430 hp OM602 videos
 

Hello everyone,

I was in the TDIclub chat room earlier today, and a guy from Finland and I were talking about Benzes. He mentioned that there is a small group of people in Finland who are tuning up their OM602 & OM603 engines to the extreme.

He mentioned that this particular 190D (as I have been corrected) has close to 430 hp on the dyno. :eek:

Happy viewing!

http://www.kolumbus.fi/sallatoimi/mersukiihytys.mpg
http://www.kolumbus.fi/sallatoimi/mersukiihytys1.mpg
http://www.kolumbus.fi/sallatoimi/mersukiihytys2.mpg
http://www.kolumbus.fi/sallatoimi/mersukiihytys3.mpg
http://www.kolumbus.fi/sallatoimi/mersukiihytys4.mpg

YES YES YES!!!! I am NOT the only one out there. I can do 60 mph in 7.6 seconds right now at least! Time to blow those CDI's out of the water, right now!

Forget it. Time to take on the E55 Kompressor.

Isn't that bad for the engine, though?:rolleyes:

BTW, that looks like a 190D, not a 300TD. Just a 2.5 5-cylinder turbo, unless they somehow shoved the six 3.0 in there.

So erm... just WHAT did they do to these engines??? :eek: :eek: :eek:

I'll have to get more information from the guy who gave me the links. He said for sure that it was a 3.0 turbo. Maybe it was a 300D, and he added the "T" for turbo instead of touring. I dunno.

I'd be happy with 200 hp :cool: ... but 400?? :eek: I love it!

The reason I say a 190 is because of the position of the instrument cluster. It has a rear defroster horizontally placed next to it, and a smaller center console with 190 vents. But I don't know, maybe I need to look into ocular nutrition supplements, lol. Regardless, it does not look like any W124 I've seen.

This is great Vdub. I think you should post this on your site. A lot of the members would gawk at that material.

These videos are to show all you guys thinking that old diesels are "not capable of any more power than you already have". Its possible, it has been done, and there's proof to back it up. Don't know how long the engines will last, but it's possible.;)

LOL. That they would.

Anyway, the instrument cluster & switch position does look like my 190... perhaps it is. I haven't looked inside a w124 recently.

W124
http://i18.ebayimg.com/01/i/01/84/9f/97_1_s.JPG



W201
http://images.andale.com/f2/102/107/...4_DSC00204.JPG

There ya go then. :) ... time to edit the thread title.

What is the deal with them hitting 6k+ RPM between shifts? Is it a bad auto trans or do they suck at shifting? I'd love to know what they did to these engines too.

It looks like they lost traction for a second or two. The boost really pounds in at higher revs it seems.

I'm picturing, in my mind. A 190D 2.2 diesel with that engine setup under the hood. Racing an E55 Kompressor and winning. That's just sick. I rewatched that S55 Kompressor video I have of it accelerating to 113 mph, and I thought;"what a slow car".:eek::eek:

THAT IS AMAZING!!! I can't believe how quickly those kms/hr were rising. Just like a diesel - lots of low rpm torque and evened out in the mid-range.

It sure would be great to learn a little more about how they managed to do that. I am imagining bigger turbo/s, intercooler, intake and exhaust, IP timing etc... Might be a dog to drive around town...

Definitely a 190.

Those shifts sounded and look pretty violent. I don't think an average 722.xx will last long like that. With that kind of hp out of a 603, I would have to find a rare 5sp.

It's a stick shift, and I think it's a combination of rediculous wheel spin, and some clutch slip.

It definitely has a huge turbo on it. Listen to it in clip ...1.mpeg ... also, boost doesn't really hit until 4000 rpms.

A Getrag racing dog-leg 5-speed out of a 190-16V would do just fine..

..I need more information, I want to build a beast like this.

turbodiesel,

You buy the parts...I'll help you put it together!! - In exchange for some joy riding of course.

Philly is not that far from North Jersey!!

How has the Euro been running for you?

I'll try and find more information. I'm curious myself.

Sounds like a plan. Euro is running great!! I love it.

It looks like he's got twin turbos. One of them is running 17 psi, and the other is about 11 - 12 psi(from what I can make out).

UGH!

I want.

I want more info.

hummmmmm, 400 hp diesel wagon. :eek: YEEEHHHHAAAAAAAAA Damnit!




When do you figure you might be able to scare up more info?



Joe

I hope that I'll be able to chat with him tomorrow or Wednesday. Really looking forward to it! :cool:

That is most likely a 602 engine in the 190D. I don't think there is physically room for a 603 with adequate cooling but I could be wrong. Intercooling would be a requirement for big power. I don't believe they are making anywhere near 430 SAE HP. Maybe torque, but not HP. No way. Show me the dyno sheet and a video of the car + engine on the dyno.

On a side note, what is UP with those videos? Can't they get a clean video of a nice 0-200kmh run? Looks like they were just screwing around or somthing - I don't get it.

I do want to know more about the engines, and what they did, etc... you can turn the IP governor max RPM up to let the engine rev to 5500-6000, but there's no point unless the engine is making power up there. The stock setup tapers off above ~4500 or so and there's little to be gained by revving beyond ~5000. I'm not sure you can move the powerband higher up with the stock camshaft...???

:confused: :confused:

Great. So what make, year, model do you have, and what specific engine modifications did you do to get 0-60mph in 7.6 seconds?

Wow those vids are sweet. When he was getting those real bad flares the dude says something... sounds like "baby" or "maybe" mostlikely not english I presume. Engine life dramatically cut short?

God that's sweet though.

Didn't you say this guy was in Finland? Maybe those acceleration runs were done on ice. :o

I'm not sure you can get any diesel to make real power over 5000 RPM. Somewhere I picked up the impression that 5K is a more-or-less fundamental limitation of diesel cycle internal combustion powerplants. Something about the speed of the flame front inside the cylinder - the fuel just doesn't burn fast enough. At higher RPMs there isn't time for the fuel to burn before the piston reaches bottom dead center.

Unlike gasoline engines we didn't see diesel redlines and/or powerbands move upward during the shift from OHV to SOHC to DOHC. Even the twin cam, 24 valve six in the E300 redlines at the customary ~5100 RPM. And as Rick recently demonstrated, it shifts itself at about 4600 RPM.

- JimY

Diesel combustion actually starts "chasing" the piston after 3800 rpms, but you can still make power... just not as much as you would make below 3800 rpms.

I tried to edit the thread title when I found out that it was an OM602 engine (190D 2.5 Turbo), but I guess it didn't work. I'll try again.

I haven't seen the guy recently. I was out of town yesterday and didn't have a chance to get online... but I'll keep checking.

Yes, the guys are located in Finland... don't know about the ice runs ;).

Yes, the videos are kind of shotty, but they give you an idea of the stupendous amount of power that they've been able to get out of the engine.

As for the transmission flaring... it is a manual transmission... no flaring there, only clutch slip and/or wheel spin.

So the question is, what can a 3.0 liter six do? Or even maybe a certain 3.5 six??:p

How about a 3.0 liter five? If these engines are stock under 200hp, how long do they last at 430hp?

Only 150k-200k maybe?:D

Someone did that (many years ago) and posted details on the MBZ.org DieselTech list. The short version is, the engine lasted just fine, but it required insane modifications, and the cost was ludicrous (mostly shop time - a few hundred hours, IIRC). Tons of custom head porting, etc etc. He basically said that while it was an interesting project he'd NEVER do it again. I also think it ain't worth it, especially on the 617 engine. I'm more interested in mild mods on the 603... Mosselman claims 20% hp gain and 25% tq gain with an intercooler alone, which would make me pretty happy (175hp, 250tq) and the engine should be as reliable and long-lived as stock. Pushing beyond 200hp is asking for short engine life, which is not cost efficient, IMO...

:)

hi guys for some reason i think they are running propane injection ,for those of you that don't know propane for diesel engines is like nitrous for gas engines ?????????:)

I guess you can run nitrous in diesels to. Trucks did it, it's a show on TNN. I wish you could tune MB diesels like you can a Cummins.

Yeah, I guess MB's are maxxed out already(seems to be the universal opinion on this board).

Mercedes only built the engines to be able to withstand their standard rated bhp and no more or else you risk catastrophic failure.

Short engine life in a MB diesel is 300K miles.

That was always my opinion, so what if you cut the operational life span in HALF, you still have an engine that will outlast most of them..

The fact remains that the few people who actually have hot-rodded their MB diesels, have done an excrutiatingly poor job of documenting the modifications, and/or tangible power gains. I'm all for it but SHOW ME THE NUMBERS ALREADY.

:rolleyes:

Propane is a fuel. Adding propane is like adding more diesel. Nitrous allows more fuel to be burned in the cylinder. Adding nitrous will allow you to burn more fuel if you already have an overly rich mixture.

I know of a few VW TDI owners who run nitrous to balance the excessive amount of fuel that some chips demand. The nitrous reduces exhaust smoke and increases power because more fuel is being burned efficiently. Adding propane to a chipped TDI would make for a serious soot machine. :eek:

Our MB engines are at the limit because they are not intercooled. You can still turn them up a bit, but not by a significant amount, and not without shortening the life of the engine.

GSXR where can I find out about the cam kits and intercooler kits for a 603? I was thinking about having a little fun with my car, nothing crazy maybe just lowering it 1/2in to1in and a more free flowing exhaust. But a little more power is always nice.:D

Go here for Mosselmann products.

Go to intercoolers.

You should see the 603 listed(124 300D).

Hatterasguy, there are no cam kits for the 603, or any MB diesel, that I know of. Mosselman makes an intercooler kit however it was designed for the Euro 603, which has different turbo plumbing. It could work if a different adapter was made - I called and talked to Willy Mosselman about this last year. We'd need a few people interested in the kit for him to make the USA adapter, though. Everyone is scared away by the cost - nearly $2000 USD, with the current lousy exchange rates. I want to get this kit someday though! Photos of the Euro 603 are here, so you can see the difference (note there is no EGR mixer housing) :

http://www.meimann.com/images/mercedes/OM603_intake/

I also want to remove the catalyst and replace it with a straight pipe (that's cheap), and see if there are any power gains to be had there. I doubt you can get lowering springs for your SDL but you can cut a 1/4 or 1/2 coil, and use different pads to drop it a little bit. I wouldn't get crazy with lowering though...!

:p

H&R makes W126 lowering kits, their about $400.
$2000! my god:eek: Tell me when it gets to below $1k!

Lowering an SDL
 

I wouldn't cut the springs on the SDL. The ride is already squishy enough. It needs stiffer springs that are progressive rate and only lower it a little bit.

Everyone will find this interesting... from Eibach's website.

MERCEDES, 300SD/380SEC/380SEL, W126 - 1987
(Exc. S/Lev.)
Product -- Front -- Rear -- Comments -- Part Number
PRO-KIT -- 1.3 in -- 1.3 in -- Ride heights may be adjusted through Mercedes Pad System. Please consult your authorized Mercedes Dealer if add'l ride height adjustment is needed. -- 2507.140

It doesn't mention the SDL, but it is possible to inquire with their online tech staff.

From H&R's website:
Stage Chassis / Drivetrain Notes Approx. Front Lowering Approx. Rear Lowering Part Number Sug. Retail Photo
Sport Spring W126 6cyl, V8 w/o self-leveling 8 1.4 1.4 29559 $ 410.00 Kit
Sport Spring W126 6cyl, V8 w/self-leveling 8 1.4 1.2 52759 $ 410.00 Kit

This is what I was thinking about.

The second one might be nice, where it lowers the front .2" more than the back. $410 for the kit isn't a bad price either.

I was thinking about one of them, H&R seems to make a good product.

http://mersuforum.net/
 

Hi! This is Finnish MB-Forum.

Select->Projektit->Liukasta?

There is some photos and videos about Super-turbo`s...:)

Hi Vankari.

Since no one here can read finns it
would be nice to get a parts brake down
of all the modifications made.

I'm sure alot of people here would really
appreciate this.
I know I would.

Thank you.

Louis.

Hello again!

Modifications in these car are

-Bigger turbo (Intake 56mm. exhaust 60mm. Scania 9 Litre engine!)
-Some modification in diesel pump.
-Bigger intercooler.
-3" exhaust pipe.
-Diesel injectors are normal.
-exhaust manifold is home made.
-boost pressure 1,5 bar.

These modification give about 350 bhp.

There is English forum, so you can register your self and ask more. Many Finnish spoke English so you can have ansver your mother tongue.

My English is not so good...

Have you considered the JY intercooler option? There are quite a few people who will take intercoolers from other cars, the Talon/Eclipse ones are popular, put two or three of them together with custom tanks and bingo, intercooler for 1/3-1/2 the price. There are places like Jegs and Summit that will sell you all the tubing that you need to plumb it. There are quite a few people in Turbomustang.com that do this, and have done this. My guess is that you could do an intercooler with all the piping for under a grand.

I think it could be done, but to date, nobody has done this on a OM60x in the USA. At least none I have ever seen or heard of anywhere on the internet...

:(