R-12 alternatives - Page 18 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Matt L · #**256** 06-27-2006, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary F.

Matt L,

Speeding, running stop lights, stop signs, drunk driving kill and injure people., allowing a few ounces of r12 escape into the air has no direct effect on anyone. Most of us cannot afford $3000 for a capture machine, or pay someone $150. to do it for us. Also most of us drive early 80's model MB which are highly polluting to the atmosphere.. The argument being we pollute a lot more driving than letting a few ounces of r-12 or r-134a escape.
I am against using either r-12 and r 134a, or freeze 12. As you can see by an earlier post what r134 does to you., so why use it. The EPA is not going to someone's house to arrest them, they are just bunch of lazy overpaid and under worked beauracrats, they make up this crap to justify there existence.
If you are really worried about the enviroment, then park your MB or buy the newer diesel technology that is less polluting.

I am just against people getting on their soap boxes quoting enviromental laws when they drive cars like we drive. ( By the way I do not speed and have never received a ticket for anything, I have been driving since I was 15 and I am 62 now) People that speed, in my estimation are just immature jerks., who want instant gratification. Damn the torpedos, full speed ahead.

You're correct that the penalties for misusing refridgerants are extremely unlikely to be meted out to someone working in his own garage.

But you are missing my point, in that there are laws that you would follow even if they weren't codified, and laws that are completely inane but have harsh penalties. I'm not attempting to justify the penalties for misusing refridgerants. While we really shouldn't be venting refridgerant, the punishment does not fit the crime. But it wasn't you or me who enacted this insanity. Thank your local automaker, all of which were hoping that the refridgerant trouble would mean a lot more new car sales.

And I do speed. I pretty much always travel at 10mph over the limit on the open road near where I live. Doing so is moving with the traffic. I don't even brake for cops at the side of the road (unless some clueless person ahead of me does), and haven't received a ticket on the highway in well over a decade. If the penalty for speeding were 25 grand, and there was zero tolerance (i.e., no 10mph buffer), I'd drive the speed limit. Along with everyone else.

leathermang · #**257** 06-27-2006, 07:34 PM

"If you are really worried about the enviroment, then park your MB or buy the newer diesel technology that is less polluting." -- Gary F.

False economy. If you figure up the pollution from all the manufacturing required to make that new car you and the environment are way ahead keeping the old one on the road.

84300DT · #**258** 06-28-2006, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leathermang

False economy. If you figure up the pollution from all the manufacturing required to make that new car you and the environment are way ahead keeping the old one on the road.

couldn't agree with you more there greg. there is so much waste these days..

84300DT · #**259** 06-28-2006, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel Giant

Yes if I had a failure with one then I would post it

that's enough of a statement for me.

i'm not opposed to new ideas that work.

no one invented penicillin w/out some trial and error.

we shall keep the discussion going... for now.

leathermang · #**260** 06-28-2006, 11:28 PM

Since he is doing it on other people's cars the question becomes whether or not they , lets say a year out with Black Death of their compressor, would come back and tell him about it ....
I would not.. I would find a new shop because I expect a fixed system to last 5 years before needing any adding of refrigerant ( that due to the designed leak at the compressor shaft for lubrication purposes of that seal ) and ten years before anything else had to be done to it...
But really , after all his slanted promotion of Freeze12 here ... how realistic is it to expect him to come back with a Mea Culpa when compressors give out due to lack of proper oil miscibility or excessive head pressures due to Freeze12 being 80 percent R-134a ?

Brian Carlton · #**261** 06-28-2006, 11:37 PM

The SD has Freeze-12 in it.

I bought it that way.

I've owned the SD for four years. It was converted at some point prior to my purchase.

No black death and no performance issues.

The Freeze-12 performs about the same as the R-134. There is no magic to the stuff.

When the compressor finally goes, I'll convert it back to R-12, hopefully.

leathermang · #**262** 06-28-2006, 11:48 PM

"...no performance issues."
You live in CT !! LOL
Drive it down to the Centerville Texas Get together... that will be a good test.

"The Freeze-12 performs about the same as the R-134."
Since it is 80 percent R-134a that seems very logical .

"There is no magic to the stuff."
Now, if everyone would just admit that....

"When the compressor finally goes, I'll convert it back to R-12, hopefully."

Even simply changing to straight R-134a would take away the problem of finding shops to service it ... and where you live might be perfectly great performance....

Brian Carlton · #**263** 06-29-2006, 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leathermang

"...no performance issues."
You live in CT !! LOL
Drive it down to the Centerville Texas Get together... that will be a good test.

........come on now.......you know damn well that I don't live in CT.

........The Freeze-12 won't survive a Centerville, Texas GTG..........

........but...........neither will the 240D.............

Pete Burton · #**264** 06-29-2006, 12:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Carlton

........but...........neither will the 240D.............

ouch!

Brian Carlton · #**265** 06-29-2006, 12:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Burton

ouch!

Actually, Pete, if you really want to look at it carefully, the SD will keep me at a fairly comfortable 80°F. in the 110° Texas sun, and the 240D will keep Greg at a suffocating 125°F.

So.........I'd say the Freeze-12 is preferable........don't you think??

Pete Burton · #**266** 06-29-2006, 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Carlton

Actually, Pete, if you really want to look at it carefully, the SD will keep me at a fairly comfortable 80°F. in the 110° Texas sun, and the 240D will keep Greg at a suffocating 125°F.

So.........I'd say the Freeze-12 is preferable........don't you think??

Oh, absitively! In fact, I was thinking of sending him a care package of a few small bottles of R290 so he could piece by for a few more years until he gets the R12 in. Living here, it's hard to take A/C seriously. We have central air in the house here and haven't even turned it on yet. After all, it's only June.....

JimmyL · #**267** 06-29-2006, 01:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Carlton

........The Freeze-12 won't survive a Centerville, Texas GTG..........

Well, I hope it will survive there. That is what I will be utilizing........

And you're right, the Freeze12 will be cooler than the 240D..........

R Leo · #**268** 06-29-2006, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyL

Well, I hope it will survive there. That is what I will be utilizing........

And you're right, the Freeze12 will be cooler than the 240D..........

...Sybill, the car of many personalities, has been keeping me cool with R-470.

Four windows and 70mph.

Brian Carlton · #**269** 06-29-2006, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete Burton

Oh, absitively! In fact, I was thinking of sending him a care package of a few small bottles of R290 so he could piece by for a few more years until he gets the R12 in. Living here, it's hard to take A/C seriously. We have central air in the house here and haven't even turned it on yet. After all, it's only June.....

Well, you had better send him that care package otherwise that poor 240 is never going to get a/c..........