Talk me into (or out of) this car...[R107 500SL]

[Diseasel300]

The subject car in this thread is a 1983 500SL that my father bought in 1998 and has been in the family since. I've had a love-hate relationship with this car since Day One and things sort of came to a head this past weekend. I have some thoughts and I'm having a hard time deciding which is the best way to go so I thought I'd share here and seek feedback.

My father is the 3rd owner of this car. It's lived in Texas it's entire life and been garage-kept throughout. Original paint, original interior, zero rust, no accidents, etc. 116K on the clock. Hard top present, still has the Euro bumpers and trim, somehow made it into the country without being emissions-converted so it still has the Euro exhaust setup, still has all the switches and tags labeled in German (US speedo tho).

Unfortunately that's kind of where the good things stop. My father's idea of "preservation" is to just let things sit. As a result, this car has done a LOT of that in its life. We're talking <4000 miles driven since 2002. As a result there's lots of leaks, lots of suspension issues that need to be addressed, and the biggest issue: Am engine mount arm with the bolts sheared off in the block.

The sheared off engine mount arm bolts is the latest issue and it's causing some problems. It was found when I finally got him convinced to change the engine mounts to fix a "sag" towards the passenger side. The driver's side engine mount bolt came right out, the passenger side was grossly misaligned. I had a buddy help rock the engine while we jacked it up to get the bolt out......then the engine mount arm dropped off...... It wasn't a bad engine mount, it was all four bolts sheared off in the block, we only found 1 of them, so they've been gone for a LONG time.

There is ZERO access, so I suspect the engine needs to come out to fix this issue properly (unless someone's encountered this before and has suggestions).

I suggested to my dad to take the opportunity to fix the leaking input shaft seal on the transmission, fix the engine oil leaks, fix the multitude of vacuum leaks on the intake manifold, and rebuild or replace the A/C compressor.

I told him I have no real interest in fixing the car for him. He hasn't driven it in 15 years and it just sits. Usually with something inexpensive keeping it there. I just got finished rebuilding a frozen brake caliper that's kept it parked since February 2019. A $14 seal kit kept the car parked...let that sink in. My biggest fear would be taking the car apart and finding something else that needs fixing, then having the car sit all disassembled waiting for him to decide to pony up (I don't put my own money in someone else's car). It's happened before, so there's precedent for this exact situation happening. In 2008, the brake booster vacuum line broke (probably when the engine mount bolts broke). That car sat in the same spot until he decided to fix it in 2015. I suggested way back in 2008 that the engine mounts needed to be checked and probably replaced. Ignored. So here we are...

At this point, he's looking at several thousand dollars to have a shop do the work, and he's still going to be left with a car that needs suspension work, upholstery work, body seal work, and he still won't drive it.

He's now considering trying to sell the car as-is and just get it gone since he never drives it.

I've had thoughts of trying to get him to sign the title over to me and fix the car up properly, then drive it like it should be driven. I'm on the fence whether I want to take on the financial burden and PITA burden of fixing this car when I already have my own "fun" cars (E34 and W126). The SL just doesn't make me smile like the E34 and W126 do and I'm not sure if it's the car or the negative emotional connection I have with it due to the long-term frustrating repair and maintenance situation.

I went to prom in this car. I had my first date in this car. It's been in a couple of homecoming parades. It's an uncommon and unmolested car that I suspect will climb in value in the coming decades. I feel like if I let this car out of my life, I'll regret it when I'm old enough to properly enjoy it.

So here we are. I'm stuck whether I want to try to take ownership of the car and fix it, or let him sell it off. Or worse.....let him find some half-assed shop that isn't familiar with Euro cars try to do some jack-leg repair on it and ruin the car.

I appreciate any feedback. Positive or negative.

[BWhitmore]

Ask your father to sign the car over to you and fix it properly. It sounds like you have a lot of good memories associated with this car and would enjoy driving it.

[t walgamuth]

Originally Posted by BWhitmore

Ask your father to sign the car over to you and fix it properly. It sounds like you have a lot of good memories associated with this car and would enjoy driving it.

Agreed.

or sell it off. It looks worth saving for sure.

[mkahmed]

If your budget allows, keep it. Once it's yours you are in control of the repairs and will undoubtedly recoup the enjoyment for years to come.

[Diseasel300]

We had a pretty lengthy discussion about the car this evening and he's pretty adamant that the car is just going to sit for the foreseeable future. He doesn't want to pay someone to fix it, he doesn't want to work on it himself, he doesn't want me working on it, he doesn't want to sell it, and he doesn't have any plans to drive it. It's his car, he can do with it as he wishes.

Whatever. I dusted my hands of it and walked away. Some battles just aren't worth fighting.

[RobertinMN]

Originally Posted by Diseasel300

I went to prom in this car. I had my first date in this car. It's been in a couple of homecoming parades. It's an uncommon and unmolested car that I suspect will climb in value in the coming decades. I feel like if I let this car out of my life, I'll regret it when I'm old enough to properly enjoy it.

So here we are. I'm stuck whether I want to try to take ownership of the car and fix it, or let him sell it off. Or worse.....let him find some half-assed shop that isn't familiar with Euro cars try to do some jack-leg repair on it and ruin the car.

I appreciate any feedback. Positive or negative.

Fathers and ex wives......

You have some fond and fun memories with this car--don't let an aging father who may be concerned about money be your guide. You are correct that someday it will fetch a lot of money and it already would in Europe.

Now, be aware that you will have to pull the engine and tranny (together is easiest) and do the job right. Lots of people will tell you to just not--but, as everyone scraps older engines and drops in new uesed ones, there are fewer and fewer around. You are fortunate that it has Euro exhaust and lot more power because of it. There are mods you can do to it to make even more powerful.

Pulling the engine and tranny allows you the luxury of replacing all of the seals on both which are shot by now from age if nothing else. It allows you to refurbish the heads which likely need it and do the timing chain correctly replacing all of the guides at once and the crankshaft sprocket. You can get the broken bolts out of the engine without too much difficulty and the bolts are peanuts compared to the other stuff.

It was your dad's, your first date, prom--maybe more. Not everyone can say that and maybe you can give it to your son someday. I wish I still had my '69 Pontiac to give to a son or my '86 Porsche. But I don't. At the time, I just thought if I really wanted one again, I could always buy another one. Life doesn't work that way.

If it's any further consolation, the '86 560SL I restored and shipped to my daughter some 8 years ago now is living a fine and well appreciated life in Baltimore where local mechanics love it, her knowledge of it and the care with which it was restored.

[Diseasel300]

To close out this thread and answer the question of what happened to the car, we finally came to an agreement earlier this year and the car now belongs to me (which was a whole story in itself transferring a vintage title with a Euro-format VIN).

I fixed the sheared engine mounting arm when I dropped the front subframe out to rebuild it. Gave me direct access to extract the broken bolts and R&R everything that was needed. Front subframe rebuild tightened up the steering and handling by a truly shocking amount (no more 10-2 slop in the steering!), and I even rebuilt the A/C system that hasn't worked since 1998 and it blows frosty cold.

I've put close to 3000 miles on the car this year, including a trip to Houston and back with zero issues. That's more miles put on the car in less than one year than it had put on between 2004 and 2022. The car also made it to the Centerville GTG in October, which was probably the first car show that car has ever been in.

[tubegeek]

Happy ending to a family saga - glad it worked out.

[cmac2012]

Originally Posted by Diseasel300

To close out this thread and answer the question of what happened to the car, we finally came to an agreement earlier this year and the car now belongs to me (which was a whole story in itself transferring a vintage title with a Euro-format VIN).

I fixed the sheared engine mounting arm when I dropped the front subframe out to rebuild it. Gave me direct access to extract the broken bolts and R&R everything that was needed. Front subframe rebuild tightened up the steering and handling by a truly shocking amount (no more 10-2 slop in the steering!), and I even rebuilt the A/C system that hasn't worked since 1998 and it blows frosty cold.

I've put close to 3000 miles on the car this year, including a trip to Houston and back with zero issues. That's more miles put on the car in less than one year than it had put on between 2004 and 2022. The car also made it to the Centerville GTG in October, which was probably the first car show that car has ever been in.

I’ll be damned. You’re still with us, at least of last November. When you quit posting in 2021 I was afraid you had shuffled off from this mortal coil.

No one else here knows the SDL like you do.

[Diseasel300]

Originally Posted by cmac2012

I’ll be damned. You’re still with us, at least of last November. When you quit posting in 2021 I was afraid you had shuffled off from this mortal coil.

No one else here knows the SDL like you do.

I got tired of arguing with people that don't know anything or repeat false information. I'm still active with W126es and Mercedes, just not this forum. Just this week I finished rebuilding a 350SD that blew a head gasket then suffered a camshaft failure. Another 300SDL coming my way for resurrection soon too, but I won't be posting here about it. Nobody cares.

[fonzi]

Originally Posted by Diseasel300

I got tired of arguing with people that don't know anything or repeat false information. I'm still active with W126es and Mercedes, just not this forum. Just this week I finished rebuilding a 350SD that blew a head gasket then suffered a camshaft failure. Another 300SDL coming my way for resurrection soon too, but I won't be posting here about it. Nobody cares.

I like to document my repairs and multiple projects just because it helps me keep track of where I am on lots of slow-progressing projects. Sometimes I document the research I’ve done and where my head is/was at the time. It often saves me from doing the research twice. Sometimes people see value in the threads, but I don’t really care too much about that. Sure, I’m glad to hear it helped someone else, but generally I’m doing most of it for selfish reasons. And when I sell a car, it’s basically all documented.

[Diseasel300]

Originally Posted by fonzi

I like to document my repairs and multiple projects just because it helps me keep track of where I am on lots of slow-progressing projects. Sometimes I document the research I’ve done and where my head is/was at the time. It often saves me from doing the research twice. Sometimes people see value in the threads, but I don’t really care too much about that. Sure, I’m glad to hear it helped someone else, but generally I’m doing most of it for selfish reasons. And when I sell a car, it’s basically all documented.

Oh, I do that too. I just keep a written log with my cars and a big folder of receipts and invoices for parts and work I have done. The 560SEL I brought back from death and then sold last years was a perfect example. The PO had a log they'd kept from 2006, and I filled it in and documented the pile of work I did to it.

I also take little clips and short videos when I do something important or educative and share with friends I've made elsewhere and on this forum and still keep in touch with. There's just a handful of people here I got to the point I couldn't stand, most of them seem to not post much and one of whom seems to no longer be here thankfully. I just lost interest in posting here.

Maybe I'll come back when I get the SDL down here this summer and start tearing into it. That's going to be a slow-burn project that'll go for years, but it'll be the car I'm buried in. Right now, I'm mostly fixing up the E34 and just finished that 350SD for my friend. Not a lot of content to share here.

[dieselbenz1]

Well I for one miss reading your posts I learnt lots from you!

[t walgamuth]

Glad this has panned out for you. That is a pretty rare car. Those euro 500s will scoot!

[Diseasel300]

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

Glad this has panned out for you. That is a pretty rare car. Those euro 500s will scoot!

It's more the sentimentality than the rarity of the car for me. It's been in the family for 25 years now and I have a lot of memories in it. Yes, it definitely will scoot, especially since this one was never saddled with emissions controls other than some cats welded on after the downpipes.

It's been getting used a lot more since I did the front end and fixed the engine mount. I had it at the Centerville get-together with the MBCA crowd in October and it'll be at Radwood in Austin this April. On the way to Houston, it lit the cats off on I-10, smoking out all the traffic behind. I doubt seriously that car had been on the road long enough or gotten them hot enough to light off since the mid 1990s!