And in the case of Exxon, or any public corporation, it affects the profit of the owners, which in the case of Exxon, could be several hundred thousand poeple and organizations (also owned by people) owning the stock. Including working class people hoping to build up a retirement fund with the uncertainty of social security.

The profit is not the corporation's, but the owners', the stock holders. Taxing corporations only affects the end user and the stock holders.

Either the end user gets charged more, or the owners don't make as much. But if the market can bear the cost of the product PLUS the cost of the tax, then it could be argued that if there were no tax, the cost is completely born by the owners. If you have a 401(k) or a mutual, you probably have an interest in having Exxon provide as much profit as possible.

__________________
Thank You!
Fred
2009 ML350
2004 SL600
2004 SL500
1996 SL600
2002 SLK32
2005 CLK320 cabrio
2003 ML350
1997 C280 Sport

I don't think we disagree, do we?

If the tax burden is onerous, the taxpayer will move, cheat, pass the cost to the consumer or go under. The more baggage you put on the donkey's back the more you make him work for your benefit rather than his own.

What has heavy industrial and textile business in America done over the 30 years as the burden increases? How is that different from the snow cone stand?

So?

You lost me. Costs are either borne by the owners or passed on to the consumer, whether a tax is part of them or not. If Exxon were in my 401k, I'd rather they made less money.



No, we don't disagree, just have slightly different ways of looking at it.


1-They've outsourced. 2-It's not essentially.

The textile industry has outsourced for a slew of reasons. Labor for one. Labor, like taxes, are a cost. No one is calling for people to work for them for free, so why call for ending taxes? If they got cloth for free, naturally they would no longer be burdened with the cost of material. Taxes are just part of the cost of doing business. I fail to see why corporations should just have a cost lifted off of them for no reason. It's a market condition like any other. Maybe it leads to bankruptcy, maybe health care costs do. And one would have to be high to think prices will go down if the tax is gone.
If we're going to lift the tax burden of a group for no reason, how 'bout lifting it off citizens first?

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1984 300TD

"If we're going to lift the tax burden of a group for no reason, how 'bout lifting it off citizens first?"

That's the point. The citizens are paying the tax that you say Exxon pays. Nobody else. Whether the citizen is the consumer, the investor, or both.

__________________
Thank You!
Fred
2009 ML350
2004 SL600
2004 SL500
1996 SL600
2002 SLK32
2005 CLK320 cabrio
2003 ML350
1997 C280 Sport

The citizen as consumer also pays the cost of transportation. Should that be free for companies too? As investor/owner, the citizen pays income tax, just like everyone else. Why should the investor have his tax burden lifted and not the non-investor? I propose we only lift the income tax burden of people who own no stocks or business.


As individuals, we pay taxes in exchange for services. The company uses those services too.

__________________
1984 300TD

Once again, I wish I could convince you, the corporation pays no taxes. None. Zero. The owners do. Citizens and foriegners, but eventually, normal people, own all the public companies. And as owners, they pay the taxes.

__________________
Thank You!
Fred
2009 ML350
2004 SL600
2004 SL500
1996 SL600
2002 SLK32
2005 CLK320 cabrio
2003 ML350
1997 C280 Sport

Where does the citizen get the money to pay the tax??

Brian, what do you mean? The source of the money? The government prints it by the ton.

__________________
Thank You!
Fred
2009 ML350
2004 SL600
2004 SL500
1996 SL600
2002 SLK32
2005 CLK320 cabrio
2003 ML350
1997 C280 Sport

Where did the "citizen" get the money to pay the tax that you claim that they pay............did they steal it from the government?

They may have received it from the government directly, in the form of SS or welfare. Or, they may have earned by working for a company, incorporated or not, which in turn gets their money from customers, who are ultimately individual citizens. Or maybe self employed and from their customers.

Or a bazillion other ways to get money. Inherit it, steal it, find it, embezzle it. Maybe even print it themselves.

Lead me where you want to go a bit more clearly.

__________________
Thank You!
Fred
2009 ML350
2004 SL600
2004 SL500
1996 SL600
2002 SLK32
2005 CLK320 cabrio
2003 ML350
1997 C280 Sport

..........therefore, the corporation paid the tax.

No, the owners did.

__________________
Thank You!
Fred
2009 ML350
2004 SL600
2004 SL500
1996 SL600
2002 SLK32
2005 CLK320 cabrio
2003 ML350
1997 C280 Sport

The owners couldn't pay the tax because they never received the any money to allow them to pay anything.

The corporation earned the money and the corporation paid the tax.

Funny. I just read the first page of this thread, and then this 15th page. Kinda like the soap operas. You don't need to watch them everyday to follow the plot

It's the democrats fault, y'know.

__________________
past MB rides:
'68 220D
'68 220D(another one)
'67 230
'84 SD
Current rides:
'06 Lexus RX330
'93 Ford F-250
'96 Corvette
'99 Polaris 700 RMK sled
2011 Polaris Assault
'86 Yamaha TT350(good 'ol thumper)

Yep, we go round in circles..........seemingly forever..........