Frist: Tax-returns measure indefensible - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

mikemover · #16 11-23-2004, 01:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KirkVining

That is absolutely criminal that an attempt was made to give political hacks access to information like that. I find Istook's explanation deceitful as well. This action was part of some larger plan, and there should be an investigation to find out what it is, but we know that will never happen.

Dammit, I hate it when I agree with you!

Mike

KirkVining · #17 11-23-2004, 02:23 AM

Actually, Libertarians are supposed to agree with democrats about half the time. Keep working at it, you are at about 2%.

mikemover · #18 11-23-2004, 02:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KirkVining

Actually, Libertarians are supposed to agree with democrats about half the time. Keep working at it, you are at about 2%.

I posted this rant a while back.....I couldn't locate it at first....I think I posted it on a thread that was subsequently deleted....Fortunately, I also copied it and e-mailed it to someone, so please allow me to repeat myself here, once again. I think it applies to this thread's topic as well, on a number of levels.

Most of the problem, and most of MY personal dislike for the Democratic party, does not reside in the party's stated goals and ideals (as listed by KV in the post that prompted this response). I actually agree with many of them.

The problem lies in the means by which they are trying to attain these goals:

Basically, I have observed that the Democratic party as a whole has decided that government intervention is ALWAYS the solution, regardless of what the problem is. This approach has created FAR more problems than it has solved, and it is at the heart of my aversion to most Democrats, and many Republicans as well.

Socialists, radical environmentalists, and other special-rights-seeking minority factions have taken over the public image and direction of the Democratic party, alienating independent-minded people like ME, who actually agree with many of the stated goals of the Democratic party, but favor achieving them through knowledge, education, efficiency, accountability, personal responsibility, and self-reliance, free-market, and overall freedom, NOT through increasing the size and grip of our already grossly bloated and meddling government. The Republican party has lost much of my support as well, for advocating a similar approach to advancing their own agenda. Many of the differences between the two major parties are evaporating. Thus, my libertarianism.

Forcing one's ideals and goals upon other citizens by use of legislation and the power of their own government is never going to win you any new friends. Republicans are guilty of this as well, but the Democrats are MORE guilty in recent years. This is why the Democratic party is currently floundering.

Both the Dems and the Repubs at least PRETEND to agree that government has become too big and bloated, yet they both continue to expand it at every opportunity. The problem here is, the parties cannot agree on what is "fat" and what is not "fat". Of course the OTHER party's pet projects are always seen as expendable....This stalemate is never going to lead to a smaller, less intrusive government.

This is why our government should not be involved in ANY of these secondary roles for which it was never intended. There's a reason the founders did not want our government involved in all of the things it currently is into....they could forsee it becoming what it is NOW: A big, expensive, intrusive, unwieldy MESS.

Mike

BobK · #19 11-23-2004, 07:19 AM

Mike, you and I are on the same page. In my case, I fall into the catagory of a strict constructionist. I support the constitution AS WRITTEN. Sometimes that would help some of the things I like, sometimes it would hurt. BUT, there is a great process for fixing things we don't like: The amendment process. My own feeling is that things should be done as close to home as possible. Local governments should handle most jobs:city streets, sewers, fire protection. County level for rural roads and schools with some oversight/funding from the state. (I dare anyone to find the dept of education specified in the US Constitution.)The federal governments' main role is to make war, sign treaties and sell stamps. The problem is, when you hire engineers, they build bridges; when you hire surgeons, they cut; when you hire legislators, they muck things up-no,I mean they make laws. If I had my way, we would delete at least one third of the federal government. Until that happens, I will continue voting in the democratic primaries for moderate, centerist candidates to try to take the party back from the folks that are so far left, they are falling off the coast of Ca.

mikemover · #20 11-23-2004, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobK

Mike, you and I are on the same page. In my case, I fall into the catagory of a strict constructionist. I support the constitution AS WRITTEN. Sometimes that would help some of the things I like, sometimes it would hurt. BUT, there is a great process for fixing things we don't like: The amendment process. My own feeling is that things should be done as close to home as possible. Local governments should handle most jobs:city streets, sewers, fire protection. County level for rural roads and schools with some oversight/funding from the state. (I dare anyone to find the dept of education specified in the US Constitution.)The federal governments' main role is to make war, sign treaties and sell stamps. The problem is, when you hire engineers, they build bridges; when you hire surgeons, they cut; when you hire legislators, they muck things up-no,I mean they make laws. If I had my way, we would delete at least one third of the federal government. Until that happens, I will continue voting in the democratic primaries for moderate, centerist candidates to try to take the party back from the folks that are so far left, they are falling off the coast of Ca.

Yep, we're definitely on the same page. Except I'd do away with 2/3 of the federal government!

I also like the "falling off the coast of CA" joke.... Very funny, and very true.

Mike