was pretty clean, & put a new filter and gasket on the pan. There is an intermittent trans fluid leak believed to be in the tubing from the tranny to the cooler. So i never know if the fluid level is right, but just read several threads on that and will check it again in the morning.

Is there an adjustment for how high it needs to rev, or is the tranny "toast"?

Unknown mileage due to odometer that stopped at 164K before i bought the car.

Thanks in advance,this forum has been so helpful on many issues.

Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-08-2016, 09:49 AM
Diesel911's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Long Beach,CA
Posts: 51,251
If you are speaking of high reves to go into first gear when I had that issue what you did already chainging the fluid and filter fixed it but then less then 1 year later the B2 Piston Broke.
If the B2 area has the original B2 Piston Bushing and Seal the Bushing is Aluminum and apparely gets grabby on the B2 Piston and the Seal can stop sealing well.
The replacment bushing looks like it is made of Nylon.

I have replaced the B2 Piston and the related parts on mine. The job is not technically hard but on a W123 you need to remove enough stuff that the tail end of the Transmission can be pushed towards the drivers side in order to have enough room to get at the B2 Piston access area.

The B2 Band can also get worn. After that my knowlege on the issue peters out.

You might look up adjusting the Bodwen Cable.

Repair Links
Fast navigation Fast navigation Do It Yourself Links

I did the stuff mentioned to my Trans but I have never put on the pressure gauges to see if my pressures and the Modulator adjustments are correct.

Also back in 2007-2010 some people had were finding that the springs in side of the transmission's valve body were broken.
__________________
84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-08-2016, 05:32 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 3,115
There is a good article on adjusting the tranny by Steve Brotherton, linked here (doesn't work today)
www.peachparts.com/shopforum/general-information/279426-proper-vacuum-system-tuning-achieves-optimal-shift-acurate-repair.html

Try googling by title
"PROPER VACUUM SYSTEM "TUNING" ACHIEVES OPTIMAL SHIFT CHARACTERISTICS AND AN ACCURATE REPAIR".

I would check vacuum to VCV, Bowden cable, modulator, in that order. When my 300D's shifted too late, it was the Bowden cable adjustment. In one, the plastic adjuster threads had broken so I put a slit tube over that to hold the proper position.
__________________
1984 & 1985 CA 300D's
1964 & 65 Mopar's - Valiant, Dart, Newport
1996 & 2002 Chrysler minivans
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-08-2016, 06:41 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Modesto CA
Posts: 4,087
Quote:
Originally Posted by sun tortise View Post
Finally got the linkage sorted out, on my 1985 300D, and have all the gears, tho it is hard to shift from neutral to reverse. It will easily go from park to reverse however.
Is it also hard to continue on through R to P?

Quote:
No matter what gear, the tranny will not kick in without a relatively high RPM compared to other 300D's i've driven. And sometimes makes a whirring noise until it does kick in.
Does "kick in" mean a sudden, sharp engagement when driving off from a stop,
OR
A smooth engagement, only that it occurs at increased RPM?
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10-09-2016, 01:10 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 320
It is only hard from neutral to reverse. You have to really strong arm it all the way to park, then it will go back to reverse easily. Reverse to park is OK.

It is if anything sluggish a bit when revved high enough to start moving. No "kick" to the kick in.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-09-2016, 01:31 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Modesto CA
Posts: 4,087
Quote:
Originally Posted by sun tortise View Post
the tranny will not kick in without a relatively high RPM. And sometimes makes a whirring noise until it does kick in.
The above two statements suggest either a stripped stator spline, or a slipping sprag in the stator.
Without a functioning stator in the torque convertor, there will be increased RPM required to accelerate from a stop. Once at a constant speed the function of the stator is reduced, and the response of the torque convertor is much closer to normal.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 10-09-2016, 01:38 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 320
What is required to fix the stator?

Can the stator be repaired with the trans in the car, or is it a major rebuild?
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-09-2016, 01:40 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 320
Transmission from 84 wagon: would it work in an 85 300D?

If the above repair is major, i have a tranny pulled from an 84 300TD. Wondering if it would be a direct fit.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 10-09-2016, 01:44 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 320
Also wondering if the stator problems would be likely to rapidly deteriorate, or just remain an annoying glitch for an extended period.

What about the reverse problem?

Thanks again for the advice!
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 10-09-2016, 01:49 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Modesto CA
Posts: 4,087
Quote:
Originally Posted by sun tortise View Post
Can the stator be repaired with the trans in the car, or is it a major rebuild?
If the stator spline is stripped, replacement of the front pump is required, and replacement of the torque convertor due to contamination.
If the stator spline is OK, replacement of the torque convertor is required.
The stator is built into the torque convertor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sun tortise View Post
If the above repair is major, i have a tranny pulled from an 84 300TD. Wondering if it would be a direct fit.
Examine the transmission type/part numbers located (stamped) on the right side pan rail above the pan gasket.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 10-09-2016, 01:57 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Modesto CA
Posts: 4,087
Quote:
Originally Posted by sun tortise View Post
Also wondering if the stator problems would be likely to rapidly deteriorate, or just remain an annoying glitch for an extended period.

What about the reverse problem?

Thanks again for the advice!
A damaged stator spline or stator sprag will continue to contaminate the ATF, hence, continuing to distribute wear particles throughout the transmission.

The selector stiffness suggests a binding problem, or damaged bushing at some point in the linkage.
OR
An internal selector bind. Test for this by removing the link rod from the arm on the trans, and then moving the trans arm through its range.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 10-09-2016, 04:22 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 320
Took it for a spin

Found that the trans fluid was way low, added the only quart i had on hand, & took it for a drive, and it starts moving much more readily, no "whirring".

BUT this time, i could not strong arm it past reverse to park and then return to reverse.

Unlikely to be the linkage because i can shut off the engine, and then the lever goes thru all the gears, AND, i can start it in park, and go to reverse with no problem, and reverse is strong. For some reason, the gear shift lever does not want to go from drive to reverse, but only when the engine is running.

So how does one fix an internal selector bind, and can one live with that for a while w/o further damaging the transmission? (I'm assuming the other symptoms were mainly low tranny fluid and not the stator/spline).
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 10-09-2016, 05:22 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Modesto CA
Posts: 4,087
Quote:
Originally Posted by sun tortise View Post
Found that the trans fluid was way low, added the only quart i had on hand, & took it for a drive, and it starts moving much more readily, no "whirring".

BUT this time, i could not strong arm it past reverse to park and then return to reverse.

Unlikely to be the linkage because i can shut off the engine, and then the lever goes thru all the gears, AND, i can start it in park, and go to reverse with no problem, and reverse is strong. For some reason, the gear shift lever does not want to go from drive to reverse, but only when the engine is running.

So how does one fix an internal selector bind, and can one live with that for a while w/o further damaging the transmission? (I'm assuming the other symptoms were mainly low tranny fluid and not the stator/spline).
Proceed to pan removal, and inspection of the internal connection to the selector valve in the valve body. There is a reverse blocker that is normally activated only above a road speed of about 5-6 MPH; it may be causing the block that you experience when there is hydraulic pressure (engine running), but no block without pressure.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 10-10-2016, 12:57 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 320
Adding tranny fluid made reverse problem WORSE!

I'm thinking this corroborates your theory, Frank, as adding fluid when it was very low might have increased hydraulic pressure.

How would i recognize the selector valve body once i took the pan off, and is this something that could be repaired/replaced with the trans still in the car.

Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 10-10-2016, 02:37 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Modesto CA
Posts: 4,087
Quote:
Originally Posted by sun tortise View Post
I'm thinking this corroborates your theory, Frank, as adding fluid when it was very low might have increased hydraulic pressure.

How would i recognize the selector valve body once i took the pan off, and is this something that could be repaired/replaced with the trans still in the car.

Thanks
Inasmuch as this is terra incognito for you, suggest some time spent with Google Images, and online shop manuals to familiarize yourself with the components.

Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:38 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2024 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page