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  #1  
Old 07-25-2021, 03:29 PM
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1984 300D TURBO NO START AFTER REPLACING THE TIMING CHAIN

Hi Everyone,

I got stuck in a loop here. I own a 1984 300D Turbo, which has 390,000 miles currently. It used to blow white and blue smoke, but I replaced the head gasket, rebuilt the head and changed the timing chain. While replacing the timing chain, I did not remove the vacuum pump, and the vacuum pump sucked the timing chain on feeding the chain. I'm not sure if it threw the injection pump out of timing doing so.
Unfortunately, the car will not start.

(I). I rechecked the valve gaps, and they all appear to work within the specs.
(II). The compression on all of the cylinders is within 360-380.
(III). I timed the crank and the cam, and the markings are perfectly aligned. (see pictures attached)
(IV). I primed the fuel pump and concluded there is no air in the fuel lines.

The only success I've had is that the car ran once for about 2 seconds before dying. I am confident that I have over-fueled the cylinders. I can check the timing with the drip method at 24 BTDC. I'm unsure if I should remove the delivery valve spring in the 617 Engine. I recall reading a thread on the Pelican Forum that suggested removing the delivery valve spring on the 615/616.

What should I be doing to get it up and running again? Any feedback would be appreciated.


Attached Thumbnails
1984 300D TURBO NO START AFTER REPLACING THE TIMING CHAIN-crank-.jpg   1984 300D TURBO NO START AFTER REPLACING THE TIMING CHAIN-cam.jpg  
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  #2  
Old 07-25-2021, 04:25 PM
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First, check the injection pump timing. If the timing is correct, ensure the glow plugs are operating correctly, i.e. you connected the wiring properly, etc.

The delivery valve removal is hit or miss. Some of the OM617's will drip without its removal and some don't.

If the chain did slip then you might need to pull the pump to retime it. Cross your fingers.
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  #3  
Old 07-25-2021, 04:42 PM
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You can also remove the bolt where the locking tool goes. The slot should line up 15 ATDC on #1 cylinder power stroke
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  #4  
Old 07-25-2021, 07:47 PM
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I tried starting the car. After a few tries, it did start with clanking and white smoke. But, it would stay idle when pushing the accelerator paddle to 800 RPM. It will stay idling at a lower RPM. I did not have this issue before changing the timing chain.
a). It seems like the ignition pump has jumped at least a tooth. I am not sure how many degrees I can adjust to the pump timing to compensate for the off timing.
b). The old chain was quite loose, and possibly the pump timing has been adjusted to the max, and now it needs to be timed with the new timing chain.
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  #5  
Old 07-25-2021, 09:25 PM
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See the picture in post number 3.

Vacuumpump rattling om617

This won't fix you fuel Injection pump timing issue but the end play on that timer bushing should have been checked because if there is too much it destroys Vacuum Pumps and that threatens your now Timing Chain and head job.

To the rear of your Fuel Supply Lift Pump should be a plug with at 17mm hears on it. Some oil is going to come out of their when it is removed.
Once that is done turn the Engine in the direction of rotation till come up on the compression stroke and go to OT (top dead center) and then go past it slowly to 15 degrees (that is after top dead center).
Find a way to look inside that port and you should see a sort of blade of steel going a crossed the middle of that port. If you don't see that your Fuel Injection Pump is out of timing.

The attached picture is not an MW Fuel Injection pump but when you look in the port if you pump is still timed OK you should see that blade in the center of the port.
Attached Thumbnails
1984 300D TURBO NO START AFTER REPLACING THE TIMING CHAIN-timing-locking-pin-port.jpg  
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  #6  
Old 07-26-2021, 03:44 PM
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[QUOTE=Diesel911;4181150]See the picture in post number 3.

Vacuumpump rattling om617

This won't fix you fuel Injection pump timing issue but the end play on that timer bushing should have been checked because if there is too much it destroys Vacuum Pumps and that threatens your now Timing Chain and head job.

To the rear of your Fuel Supply Lift Pump should be a plug with at 17mm hears on it. Some oil is going to come out of their when it is removed.
Once that is done turn the Engine in the direction of rotation till come up on the compression stroke and go to OT (top dead center) and then go past it slowly to 15 degrees (that is after top dead center).
Find a way to look inside that port and you should see a sort of blade of steel going a crossed the middle of that port. If you don't see that your Fuel Injection Pump is out of timing.

The attached picture is not an MW Fuel Injection pump but when you look in the port if you pump is still timed OK you should see that blade in the center of the port.


I tried to search for the thread you had mentioned, but I couldn't find it.
How to check the end play of timer bushing?
I will check the pump timing.
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  #7  
Old 07-27-2021, 12:56 PM
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[QUOTE=Deutscheauto;4181337]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diesel911 View Post
See the picture in post number 3.

Vacuumpump rattling om617

This won't fix you fuel Injection pump timing issue but the end play on that timer bushing should have been checked because if there is too much it destroys Vacuum Pumps and that threatens your now Timing Chain and head job.

To the rear of your Fuel Supply Lift Pump should be a plug with at 17mm hears on it. Some oil is going to come out of their when it is removed.
Once that is done turn the Engine in the direction of rotation till come up on the compression stroke and go to OT (top dead center) and then go past it slowly to 15 degrees (that is after top dead center).
Find a way to look inside that port and you should see a sort of blade of steel going a crossed the middle of that port. If you don't see that your Fuel Injection Pump is out of timing.

The attached picture is not an MW Fuel Injection pump but when you look in the port if you pump is still timed OK you should see that blade in the center of the port.


I tried to search for the thread you had mentioned, but I couldn't find it.
How to check the end play of timer bushing?
I will check the pump timing.
Apparently I forgot to post it: Vacuumpump rattling om617

See post 3 for a picture and read post 4.

Who has or knows someone that has experienced a timing chain breakage/failure?

What in particular causes vacuum pump failure?

I don't know if I found the right threads but most if the incidents of on OM617.952 engines seem to have be caused by Vacuum Pump Failure.

On the piston type vacuum pumps too much end play in that Timer/intermediate shaft bushing causes seems to cause that vacuum pump failure.

If pieces of the vacuum pump drive end fall into the timing gears and chain it can cause valves and pistons to collide as well as breaking the Timing Chain.
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  #8  
Old 07-27-2021, 01:07 PM
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Location: Long Beach,CA
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Note that I have too much end play in my own Timer/Intermediate Shaft Bushing and have a new bushing that I am going to install. My Timer and Intermediate Shaft are off I have just not gotten around to assembling things nor in fact ordering the other parts needed for install my Cylinder head and transmission (which I also removed to change the seals)

Took the End Play On My Timer/Intermediate Shaft

Also while I am doing this I am also doing Publisherclearinghouse contests and the divided attention often causes me to screw up stuff I am writing.
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  #9  
Old 09-02-2021, 12:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diesel911 View Post
See the picture in post number 3.

Vacuumpump rattling om617

This won't fix you fuel Injection pump timing issue but the end play on that timer bushing should have been checked because if there is too much it destroys Vacuum Pumps and that threatens your now Timing Chain and head job.

To the rear of your Fuel Supply Lift Pump should be a plug with at 17mm hears on it. Some oil is going to come out of their when it is removed.
Once that is done turn the Engine in the direction of rotation till come up on the compression stroke and go to OT (top dead center) and then go past it slowly to 15 degrees (that is after top dead center).
Find a way to look inside that port and you should see a sort of blade of steel going a crossed the middle of that port. If you don't see that your Fuel Injection Pump is out of timing.

The attached picture is not an MW Fuel Injection pump but when you look in the port if you pump is still timed OK you should see that blade in the center of the port.

I do not have a repair history on this 300D. Previously, the timing was adjusted to the maximum advance position. I set it back to align the blade as per your instruction. The car started half a click with no smoke, and there is no knock.
Thanks to all for your support.
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  #10  
Old 09-02-2021, 04:06 PM
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Location: Long Beach,CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deutscheauto View Post
I do not have a repair history on this 300D. Previously, the timing was adjusted to the maximum advance position. I set it back to align the blade as per your instruction. The car started half a click with no smoke, and there is no knock.
Thanks to all for your support.
Perfect.

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