W124 F/R camber help - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

sjsfiji · #1 06-05-2003, 03:54 PM

Hi All,

I've just finished ready all the posts regarding camber correction. I had my car aligned a few months back and the FRONTS are off by 1.5 deg (NEG) camber. The REARS are too of course.

It appear a lot of people have used Delsing, RennTech, and KMACs for the rears. I like DIY things and hate to drill new holes in the under carriage... Which is best and cost effective?

The FRONTS adjustments, however, are max'd out. Are there camber kits for these too?

thanks,

sjsfiji

mbdoc · #2 06-05-2003, 05:08 PM

The front end can run -1.2 to -1.5deg w/o too much tire wear. Does your car have more -camber than that?? If so you might consider raising the front back up a little bit.
Of course the same goes for the rear -1.5 to -2.0deg.
The k-mac cams are the best way to correct the rear.

sjsfiji · #3 06-05-2003, 08:14 PM

MBDoc,

Thanks, I'll check the settings from the printout. Any thoughts on toe settings?

Thanks,

sjsfiji

mbdoc · #4 06-06-2003, 08:00 AM

Toe-in both front & back should be around 2-3mm OR .25 to.4deg

sjsfiji · #5 06-06-2003, 11:23 AM

MBDoc,

Here are my current settings as per the printout...

LF camber -.9 deg
RF camber -1.5
LR camber -2.5
RR cabmer -2.6

With these settings, are my tires going to wear at a reasonable rate? I'd rather not spend the $$$ on the K-macs 'cause its pretty expensive... What are your thoughts????

ksing44 · #6 06-08-2003, 06:04 AM

Based on the printout from my mechanic, the minimum front camber is listed as –1.33 degrees for a "sport suspension". The rear is not specified, I suppose because it isn’t adjustable from the factory. I thought the front was already adjustable and I know that the K-MAC eccentric rear bushings will definitely fix the rear. My car was –2.7 and –2.9 in the rear before I installed the K-MAC bushings, but now it is adjusted to –1.2 and –1.3 degrees. My front camber is –1.2 and –1.1 degrees. I also asked the mechanic to use the minimum for toe of 0.08 degrees, because I always wore the outside edge of the front tires. Now with the negative camber adjusted to within specifications and the toe adjusted to 0.08, my tires seem to ware in an exactly even manner. I am pleased with my current adjustments.

I think you should get the K-MAC bushings in the rear, or raise the car a bit with thicker spring pads to get rid of that excessive negative camber. You can check the "bumps" on the pads. See if they are 1-bump at all four corners. You could add a bump in thickness, which might fix the slightly over negative front camber and then get the K-MAC bushings for the rear. Some guys go ahead with the very high negative camber, but more negative than –2.0 has to be too much camber. Is your car really low? Maybe someone cut the front springs, because the drop in the rear is often more than the front when you install aftermarket springs. Some guys cut the springs to get it really low in front. Maybe you are just too low.

In terms of $$$, yes it may cost some money to get it right, but with only 52K on that 87 W124 it would be worth it to get it just right. You have a real collector’s car with many years of enjoyment to follow. If I were you, I would do whatever it takes to get it perfect. I think you will be thrilled with the car.
:p

need2speed · #7 06-09-2003, 12:40 PM

FWIW, tire manufacturers are also a source of info on acceptable camber settings. For example, Michelin recommends -1 to -3 degrees negative camber with Pilot Sport tires for optimal handling, according to a Michelin technical bulletin posted by TireRack. Yes, wear will be greater than with less negative camber BUT it depends what you are going for....

BTW, Michelin also provides tire inflation recommendations that differ from Mercedes.

sjsfiji · #8 06-09-2003, 03:59 PM

ksing44,

I'm sure the springs were not cut, and I checked the pads at front and back and they are the highest. I think that's 3 for the rear and 4 for the front. I'm thinking the guy who aligned it just does know how to do it properly. Are the left and right front camber settings separate, or are they somewhat connected??? Anyway, I'm going to bring the car to an alignment specialist here in the bay area and try to get at least the fronts adjust properly. I'll also recheck the pad in the front and rear.

Do you know what the maximum spring bump pads are for the front and rear?

thanks,

ksing44 · #9 06-10-2003, 05:39 AM

I was told that the pads can be from 1-bump to 4-bump. Most guys use the smallest pads possible when they get the lowering springs, so considering that you have 3-bump and 4-bump pads, your springs may be pretty aggressive in terms of the amount of drop. I had to use the 3-bump in the rear with 1-bump in the front to get the car level. The rear dropped more than the front when I installed the Eibach springs. The Eibach Pro-Kit springs are kind of conservative, in terms of stiffness and the amount of drop.

I’m sorry, but I don’t know for sure if the front camber is adjustable on each side, but I would think it would be. The K-MAC bushings in the rear are adjustable from both sides, but I am not sure how the adjustment works in the front. Certainly a good alignment guy will know what to do. These are 4 wheel alignments, so I guess it is more complicated than a "typical" vehicle. Good luck.

sjsfiji · #10 06-11-2003, 10:41 PM

ksing44,

Do you have pics of how your car looks lowered? Also, did you alignment guy have any probs adjusting your front camber settings? What are your settings if you don't mind....

I ask since I might want to go Eibachs too....

thanks,

ksing44 · #11 06-12-2003, 07:21 AM

Sorry, but I don’t have any digital pictures. A couple of friends at work have offered to take a few pictures with their cameras, so one of these days I’ll get some pictures to show everyone my car. I really would like showing it off. I think the 1995s are very nice looking automobiles. My car has about a 1-inch gap between the fender and the tires and when the car is sitting on my very flat garage floor the middle of the fender is between 25.25 and 25.5 inches from the floor at all four corners. It was between 26.25 and 26.5 inches from the floor before I installed Eibach springs and the Bilstein HD shocks. I have 3-bump rear pads and 1-bump front pads. I think I would like the look if it was even lower, but then I suppose I would have some issues with bottoming out on speed bumps. I already have to be a little careful. How much of a gap do you have between your fender and tires? Have you ever measured from the floor to the lip of the fenders?

Take a look at pictures from "The Doctor". His car is very low and it still looks very good.
http://forums.mbworld.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=37773&perpage=10&pagenumber=5
It is so beautiful that I am sure it is not what some people would call "ghetto", even though I guess it is "slammed". My car is definitely higher by at least an 1 inch or maybe two, but his car looks to be the later body style like mine. He also has all the modifications that everyone seems to want. He has AMG "like" wheels, lowering springs, sport shocks, chrome exhaust, clear corners, avantguarde/S600-style grille, and window tint. I tried to get the new grille, but it turned into a nightmare when I ordered it from Mercantile Europarts so I gave up.

From my earlier post above:
"My car was –2.7 and –2.9 in the rear before I installed the K-MAC bushings, but now it is adjusted to –1.2 and –1.3 degrees. My front camber is –1.2 and –1.1 degrees. I also asked the mechanic to use the minimum for toe of 0.08 degrees, because I always wore the outside edge of the front tires."

Here is a post with some information about alignment specifications.
Alignment before new tires?
I notice that the specifications for front camber are different in the printout in the post, but they selected "without sport suspension" and I went with the "sport suspension" set-up. The specification range for front camber in a sport suspension is Min –1.33, Nominal –1.0, and Max –0.83. As I said before, the rear camber is not specified. I suppose because it is not adjustable from the factory. I don’t like Benzwood’s numbers, because there is too much difference in camber between the left and right side of the car. I think his car should be more symmetrically aligned.