W123 Bundts question - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Stretch · #1 10-15-2010, 02:21 PM

Dear All,

I have several dumb questions to ask about Bundts / Kroonkurk / Barock alloy wheels.

1) Easy one:- which size wheel is necessary for a W123 (both 14" and 15" sizes => is 7J X 15CH any good?)

2) Which manufacturers made these wheels in the 1980s? Was ATS one of them for example? Which, if any, is considered to be the best manufacturer.

3) Do these wheels go porous with age? If I buy a set will I spend most of my time pumping up tyres before I start the engine?

4) I've seen in other threads that you can buy replicas new - er - where can I buy them? Who still makes 'em?

I hope these questions aren't too irritating - if they have all been answered before please direct me to the relevant threads!

MBeige · #2 10-15-2010, 04:11 PM

15" are hard to find. Made by Fuchs (original MB), ATS, ARC-Alurad, Centra, Ronal (last 4 are aftermarket). ET23 to ET25 range of offset figures. Best, is Fuchs because that's 1. original and 2. they're forged so the wheels are stronger.

As long as they're not chromed you should be okay. Chrome has a tendency to leak air out after a while.

You've probably already seen my 15" Centra Bundts before:

More here

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w123-e-ce-d-cd-td/1400649-different-versions-15-bundt-wheel-design.html

sd300td · #3 10-15-2010, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Army

Dear All,

I have several dumb questions to ask about Bundts / Kroonkurk / Barock alloy wheels.

1) Easy one:- which size wheel is necessary for a W123 (both 14" and 15" sizes => is 7J X 15CH any good?)

2) Which manufacturers made these wheels in the 1980s? Was ATS one of them for example? Which, if any, is considered to be the best manufacturer.

3) Do these wheels go porous with age? If I buy a set will I spend most of my time pumping up tyres before I start the engine?

4) I've seen in other threads that you can buy replicas new - er - where can I buy them? Who still makes 'em?

I hope these questions aren't too irritating - if they have all been answered before please direct me to the relevant threads!

1) 7x15 should be ok. For 15 inch wheels the offset is 23-25 ish, IIRC.
2) There were a few mfg's and ATS was one. All equal in my book though slight variations between mfg's exist.
3) No, not typical.
4) MB Classic Center will sell you a new set. But, refinishing is cheaper.

Stretch · #4 10-16-2010, 03:32 AM

Thanks for the information - to what extent can wheels be refinished? More specifically if there are chunks missing out of the side of a cast wheel can it be safely repaired?

Has anyone ever heard of these wheels being tested for cracks - eddy current testing or die penetration techniques?

MBeige · #5 10-16-2010, 01:24 PM

My 15" Bundts came with missing chunks on the center cap mount, had them restored.

Stretch · #6 10-17-2010, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBeige

My 15" Bundts came with missing chunks on the center cap mount, had them restored...

Wow now if that can be fixed... I don't really have any worries do I?

sd300td · #7 10-17-2010, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Army

Wow now if that can be fixed... I don't really have any worries do I?

Just make sure the wheels are true and hold air. Much harder if not impossible to fix.

MBeige · #8 10-17-2010, 06:25 PM

Absolutely!

JHZR2 · #9 07-01-2011, 11:15 AM

Am I reding it correctly that ONLY the Fuchs wheels were forged, not the others?

Are all 14x6/14x6.5 wheels forged?

DO only the fuchs wheels have the MB star?

Stretch · #10 07-01-2011, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHZR2

Am I reding it correctly that ONLY the Fuchs wheels were forged, not the others?

...

That's what I now understand to be true...

I can't answer the rest of the questions completely. There is some information in the FSM chapter 40-100 for the correct size tyre for the wheel. And a bit more in chapter 40-102 about rims.

In 40-102 it says that the Mercedes star was attached to all forged rims - but that doesn't necessarily mean that the copy cats didn't copy that too. It says that steel rims were only given a star from 1973...

JHZR2 · #11 07-01-2011, 02:11 PM

So what would I be giving up buying ATS 15" bundts?

Would OE 14" wheels, which I assume to be forged, be stronger?

Stretch · #12 07-01-2011, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHZR2

So what would I be giving up buying ATS 15" bundts?

Would OE 14" wheels, which I assume to be forged, be stronger?

MBeige seems happy with his ATS wheels - I hope he chips in to confirm this...

I would expect forged wheels to be stronger than cast wheels as forging manipulates a granular flow of metal as the wheel is shaped. But whether that makes much of a difference in practice I don't know. Some of these wheels are 40 years old...

...meaning you've got other more important things to worry about like metal fatigue and unseen / hidden damage.

I've got hold of a set of Fuchs 14" wheels and when tapped they ring like bells. Don't buy anything that has a dull clunk sound when tapped. That'll probably be cracked somewhere. Please note this simple test is difficult to achieve when the tyres are fitted!

MBeige · #13 07-01-2011, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHZR2

So what would I be giving up buying ATS 15" bundts?

Would OE 14" wheels, which I assume to be forged, be stronger?

Ideally, the Fuchs MB 15" bundts are the way to go, I'll agree. However, even if you gave up a bit to get the aftermarket ATS 15" Bundts, you'll gain so much more in terms of looks, handling and more available tire choices.

Been using mine (made by Centra) for almost 3 years now w/ no leaks in air.

Adler · #14 07-19-2011, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBeige

Ideally, the Fuchs MB 15" bundts are the way to go, I'll agree. However, even if you gave up a bit to get the aftermarket ATS 15" Bundts, you'll gain so much more in terms of looks, handling and more available tire choices.

Been using mine (made by Centra) for almost 3 years now w/ no leaks in air.

What model were the 15" Bundts fitted to ,as they seem to be quite rare as compared to 14" ones.?
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