New one to the forums

Hello guys and gals.
I am new to this forum and found it when searching for Unimog info. I am currently looking for a Mog. prefferably a 416 Doka. I'm not looking to buy one tomorrow or within the next year, but I would like to find out anything I can about them. Like where do yall get parts for them if needed and what not.

In case anyone is wondering what my nickname stands for. Its International / Navistar T444 is the engine Ford (Power Stroke) uses in their trucks. The power stroke is a highly tuned down version of the T444.





2001 Ford F250 4x4 diesel. Plenty other toys to be pulled by the ford. Southern Louisiana Amsoil dealer.

[Frank X. Morris]

Howdy T444,
Welcome to the forum. Here is the web site every Mogger should have bookmarked.
www.rockymountainmoggers.com
For dealers just go to Unimog links. There are a number of dealers that are real good and you will find them in the RMM ste. The one that is fairly close to you is Sean Philyaw of Euro Truck Importers in Georgia. He is real good to work with. Hope this gets you going towards ownership and again welcome.

[gsamuelson]

The 416 DoKa is a sweet machine but I am a bit prejudiced since I own one . The neat thing about Unimogs, especially non-military ones, is that they come in an almost infinite number of variations with numerous options. Trying to compare one to the next can be difficult without considering all the options. For the recreational user, many of the options are not all that necessary. Features that are really nice to have are a front PTO and winch(winch made by MB also, can you say BIG ), fast axles (gets you going about 110km/hr on the flats), high air intake, auxillary air compressor, additional aftermarket fuel tank, auxllary cab heater(aftermarket also).

As for finding one, take Frank's advice and go to the Rocky Mountain Moggers page. There is more information and pictures there than anywhere else.

Parts availablilty is not a huge issue so long as you reallize that if something breaks you will have to order it from a Unimog parts dealer. Fortunately, like most MB products, perhaps more so with the Unimog, things don't just break![B]

I bought my Unimog from Classic Unimogs in Germany(www.classicunimogs.com). Lisa and Ziggy took my specifications and found exactly what I was looking for at the price I wanted to pay. There are several dealers in the USA and Canada but my experience with some is that they want to sell you a pristine truck and charge accordingly. Others Owner's I have spoken with have had a hard time getting info from Dealers, the Dealer is either too busy to return calls or are sick of dealing with people who just want to kick tires.

If you seriously want a truck and are in a position to buy one, go for it. If the dealers shrug you off be persistant, especially if they have a truck you want. Don't kick tires pretending to buy, you'll just piss them off. If you see a truck you want but are not in a position to buy it, find the money!!!!!!!! or walk away. Unimogs, especially 416 DoKa's(reasoanably priced), do not stay in one place for long. If your not there with cash in hand when the boat hits the dock you'll probably not get the truck. In fact, many Dealers sell the truck before it gets off the boat.

If you want to kick tires ask someone who owns a Unimog, most Owners like myself will be more than happy to talk your ear off and show you every detail of their rigs. If you can't find a 416 DoKa, any 416 will do as far as mechanics, ride and handling go.

Good Luck!

THANKS a bunch

i found the classicunimogs.com website. That seems to be a excellent place to buy from. I live 15 minutes from a lcoal port. which is then 10 minutes from the Gulf of mexico. So im not worried about shipping. Just need to find the one I want. Are the fast axles something that has to be had? would the reular axle ratios be seffice for mild road use, at most a speed limit here is 65mph. would be work at that speed or fast axles required?
GS, do you have ICQ or AIM?

Thanks again for yall posts.

[gsamuelson]

Another local Mogger has a 416 with the standard axle ratios and does just fine on the highway, I think he gets up to 55 miles/hr. If he had the chance (ie cash, about $4,000) I think he would have put in the higher ratios to improve his top end speed. One other thing to consider is that with a higher top end speed, you aslo get a higher bottom end speed. So there is a trade off. In the end you have to meet your greatest needs and unfoirtunately this sometime involves a compromise.

I live about one hour away from any decent 4X4 roads so I have to get on the highway. I have done it with my old 404(max 55miles/hr) and it was ok. At 110km/hr I dont save all that much time on a trip but I feel like less of an obstacle on the highway.

You can e-mail me directly if you want any further info. gsamuelson@dccnet.com or we can keep the discussion here for all to read!

right, so faster axles, id compromise total low end torque. it will be used for trails and what not. It wont be a daily driver. pulling hayrides during southern louisiana festivals or just to town and turn a few heads is all the road use it will get.

theres only one guy here who has one and he brought it to texas for his ranch. his was a 404 with f/r pto with a 3point in front. Jet black in color.

Ive searched ebay and found quite alot of general parts. which is my main concern. I had a CJ7 with a AMC 360 and most people know, they arent the easiest to get parts for. You just have to know the right people if you need parts, but I guess thats with just about anything of that nature.


what interior functions are there? how much gauge cluster they have? are all 24v systems. is it worth it to convert to 12v? this might be a dumb question, but are they power steering? I havent seen a whole lot of info on steering. brake system is drum and drum on older models and are they power too?

[Frank X. Morris]

Howdy T444,
Parts are easy to get through the dealers, especially the 416. Your useage sounds like you would do just fine with the regular axles. Going to 12v is a hot topic. Some say why and the others say why not. It comes down to the individual. Some people who leave it 24v just get converters. In some applications it is nice to have the 24v. I will let Greg answer your questions on the machine itself. Just fyi there is a 416 in Virginia for sale. Don't know details.

What type of applications would need 24v. the winch is pto right?
unless additional lighting was to be used, I could see 24v coming in handy. are the converters expensive? staying 24v and converting with a couple 12v outlets would be a bad idea.

[Frank X. Morris]

Howdy T444
Yes the winch is pto but some people use electric. I think both Warn & Ramsey make 24v winches. I have not looked into converters so I'll stay away from a guess. There are a lot of attachments for the Mog that need electrical power it is unbelievable. There are a number of outlets on the trucks to run things. You may never need any of this so your way to go might be 12v. One thing some people use the 404 for is a radio truck. Remeber that a Mog is a mobil generator.

ok

i could see the reason as far as pto and elec winch. its been debated to no end.

on the 416 what type of output am i looking at? From the engine stand point, if it does put out a decent amount of useable power, is this engine driven? does it hurt it for extend idle periods or does it need some sort of AIC (auxillart idle control) similar to my power stroke?
does the alt / generator charge at idle? does the heater or a/c (if equiped) put out at idle?

[Frank X. Morris]

Howdy T444,
I don't have any numbers on output. The output from pto or electrical would be more than enough. Long idleing is no problem they have been doing it for 50 years They have been used for well drilling and that is a lot of idle time If you need a higher engine idle speed they have a hand throttle. Hope this helped a little.

ok,
thanks.

ill wait for GS to respond on the questions that havent been answered yet.

thanks again

[gsamuelson]

Wooooo! Lots of questions! My 416 has power steering and brakes. The truck is fairly easy to drive, so much so my wife wants to drive it (not a put down on women or my wife, but some folks, men included, do not like to drive a vehicle that is manual, the 404's are an example of that and they take a certain amount of physical power/strength to drive, off road with a 404 can be quite a bit of exercise especially at lower speeds, that was my experience anyhow).

Wherthere or not your 416 has drum or disc brakes will depend on when it was manufactured and who ordered it. Older ones seem to have drums all around, newer often come with disks. The drum brakes are simple and work, the disks are more complicated and work better. I have found that with my truck empty I have more than enough braking power, so much so that I can skid very easily when it is wet outside. In other words, the brakes are not the limiting factor when stopping, the tires and road conditions are. Of course with a heavy load the disks will provide more stopping ability.

Some truck, such as mine, come with single circuit brakes, newer truck most times come with dual circuit. The brakes are air over oil, and so there is an air compressor and tank on baord. Some trucks have an auxilary air compressor also. When you start up one of these trucks you don't not just drive away, you must wait for the air pressure to build so that your brakes are fully functional. They will work without the air pressure but with more effort.

The guage cluster is fairly complete but again depends on the trck. I have a engine temp, clock, oil pressure, tach, spedo and idiot lights for charging, and a few other things that I can;t remeber.

The cab has a heater/defroster but the defroster looks as though it will only really work well on the drivers side. The controls are very basic: a 3 position rocker switch for the fan, and some flaps for directing the air.

My truck has single speed wipers(bit of a pain) while some have two speed and maybe even intermitemt.

As I mentioned before I have an auxllilary diesel heater for the cab that is mounted in the storage space below the rear bench seat.

Most of the 416 are 12V. The exception is ex-military which are 24V. Personnaly, I would bugger around converting the entire system to 12V just to make it a little easier to buy lights bulbs. A converter can be easily bought if you need 12V power.

The winch for these trucks are scary powerful beasts! Some fellow on the Mog Mail List had pictures of a winch that riped itself off the truck. I think it was a Hydraulic powered Warner winch and the mounts were fabricated in a local shop, but still!!!. The PTO winch on my truck is massive and is more than capable of pulling the truck out of any sort of trouble. I think someone had mentioned that the winch rating is equivalent to 20,000lbs if compared under North American standards. As Frank mentioned there is a hand throttle to set the engine speed for PTO operation. The hand throttle is also used to shut down the engine(important to know! ). I think if I were looking for a winch, I would get a hydraulic one since I already have the hydraulics on-board. This would be better than the PTO or the electric(IMHO). A rebuilt/used MB Model C winch costs about $2,000USD, a hydraulic winch is probably more.

As for idling the engine, I would think that it is no different than any other diesel. The more low speed idle the more carbon build up. Give her a good run once in a while and blow the crap out! Of course these engines can run at full rpm all day without a problem.

The alt does charge at idle, how well I am not sure. The heater works very well at idle, could be a problem when extreemly cold, hence the auxilary diesel heater. Diesel heaters are also available for warming the engine but it would have to be pretty damn cold for that stuff to be needed. There is on-board cold weather starting equipment that consists of a reservoir and a pump. You fill the reservoir with starting fluid (MB product) and it pumps directly into the intake while starting. The pump handle is located on the dashboard. Odd setup but it supposedly works.

Well, I outa breath! If you have any more questions post 'em and I'll try my best to answer them!

THANKS GS.

One more question: Would you donate your to the "T444 needs a mog foundation?

on the pto provision. If equiped with a 3-point hitch, whats the lifting capacity of one?

do all 416's have coil springs? Ive also read of one model not having portal axles, but have a min. 6ton axle. It still had 16" GC but was not a portal design.

Are some equipped with the 20spd? whats the normal factory trans, a 6spd?

Whats insurance rate like?

you got any pictures of your mog online?

[gsamuelson]

Sorry all donations are going towards the Fix Greg's Trusty Rusty 416 Organisation!

I am not sure if I completely understand your question but the PTO is completely independant of the 3 point hitch. The 3 point hitch works off of hydraulics. Keep in mind that my hitch is actually at the rear. As for the lifting capacity of the hitch, I cant remeber and at the moment I can;t put my hands on my dang operator's manual!!! When I find it I will let you know.

As far as I know, all UNIMOGS have coil spring suspension. The number and stiffness of the coils is dependent upon what was ordered or installed. The coil springs give the truck a very smooth ride. Most people that I have given a ride to have been very impressed how smooth the truck is. In fact it is a touch bouncy without any weight when you jerk the brakes. I have been told that the trucks ride their best when loaded but I doubt that will every happen with my truck!

The truck you are looking at with the 6 tonne axle was a custom designed expedition vehicle. A fellow down in Washington State bought it. The axle was built by a company in Germany, I haven't seen any close ups, so I am not sure how it was all put together. The drive shafts are typically enclosed inside a torque tube and I would think that whoever modified the truck would have stuck to that principal.

As far as tranny's go there are several options. First there is the basic six speed with 2 reverse. Then you can throw in a torque converter on the same tranny, very neat stuff!

Then there is an 8 speed with 4 in reverse(I think). Then there is the 20 speed which seems to be an 8 speed with crawler and super crawler gears. If you look in the archives on the topica.com mogml list there is a very good and correct description of all the tranny's.

There is also a double clutch available that allows the operator to disengage the tranny and keep the PTO operating. Partly pressing down the clutch pedal disengages the transmission, pressing the pedal all the way down disengages the PTO.


There are also 2 PTO's, the first is a single speed, the second is a 2 speed.

I have a bunch of photos of my 416 and my old 404 at:

http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/samuelson_404

Also have pictures of my 2 other MB diesels there!