After the new DV's went in the diesel clacking was quite loud, this is made worse by the stainless exhaust which echoes the note throughout the car - its happened before, then disappearing after a while.

Quiet a few people have posted similar experiences including one that only started clacking after glow plugs cut out, this is the same as mine - another poster commented it was the GPs helping to burn excess fuel, hence noise returns after they close out.

Emissions test Tuesday

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David


1996 Mercedes S124 E300TD - 129k - rolling restoration project -

1998 Mercedes W210 300TD - 118k (assimilated into above vehicle)

Passed with flying colours, testers couldn't figure out why it was smoking but not showing up on test equipment.



....long live sunflower oil..

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David


1996 Mercedes S124 E300TD - 129k - rolling restoration project -

1998 Mercedes W210 300TD - 118k (assimilated into above vehicle)

Engine starting to settle down now with less over fueling, clatter - I guess switching out one set of delivery valve holders from another pump is not such a great idea after all, that said if you can put up with diesel clacking for a while the extra power makes up for it.

On the subject of wobble in case anyone is looking for other solutions, came across this video highlighting the crank sensor, if you look at the engine while running it too has a distinct 'wobble'.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LTN1PlhDOY

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David


1996 Mercedes S124 E300TD - 129k - rolling restoration project -

1998 Mercedes W210 300TD - 118k (assimilated into above vehicle)

Your prose really has me scratching my head.
It's settling down... why is it not such a good idea then?

What part of that video did you even see the engine in the car?

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1981 240D 4sp manual. Ivory White.

It was the timing of it more than anything, just before an emissions test - the holders need a bit of time to bed in before they quieten down pushing less fuel, I also re-torqued using dieselmeken's three step procedure.

He did a couple of videos on related subjects, it was this one showing 'wobble'

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MgH0fIWNcSc&t=309s

__________________
David


1996 Mercedes S124 E300TD - 129k - rolling restoration project -

1998 Mercedes W210 300TD - 118k (assimilated into above vehicle)

How did you get on fixing your issue/wobble?

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David


1996 Mercedes S124 E300TD - 129k - rolling restoration project -

1998 Mercedes W210 300TD - 118k (assimilated into above vehicle)

No immediate change noted.

I replaced the Delivery valves on a Monday and parked the car for four months on a Wednesday, so no real road time for discerning improvement. When I get back behind the wheel in September I’ll be paying attention.

I have read that new delivery valves do need time to “bed in.” I’ve also read this in regards to delivery valve crush washers and springs, though I have no idea what this “bedding in” process entails. What exactly is bedding in?

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1981 240D 4sp manual. Ivory White.

The DV's need to "wear in" after they've been disturbed. The sealing faces won't be perfectly mated. Several operations (tens of thousands) are needed to wear the faces in. It isn't the washer that wears in, it's the faces of the DV itself. The period of time needed for them to wear in may have some mild nailing, but won't cause skipping at idle. The noise will die down typically in 100-1000 miles. If swapping the DV's didn't cure the skip/wobble/miss, be looking for another issue, probably valves not sealing properly due to wear or worn guides.

__________________
Current stable:
1995 E320 157K (Nancy)
1983 500SL 125K (SLoL)

Gone but not forgotten:
1986 300SDL (RIP)
1991 350SD
1991 560SEL
1990 560SEL
1986 500SEL Euro (Rusted to nothing at 47K!)

Gone and wanting to forget:
1985 524TD 167K (TotalDumpster™) [Definitely NOT a Benz]

Wouldn't that come up in a compression test? I was within the 10% tolerance.

No skip or miss... it *sounds* like a healthy idle.

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1981 240D 4sp manual. Ivory White.

Valves that don't seal consistently due to worn guides or tuliped heads can pass a compression test but still leak enough gas during combustion to cause an inconsistent "shake" at low RPM's. A leakdown test will turn it up, you'll hear the air leaking from the intake or exhaust on the problem cylinder.

My SDL was a good example of this. My compression numbers were all centered around 380PSI. High end was ~395, low end around ~365. The low cylinder was due to leakage past the intake valve (confirmed with a leakdown test). 10% of 380PSI (average) is 38PSI, or a range of ~361-399PSI (+/-5% of 380). My maximum difference was 30PSI from highest to lowest, or ~7.6%. If you ran the engine with the intake off, you could hear the intermittent pops from the intake runner of the weak cylinder when the valve didn't seal fully. I only use my car as an example here because all of the numbers from the engine said it should be fine, and it fell within the accepted range of compression values, but it always suffered from that idle shake, regardless of what I did to the fuel system. I never pulled the head to repair it with the intention to replace it with a #17 or later head in the future. Other than the shake at idle, it ran well, started when cold, made good power, and got good fuel economy.

The bottom line is that if you swapped the DV's and the problem remains, it's more than likely to be a mechanical issue with the engine or injector problems. The latter can be tested by substituting a different injector and checking for a change in behavior. Don't just move the injectors around to different cylinders, you'll easily be fooled by it.

It's certainly possible for the injection pump to have some sort of problem, but it's unlikely. The pumping elements won't have an intermittent problem that comes and goes. It'll be there all the time and will never change. The governor mechanism affects all of the pumping elements at once, so a governor issue will usually result in a very profound rocking/cadence that affects the cylinders at random as the mechanism hunts.

I dealt with this last specific issue in my SDL when I got it. The rear ball bearing on the camshaft in the IP had come apart and was allowing the camshaft to wander around. Impressive that the car ran, but it was very poor, an extreme lope, primarily on cyls 4-6 that would go away with an increase in RPM. The replacement used IP was varnished internally and would refuse to rev or return to idle. I got it freed up enough to try to work, but gave up and sourced a 3rd. The 3rd IP had very worn DV's that caused excessive nailing and a pronounced "soft miss" at idle when hot. That IP is the one that the car lived out its days with and was the basis for my writeup in the DV nailing thread.

When I share information and experience on the IP and how it works, it's from personal first-hand experience with relatively uncommon problems, not someone else's misguided ramblings or armchair thoughts on an Internet forum. Hopefully it helps someone at some point.

__________________
Current stable:
1995 E320 157K (Nancy)
1983 500SL 125K (SLoL)

Gone but not forgotten:
1986 300SDL (RIP)
1991 350SD
1991 560SEL
1990 560SEL
1986 500SEL Euro (Rusted to nothing at 47K!)

Gone and wanting to forget:
1985 524TD 167K (TotalDumpster™) [Definitely NOT a Benz]

As above, I think Diseasel300 has nailed (pun intended).

The only thing I would add is heat, taking the car on several long motorway runs made no difference to the clatter, loud clacking, however daily starting gradually reduced noise to nothing.

Copper washers could become annealed, heating up then cooling overnight may help more during bedding in process.

__________________
David


1996 Mercedes S124 E300TD - 129k - rolling restoration project -

1998 Mercedes W210 300TD - 118k (assimilated into above vehicle)

No kidding man. I always appreciate the time you take to write these things up.
When I get back to driving, I look forward to tearing into this again.

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1981 240D 4sp manual. Ivory White.

Out of interest, has anyone found a CPS for 606 or other engine?

Recently had to lock the flywheel to change oil seal, don't remember seeing anything similar in this location (OM606.910).

__________________
David


1996 Mercedes S124 E300TD - 129k - rolling restoration project -

1998 Mercedes W210 300TD - 118k (assimilated into above vehicle)

CPS = crank position sensor?

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Respectfully,
/s/
M. Dillon
'87 124.193 (300TD) "White Whale", ~392k miles, 3.5l IP fitted
'95 124.131 (E300) "Sapphire", 380k miles
'73 Balboa 20 "Sanctification"
Charleston SC

The crank sensor on the 603 is on the back of the engine by the transmission bell housing, I'd expect the 606 to be similar. On these mechanically-injected diesels, it's only used for tach output to the EDS/EGR computer. It won't cause the "wobble" you're trying to cure. If the idle speed solenoid is having an issue, or the ELR is hunting, the engine can "rock" like someone goosing the throttle, but it won't be causing a shake. Easy enough to test, unplug the solenoid and see if the problem remains.

__________________
Current stable:
1995 E320 157K (Nancy)
1983 500SL 125K (SLoL)

Gone but not forgotten:
1986 300SDL (RIP)
1991 350SD
1991 560SEL
1990 560SEL
1986 500SEL Euro (Rusted to nothing at 47K!)

Gone and wanting to forget:
1985 524TD 167K (TotalDumpster™) [Definitely NOT a Benz]