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-   -   Detainees that had no connection to terrorism, tortured, radicalized against US. (http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/off-topic-discussion/225156-detainees-had-no-connection-terrorism-tortured-radicalized-against-us.html)

MTI 06-19-2008 06:54 PM

Man, I have got to stop posting in invisible electrons . . .:rolleyes:

DieselAddict 06-19-2008 06:56 PM

Sorry, I didn't see your link. That's why I usually just copy and paste the article. That way more people read it.

cmac2012 06-20-2008 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim (Post 1888072)
But where are many more turning? Where are all the massive demonstrations for OBL & Co insulting their religion with the crap he did and does? Did I miss it?

I'll agree it played a minor part. About as minor as maybe that Mr Nobody you saw in the movie. You know, the one that was in the background that walked by as part of the scene on a busy street for all of 3 seconds.

You don't have a clue. It's all speculation on your part.

People notice who is civilized and who isn't. You'd be surprised at how mature and stable many Muslims are. I've met some of them.

cmac2012 06-20-2008 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gurkha (Post 1888137)
Its never the religion, its the people and their misinterpretation, particularly the zealots and there is no shortage of them in any religion to speak of. Christian Pro lifers condone violence against right to life lobby and blow up abortion clinics, few hundred years back the conquistadors wiped out civilizations in the name of religion. The list sadly goes on. The Islamists are like trapped caged animals in the arena where they know they are on the loosing side and desperate to protect themselves.

Touche. Exactly right. This notion that we Americans have some sort of monopoly on sane, civilized behavior is nonsense.

Circa 1900, we were perpetrating atrocities on Filipinos, referring to them as monkeys cuz they had the sense to crouch (good for the back) when resting.

And Vietnam was an unvarnished travesty.

cmac2012 06-20-2008 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTI (Post 1888669)
Man, I have got to stop posting in invisible electrons . . .:rolleyes:

C'mon man, you're a leftie -- no one pays any attention to you. ;)

aklim 06-20-2008 05:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmac2012 (Post 1888958)
You don't have a clue. It's all speculation on your part.

People notice who is civilized and who isn't. You'd be surprised at how mature and stable many Muslims are. I've met some of them.

As opposed to fact on YOUR part because you KNOW? How?

And I have met some unstable ones too. I have met them inside and, more importantly OUT of this country. What's your point? That those you met are more representative of what they are than those I met? If so, why? My point is simple. I have seen them enraged about what they perceive as offenses or slights to their religion. Yet if OBL & Co do something, little is said, if any. So, if they know how to scream and yell at a cartoon, are you trying to tell me that their silence is because they don't know how to do the same at what OBL is doing or is it because they are in agreement? Please don't tell me what the govt of a muslim state says. I could care less. Bill C does not speak for all Dems and neither do the Bushs speak for all Reps. Show me the massive hue and cries of the common people.

DieselAddict 06-20-2008 01:36 PM

On the same note, I haven't seen any demonstrations in the US against Bin Laden either. And our administration doesn't even seem to try to get him. Yet many Americans get enraged about abortion and gay rights. What does that prove?

Bin Laden doesn't speak for all muslims either. Any idiot knows that. In fact today he hardly even speaks.

aklim 06-20-2008 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DieselAddict (Post 1889300)
Bin Laden doesn't speak for all muslims either. Any idiot knows that. In fact today he hardly even speaks.

So you are saying that muslims can show anger at slights or even perceived slights at their religion and are media savvy, IOW, they are not clueless as to how do make a ruckus. Also, they are against what OBL has done in the name of their religion but somehow we don't hear a word about it from the common people?

DieselAddict 06-20-2008 02:31 PM

There are over a billion Muslims in the world. Most don't seem to show any anger in the public about anything, including the cartoons. They just go along their daily business like you and I. Surveys show that the vast majority of Muslims are opposed to the jihadist agenda. Look it up yourself. And some have even taken up arms against Al-Qaeda, especially in Iraq and the tribal region of Pakistan. Unfortunately Al-Qaeda is still pretty strong in Pakistan and many of the anti-Al-Qaeda tribal chiefs there have been assassinated.

aklim 06-20-2008 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DieselAddict (Post 1889365)
There are over a billion Muslims in the world. Most don't seem to show any anger in the public about anything, including the cartoons. They just go along their daily business like you and I. Surveys show that the vast majority of Muslims are opposed to the jihadist agenda. Look it up yourself. And some have even taken up arms against Al-Qaeda, especially in Iraq and the tribal region of Pakistan. Unfortunately Al-Qaeda is still pretty strong in Pakistan and many of the anti-Al-Qaeda tribal chiefs there have been assassinated.

If you go to some of those countries and make a direct insult on their religion, let me know and I'll get tweezers to pick up what is left of you.

I'm not saying there are none that are against the jihadist agenda. I'm saying that while there are some that are against the jihadist agenda, there are probably more that are for it. I don't consider you innocent if you aren't the one with the bomb vest or the AK-47. If you supply them with money, tacit support or even give them directions to a place, you are guilty.

DieselAddict 06-20-2008 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim (Post 1889380)
I'm saying that while there are some that are against the jihadist agenda, there are probably more that are for it.

Do you have anything to back up that allegation?

aklim 06-20-2008 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DieselAddict (Post 1889416)
Do you have anything to back up that allegation?

Do you have anything to back up yours? Mine is based on their lack of response when they see what OBL does in the name of islam and their response when their religion is insulted.

DieselAddict 06-20-2008 03:52 PM

Quote:

The Simon Fraser study notes that the decline in terrorism appears to be caused by many factors, among them successful counterterrorism operations in dozens of countries and infighting among terror groups. But the most significant, in the study's view, is the "extraordinary drop in support for Islamist terror organizations in the Muslim world over the past five years." These are largely self-inflicted wounds. The more people are exposed to the jihadists' tactics and world view, the less they support them. An ABC/BBC poll in Afghanistan in 2007 showed support for the jihadist militants in the country to be 1 percent. In Pakistan's North-West Frontier province, where Al Qaeda has bases, support for Osama bin Laden plummeted from 70 percent in August 2007 to 4 percent in January 2008. That dramatic drop was probably a reaction to the assassination of Benazir Bhutto, but it points to a general trend in Pakistan over the past five years. With every new terrorist attack, public support for jihad falls. "This pattern is repeated in country after country in the Muslim world," writes Mack. "Its strategic implications are critically important because historical evidence suggests that terrorist campaigns that lose public support will sooner or later be abandoned or defeated."
http://www.newsweek.com/id/138508

Txjake 06-23-2008 09:50 AM

there are certainly unstable muslims...however, I found during my military career that 7.62 & 5.56 cures the unstability fairly quickly.....;)

MTI 06-23-2008 08:43 PM

US Court: Uighurs Classification Improper

Well, at the very least, we should be glad that the biggest reason they are still being held is that we don't want to send them back to the Chinese.


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