Changing to Synthetic - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Robert W. Roe · #16 12-12-2003, 10:30 PM

I've read that the Mobil 1 0W40 is on the short list of the oils that MB recommends for its latest engines.
That's what I've started using in my 300TE, and short of the oil pressure dropping to zero at idle, it works fine.

CSchmidt · #17 12-12-2003, 10:36 PM

Folks,

I switched about 6 months ago at 245K. I changed the oil after 2k, then again recently (after about 5K). No (new) leaks, consumption the same - about 1 quart / 4000 miles. I'm in mid NC and we have many 20-30* mornings. It seems to start a bit easier. I also do a lot of 80 mph highway driving, it should help there as well.

My main reason for changing was to clean out the engine and I was then going to switch back. I'll probably stay with M1 15-50 and may try the oil analysis routine to see how it is doing around 5K this time.

Chuck

BoostnBenz · #18 12-13-2003, 01:11 AM

I'm glad to hear someone else running that Mobil 1 15w50, I was thinking it might have been the wrong one since everyone seems to use either uses delvac or their dino. Thanks to some forum members who mentioned it I picked some up on sale for $19ea. I bought enough to do 2 changes while the price was down, even $22 is pretty nice. I just don't appreciate paying $32 for 6qts of oil!

Robert W. Roe · #19 12-13-2003, 01:16 AM

I was using the Shell Rotella 5W40 synthetic in the SD, but it's been hard to find at Wal-Mart lately, at least in the gallon jugs.
It had been $12.XX a gallon, but has been like $19.XX at times in the gallon size.
My SD takes almost 8 quarts.

BoostnBenz · #20 12-13-2003, 01:20 AM

Yea I seen that last time I was there, but no rotella on the shelf.

Robert W. Roe · #21 12-13-2003, 01:24 AM

Yeah that too, when they don't have it. I think Autozone might have it, but I might be thinking of plain Rotella. I know they have the Mobil 1 0W-40, which is going to be my winter oil for the gas car, and I'm going to look hard for Rotella synth, because the 5W does help cold starting over the 15W (ok Im comparing Dino 15W to semisynth 5W).

BoostnBenz · #22 12-13-2003, 10:07 AM

Myself, I would not be interested in running a 0w40 especially because the mobil 1 15w50 I spoke of in the last post has a pouring temp of -44* why bother with such a light grade oil then? Yes autozone carries rotella dino, I've never seen the synthetic there.

JimSmith · #23 12-13-2003, 10:40 AM

If you are going to spend nearly $20.00 a gallon for oil, go ahead and use Mobil Delvac 1. I get it for $17.60 plus or minus, from the local MB dealer when I order it as part of their Mobil order. I typically buy 3 cases (12 gallons) at a time.

I used to use Mobil 1 15W-50, which is a very good oil, but the Delvac 1 (5W-40) is noticeably better with regard to starting and removing dirt. I use Delvac 1 in all my cars now, and the first time I put it in the gas cars it turned brown in a thousand miles or so. I recently acquired a "new used" 1986 190E 2.3-16 on eBay. The previous owner had run Mobil 1 15W-50 in it, and had just changed the oil. Upon arriving back home, I immediately checked the valve clearances and found the interior of the engine pretty clean, but not without a layer of brownish stuff in areas of little flow on the top of the head. The exhaust valves were a little tight, nothing really bad, so I put the valve cover back on, changed the oil to Delvac 1 and drove it for a few thousand miles. When I adjusted the valves, which is a bit of an ordeal - you have to measure clearances, remove the camshaft, a bucket and a shim, measure the shim, buy a new shim of the right thickness and reassemble for each valve, then reinstall the camshaft - the few thousand miles on Delvac 1 had made a world of difference. All shiny metal, next to no deposits, although the oil itself was not honey colored anymore, it was more of a brown color.

Anyway, once you convince yourself to buy oil in this price range, I have never seen anything as good as Delvac 1. Although it is not specifically endorsed by MB, my local dealer offers it as a premium oil when customers have their oil changed in the shop.

Good luck, Jim

#24 12-13-2003, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Is Mobil1 15w-50 a good choice, have some starting problems in the morning, runs a little rough for 6 seconds?

Changing to Mobil 1 oil would be VERY desirable but will do NOTHING about the engine running roughly!

Running roughly for 5-10 secs following a cold start is UNRELATED to oil! If you allow the glow plugs to glow for another 10+ seconds AFTER the dash light extinguishes, and then start the engine, the "roughness" might be mitigated or even eliminated if the problem is related to inadequate glow plug function. It MIGHT also be related to the valves needing adjustemnt (if you have an OM61x or older engine - valve adjustment is required evbery 15kmi).

Marshall

#25 12-13-2003, 01:11 PM

The problem with Mobil 1 15W-50 is that it is API CF rated oil. It's ancient. Find a CH-4 or the latest CI-4 for the best protection for you diesel engine. Manufacturers made substantial improvements in formulating CI-4. Specifically, high/low temp deposits, oxidation resistance, and the ability to suspend higher levels of soot. Using CI-4 is a improvement above and beyond switching from conventional to synthetic.

#26 12-13-2003, 03:01 PM

Mr. Booth,

CI-4 oils doing very well in older MB diesels.
http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=26;t=000046#000000

Marshall Booth said:
"The CI standard has not yet been endorsed by some manufacturers to be suitable for older engines."

This won't be the first or last time manufacturers don't recomend a better lubricant.

Marshall Booth said:
"Mercedes specifically approves SOME CF rated oil for their diesels but cautions against choosing oil based on the API or even the ACEA ratings and suggests using the Mercedes 228.x for older diesels and the 229.x ratings for either older or newer diesels when selecting an oil."

Mobil's Delvac 1300 Super CI-4 does satisfy MB 228.3
http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/NAUSE2CVLMOMobilDelvac1300Super.asp

Chevron's Delo 400 CI-4 also satisfies MB 228.3
http://library.cbest.chevron.com/lubes/compprd9.nsf/0/354b782d14879c3d88256dd60066c76a/$FILE/HDMO-30.pdf

Marshall Booth said:
"While it MAY be argued that CG/CH/CI oils are superior (and I'm sure they are for some purposes - but they were NOT formulated for light duty diesel service), they have properties that are not required or even benificial for some Mercedes engines and they MAY have properties that are undesirable. "

I would like to know what "undesirable properties" the CI-4 oils MAY have.

I would also like to know how CI-4 oils are meeting MB's 228.3 spec with these "undesireable properties".

#27 12-13-2003, 03:04 PM

somehow my post jumped ahead of yours.

#28 12-13-2003, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Manufacturers made substantial improvements in formulating CI-4

The problem with the API CI-4 standard is that there are several "improvements" that MAY compromise older engines. The API stadard contained a LOT of input from the EPA and much of that had to do with trapping and holding particulate. It has been suggested that such action seriously degrades the lubricating properties of the oil. I have NO position on those issues (I don't know enough to comment). The CI standard has not yet been endorsed by some manufacturers to be suitable for older engines. Nissan invalidates the warraty on it's 3 liter turbodiesel engine if CG-4 or higher rated oil is used (they require no higher than CF rated oil).
Mercedes specifically approves SOME CF rated oil for their diesels but cautions against choosing oil based on the API or even the ACEA ratings and suggests using the Mercedes 228.x for older diesels and the 229.x ratings for either older or newer diesels when selecting an oil.

While it MAY be argued that CG/CH/CI oils are superior (and I'm sure they are for some purposes - but they were NOT formulated for light duty diesel service), they have properties that are not required or even benificial for some Mercedes engines and they MAY have properties that are undesirable. The CF rated oils included in the Mercedes list (see below) DO have precisely the qualities that Mercedes considers critcal.

I recommend choosing oil based on the list that Mercedes provides: http://www.whnet.com/4x4/oil.html

At least you know that the oils approved on that list have been tested and meet the standards that Mercedes set for the engine(s).

Marshall

gsxr · #29 12-13-2003, 04:20 PM

The 0W-40 is recommended by MB strictly for fuel conservation. For older diesels, I don't recommend it. At least one person who does oil analysis regulalry noticed significantly increased wear metals while running 0W-40, which dropped down to normal when he switched back to 15W-50 or Delvac-1.

Also, I said it before, I'll say it again - don't buy Rotella "Synthetic". It's not synthetic. And it's a poor value unless you get it nearly free. Use the Mobil-1 15W-50 or Delvac-1. I wouldn't worry too much about Cx ratings, as long as it HAS a "Cx" rating, that's the most important part!

#30 12-13-2003, 07:21 PM

All of Mobil's automotive oils are API CF rated except for the conventional Drive Clean line. Doesn't mean you want to use them. CF specs offer very minimal protection from deposits, soot thickening, and TBN depletion. There are much better choices out there.

gsxr said:
" At least one person who does oil analysis regulalry noticed significantly increased wear metals while running 0W-40, which dropped down to normal when he switched back to 15W-50 or Delvac-1."

Mobil's 0W-40 is a little on the thin side for older MB diesels.

Viscosity at 100 degrees celsius:
Mobil 1 0W-40---14.3 cSt
Delvac 1 5W-40---14.8 cSt
Delvac 1300 15W-40---15.5 cSt
Mobil 1 15W50---17.4 cSt

The 0W-40 also has a healthy dose of viscosity improvers that can shear down. When this happens you will be essentially running a 30 weight. Not good.