616/617 stripped oil drain plug - Page 3 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Shern · #31 01-16-2023, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHZR2

I did this to see what was left. It was negligible.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vwnate1

Ypu did it once and found noticeable debris .

vwnate1 · #32 01-16-2023, 09:51 PM

At least *one* person gets it .

martureo · #33 01-17-2023, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vwnate1

At least *one* person gets it .

Have you considered that some oil pans/dipstick tubes have been designed for the top sider removal?

I think part of the disagreement is that modern applications have muddied the water. Not all modern engines have been designed for top side extraction, but if someone sees/hears someone doing it successfully they might assume that top side extraction works well for all modern engines. This might lead to an assumption that it works for older engines.

I was skeptical with top siders until I saw them called for by a factory manual and removed the oil pan to confirm that it did work quite well. I'm all for using them when they are called for and designed for. Outside of those conditions I'm with you, its lazy and ineffective.

JHZR2 · #34 01-17-2023, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vwnate1

At least *one* person gets it .

Get what? You realize that “negligible” and “noticeable” are not synonymous, right?

Have you ever dropped the pan on a 617 after doing a topsider extraction?

JHZR2 · #35 01-17-2023, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martureo

Have you considered that some oil pans/dipstick tubes have been designed for the top sider removal?

I think part of the disagreement is that modern applications have muddied the water. Not all modern engines have been designed for top side extraction, but if someone sees/hears someone doing it successfully they might assume that top side extraction works well for all modern engines. This might lead to an assumption that it works for older engines.

I was skeptical with top siders until I saw them called for by a factory manual and removed the oil pan to confirm that it did work quite well. I'm all for using them when they are called for and designed for. Outside of those conditions I'm with you, its lazy and ineffective.

Yes, due diligence is key. Apparently you did the experiment, like I did, and not just pass along hearsay and opinions.

I agree it’s dangerous to assume it works for all.

But this thread is about the 616/617, and it works fine there.

For any other vehicle, the simplest test is to do an extraction, then pull the drain plug and see what comes out. Modern scopes could be inserted to look since now tiny ones are available super cheap and are a good thing to have in the toolbox regardless. Dropping the pan is the ultimate test, but some vehicles it is easier said than done.

vwnate1 · #36 01-17-2023, 09:26 PM

What make and model call for it ? .

TIA,

JHZR2 · #37 01-18-2023, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vwnate1

What make and model call for it ? .

TIA,

Quote:

**************************************************

DATE: July 1997
SUBJECT:
ALL MODELS
OIL EVACUATION EQUIPMENT
Mercedes-Benz engines are designed to allow engine oil extraction from under the hood via the dipstick tube. The dipstick tube has an enlarged cross section and a formed extension at the top end. On the other side it ends a short distance from the oil pan bottom. Engine oil can be extracted using the dipstick tube.

Engine oil drain plugs will continue for the time being, although access to them may only be possible with the removal of engine compartment trim or noise encapsulation panels.
*********************************************************************************

Date: March 2001
Order No.: S-SI-58.00/118
Supersedes:
Group 58
SUBJECT:
ALL ENGINES
APPROVED OIL EVACUATION EQUIPMENT
The purpose of this Service Information is to inform dealers that Approved Oil Evacuation Equipment, which is used to extract used engine oil from the engine via the oil dipstick tube, is now available for order. Mercedes-Benz engines are designed to allow the extraction of engine oil from under the hood via the dipstick tube. The engine dipstick tube has an enlarged cross section, plus a formed extension at the top end where the dipstick is inserted and the approved engine oil evacuation equipment interfaces. The opposite end of the dipstick ends just short of the oil pan bottom, thus engine oil can be extracted via the approved oil evacuation equipment by using the dipstick tube. Additionally, the engine dipstick tube itself is the conduit through which spent engine oil is moved to the oil evacuation equipment.
In addition, service and repair components for existing approved oil evacuation equipment is also available.
Note: Because the engine oil dipstick tube is the conduit through which spent engine oil is extracted, inserting tubular probes through the dipstick tube is NOT recommended.
Special Note for M-class:
Due to the location of the vehicle frame and suspension components, the draining of engine oil via the engine crankcase oil drain plug is not recommended, since this can lead to engine oil coming in contact and subsequently be damaging to the rubber suspension components. Thus, it is strongly recommended to use the approved oil evacuation equipment contained in the Service

**********************************************

I’ve seen references for w205, w213, w164, at minimum, but the service information above says all engines. Mercedes has an official special service tool to do this. A well informed friend indicated that Audi does this too due to the complexity of underbody panels in some vehicles. It doesn’t appear to be a broad VAG mandate though.

Certainly my test validates its suitability in the 616/617 when a thin nylon tube is inserted down the dipstick hole to the bottom. I’d want to be sure that other oil pans don’t have overly raised threads before I intrinsically trusted it for all. *****However, note the language above. The dipstick tube ends “just short of the pan bottom”, and the dipstick tube is the conduit for extraction, not a longer nylon tube. Thus I would not have as much confidence in the dealer practice as I would with someone who uses an extractor that gets to the true bottom of the pan like mine did.

The N55 twin turbo engine in my 135i doesn’t even have a dipstick tube!! I guess BMW feels differently!

vwnate1 · #38 01-18-2023, 08:08 PM

Times change .

Thank you for the detailed info .

I dislike the plastic under belly pans modern cars come with, they're often damaged or gone missing and no one wants to pay for a replacement .