Found 81 240D What should I test for? - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

pj67coll · #1 06-09-2003, 09:17 PM

I've located an 81 240D 4 spd stick with 347 000 miles (or possibly 374 000) in Phoenix for 2.5 k at a dealer.

Car's been resprayed and is in physically decent shape though by no means perfect with a few parking lot dings here and their. Only rust is slight under the doors behind the rubber seals. The interior is about right for the age. Couple of dashboard cracks and drivers seat is literally crumbling - horsehair pouring out from the squab. other seats are ok. No apparent water ingress under carpets despite perished (possibly badly replaced) windshiled seals. Manual sunroof. Central locking which works fine and it started right up and shut off immediately. The only thing I noticed was that when I turned the key the glowplug light did not appear to come on. Might not have noticed it though as I was also checking out a/c operation and windows at the time.

Also I noticed the car does not shake nearly as much as the three 300D's I've tested. I only started it and did not drive it as it was rush hour and I'd prefer a more relaxed test drive so might return Saturday morning. So my question to the list members, especially 240D owners past and present would be what to look for on the test. Last time I was in a 240D was age 10 in my uncles car so this will be a fairly new animal for me to test.

Two immediate questions. The shifter knob seemed loose so that it rotated probably thru 45 degrees while being moved. My 84 200 stick did not do so but I've heard people claim that some were made this way.

Also, every few seconds while the motor was idling I heard what sounded like a sharp metallic bang like a hammer striking a metal plate. Is this "nailing"? And what's required to fix it?

- Peter.

ericnguyen · #2 06-10-2003, 12:18 AM

Dear pj67coll:

Forget about that 1981 240D with 374 000 miles for $2,500.

That's too expensive for such a high mileage car.

Eric

Stevo · #3 06-10-2003, 12:45 AM

Peter

I spoz just about every 240d you find could use a little fixing up but 347K is allot of miles unless the car has been well taken care of. What you are hearing is most likely nailing but you should have someone familiar with MBs check it out and NOT the dealer. The best way to access the health of that engine is to see how it starts when COLD. The windshield seal is not a DIY job and could be $200.00. You can rebuild he seat which would be another couple hundred or swap it with the passenger side seat or find replacements at the wrecking yard. The shift knob is screwed together just under the boot and most likely the lock nut has come adrift, easy fix.
They need to fix the glow plugs for sure as they are the new series type which is a good thing. Does it also have manual windows? Anyway point out the expense of fixing the windshield seal and seats for starters. Theres lots of 240D folks here and I,m sure you will get plenty of ideas. As you most likely know the "manual everything" 240D is the easiest car to work on that was ever made but still parts prices add up fast. I would think the car is at least 1K over priced.

MS Fowler · #4 06-10-2003, 02:39 AM

Check very carefully for rust--I know its in Phoenix, but in over 20 years, it could have been anywhere!
I agree that the car sounds overpriced. At that price it ought to be PERFECT; by your description it is not. Use the cost of repairs as negotiating material. Areas to check for rust---Under car--brake and fuel lines, brake cables, jack points, foot wells, inner rocker panels ( under the door sills).
Also check the weatherstrips and welting around the door openings.

300SDog · #5 06-10-2003, 07:55 AM

Dealers always price their cars in orbit.... Fowler is correct that everything you find wrong with the car is bargaining chip for negotiation.

But be warned!!! Dealerships are masters at deception - hiding problems like lying horse thieves.

One idea for test drive might be to arrange $30 appraisal appointment on lift where you can shake suspension components with independent MB mechanic.

Show up with the car on Saturday at mechanic's shop as part of your elicit 1-2 hour unaccompanied test drive. But dont tell the dealer you are doing this!!! Dont even tell the guy you're taking the car for more than an hour.... Keep 'em guessing and even lie about where you've been.

With plenty of complaints (sourced to yourself) following appraisal, you might scoop the car for 1/2 the asking price. Hell, bring $1200 cash and fan the wad of $100 bills in dealer's face and you might cut a deal on the spot....... or torture the dealer by walking away when he counters your offer. You can always call back next week to re-negotiate after the salesman has stewed for awhile.

Time is on your side - its buyers market with economy slow.... Expect the car to sit in dealers lot very long time. Few people will even think about owning 347,000 mile car.

Btw, Stick Shift 240D is big ticket item - incredibly fun to drive - Brisk if you know how to drive them (keeping the gears in range of speedo shift points). Great fun paddling around using the gears...... The 240D offers lots of special effects - always seems to be high reving, pulls like tractor yet rolls along like gigantic flywheel at top speed.

Rick Miley · #6 06-10-2003, 11:03 AM

Lots of good info here, and I think just about everything is covered. One more thing about the seats, though. Time, as much as use, seems to deteriorate these seats. I swapped the driver's and passenger's seats in mine and, after about 4 weeks of use, the "new" driver's seat is almost as bad as the original. There's a pile of horsehair dust in the rear floorboard, and the springs are sagging badly. (I weigh 150 lbs) A new spring box and rubber pad for the bottom only will run about $200 for parts. I haven't even seen the parts for the back, which my seats also need. And new covers are cost prohibitive unless you're doing a concours restoration or planning to drive the car another 200K miles.

There's another bargaining chip for you.

Stevo · #7 06-10-2003, 10:55 PM

I thought they stoped using that horse hair

after 1979, guess not ..huh?
Stevo

leathermang · #8 06-10-2003, 11:59 PM

Rick, that is Chihuahua Hair Dust..... and you KNOW where it came from .....

pj67coll · #9 06-14-2003, 04:19 PM

Thank you to those who took the time to reply to my original query.

I had my first 240D test drive today and was much more impressed than I thought I'd be.

The engine started instantly and shut off instantly too. And the central locking worked quickly and flawlessly. It seems to have a tight vacume system. I was able to keep moving right along in saturday morning traffic without any difficulty. In the end I was even enjoying playing with the manual shifter in traffic. Never thougth I'd say that but it's true!

The only obvious non cosmetic issue I noticed was that it pulled to the right. Though the steering did not seem to have any of the "slop" at center that previous Mercedes I've driven have had. And the AC doesn't blow cold. Compressor comes on but no cold air.

I was surprised at how smooth the engine was. Smoother than the 300D's I've tested both at idle and when driving. And I didn't notice any smoke at all.

The mileage is 347000 and the odometer was working so I think it could be accurate.

There was no hint of any oil leak under where the car was parked. And it was parked in the same place as when I saw it last Monday. Only leak I could find was a slight drip from the radiator every few seconds after the drive. I noticed that the gasket on the radiator cap was deteriorating and that may have had something to do with that. I also dont think the radiator was original. It was a Behr plastic one with what looked like an oil cooler on the side. I assume it's off an automatic as I dont recall my 84 200 stick having a oil cooler on it.

The only discrepancy I noticed was the American style odometer. MPH and an inner ring of KPH in yellow but the temperature/oil pressure guages were in metric. Does anyone know if some cars were so equipped in the US?

The thing rode so well with such a comfortable suspension that I'm tempted to wait a couple of weeks and if it's still there maybe go back and try lowballing the dealer.

Now more than ever I want one of these things as much to learn what makes them work and how to do my own maintenance on them as to drive it.

I was able to get up to 55 mph on one street briefly and that left me wondering if 240D owners need earplugs when they get up to freeway speeds?

- Peter.

Rick Miley · #10 06-14-2003, 08:05 PM

It sounds fantastic. If the compressor is coming on but the air is not cold, you might get lucky with a relatively inexpensive fix. But a currently non-cold AC in Phoenix in June should give you a very good reason to lowball the offer.

In your first post you mentioned nailing, but today you said the engine was smooth. Is the noise gone?

The oil cooler is correct for the car.

The mix of American/metric gauges is also correct for the U.S. model. Most, if not all, of them were that way.

Yes, a set of earplugs would be nice if it weren't illegal. I drive mine every day at 75+.

Still get a prepurchase inspection.

pj67coll · #11 06-14-2003, 08:53 PM

Rick.

What I assume to be nailing was still there on start up. It manifested itself as a single bang every few seconds but I did not notice it again after backing the car out of the parking bay or for the duration of the test. I'm really not sure that it was nailing. I dont actually know what that is as I've never owned a diesel before. Maby I was just hearing an unfamiliar diesel noise.

One thing I forgot to mention was that the oil pressure climbed to max a few seconds after starting and when it reached operating temperature it would idle with the needle directly in the centre of the oil pressure gauge.

As you are diesel driver please anser me this. What does the little switch under the left hand instrument cluster do? When I turned it left and right it had an effect on the idle speed. Is it similar to a choke on a carbureattor car and when is it used?

- Peter.

Rick Miley · #12 06-14-2003, 09:02 PM

Ok, it could be nailing, but that impossible to diagnose from thousands of miles away.

That's where the prepurchase inspection comes in.

You sort of implied, but didn't specifically mention that the oil pressure comes back up to 3 when off idle and warmed up. If so, then the oil pressure readings are exactly right.

That little knob is the idle speed adjustment. Left for faster, right for slower. It is used to speed up the idle when the engine is cold. It works in a completely different manner than a choke, but its end result - better running during warmup - is the same.

pj67coll · #13 06-14-2003, 09:22 PM

Thank's again Rick.

Yes, the oil pressure at idle when warmed up was 1.5 and I think it went straight up to 3 when I stepedon the gas. Although I didn't look at it often while driving. Though given how hard one has to step on the gas in this car to keep up with traffic surely only a really badly smashed motor would ever show anything lower?

It's been about three years since I've owned an MB. The more I think about it the more it brings back good memories.

Next step I think will be to try locate a good indy in Phoenix for a PPI.

- Peter.

Rick Miley · #14 06-14-2003, 09:29 PM

Oh noooooo. Don't let P. E. Haiges catch you saying you stepped on the gas! He'll make you stay after class and write a hundred times on the blackboard: There is no gas in a Diesel. That's an accelerator pedal.

Your homework assignment is to read all the posts in Diesel Discussion for the past month to learn the correct terminology.

pj67coll · #15 06-14-2003, 09:32 PM

Yeah yeah. I guess I slipped up. Actually this car makes me more inclined to use the term "acellerator" than the 300 D's I have tested, where I believe "motion pedal" would be more accurate.

- Peter.