To W140 or not??? - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

forcefed44 · #1 06-11-2009, 05:49 PM

So I finally came to a conclusion that I need to replace my beloved first Mercedes Benz. A 85' 380SE US and wanted to go through a few hits or misses in the deciding factors for replacement after dropping alot of $$$ in repairs and modifications....

new NOS rear window glass
New shocks and bushings
front steering components
German H&R race springs
New rocker arms
Waterpump
euro Gen 1 bumpers
AMG Gen 1 skirts and front spoiler
rear SDL seats
replaced D/S subframe arm (typical rust)
replaced hood and front fenders due to rust
Chain and guides replaced by P/O

She's pretty as a black/Palomino car but the rust kicking my A$$ since the P/O had the chrome trim and ate away at the rear arches as well as the lower kick trim and not knowing it was involved in an accident although repaired correctly by an out of service body shop authorized by Ray Catena.

What I want to know is if I should move up to a W140 400SE or 500SEL or repurchase a W126 again preferably a 420SEL but in black only. I do like the look of the lightly modded W140's but a smartly sorted W126 really takes the cake...

What are the pros and cons of the W140 early cars? pre 95' actually.. With the prices of them now they rival some of the better W126's.. I love the W-126 but a have my euro 380SE, US 560SEC and 300SD left and soo will need to find a newer W126 300SD due to rust.. (later on that)... Feel free to chime in as I need to find something before the end of summer..

Jim B. · #2 06-11-2009, 06:34 PM

I had the same conundrum when, back in about 1995 -1996 I had $40,000 for a car, simply burning a hole in my pocket. Back then, it would have been enough to buy a lightly used bottom of the line first year of production 1992 W140 S320 that looked like a brand new model at the time, or some like new very top of the line 1990-1991 last of the 560SEC with ultra-low miles. We are talking ONLY from California West Coast Mercedes Benz dealers and certified preowned (Called "Encore" cars in those dark pre internet days....)

The W140 rides smoother, and is more luxurious and has wider, better front seats that are incredibly comfortable. Also it's THE car to be in, in the mother of all accidents, and NO Princess stories, please: Di was NOT wearing her seat belt, the guard in the death seat was, and survived...

But their AC systems are NOTORIOUSLY unreliable, and when the evap goes bad, it's a HUGE job just to get at it, the joke is that a string was suspended from the ceiling and the WHOLE car was built around it. 22 Hours of labor at $150+ an hour at an MB dealer....got the visual yet?

They are over complicated, with double paned glass, soft close doors and trunk and other "out -Japanese-the Japanese" features, all of which are unbelievably expensive to repair.

The build quality is good, though; excellent in fact, but the complexity of throttle actuators, sensors and all those goodies in them, can kill your wallet quick.

In fact, that is why they are available so cheap, nowadays, because they sunk their previous 3rd and 4th tier owners who simply could not afford to run them, and deferred repairs and let them go. You can buy a dog W140 for $4,000 to $5,000 and be faced with over $10,000 of repairs easily....

The worst of the worst would be a 1992 600 SEL, or a rod bender 1992 350SDL. First year 12 cylinder, and the bad diesel.

~~~~~~~~~~~

The W126 ones were by comparison simpler, had MUCH fewer gizmos, and were known to be engineered to be MECHANIC FRIENDLY, easier (and therefore cheaper) to work on.

They are believed also, to be the very last of the "cost no object" and "build the very best no matter what the cost" of the big S class cars, and sold very well, compared to the W140, and junkyard parts are plentiful, and parts available at the Classic Center reasonably and quickly....( a plane flies daily out of Germany loaded with parts and lands in Montvale NJ and the parts are shipped out right from there...)

They have unmistakeable identity as a Mercedes Benz, also, and can't be mistaken for anything else.

I would go again for another W126 in a heartbeat if I needed a car, and ONLY in one place: Sunny Southern California, the car culture, where luxury cars are much loved and catered to, and have the shops and support to back it up, and where an oversupply of very clean, low mileage examples drives their prices down and keeps them there. Rust is NOT an issue there.

I went and bought EVERY single one of my W126ers in Southern California. In fact two, this year.

I would not go anywhere else to purchase one.

Hatterasguy · #3 06-11-2009, 07:30 PM

Both are getting long in the tooth, look for a lightly used W220.

OTOH the market has fallen out from under both of them, so you can probably hunt up a good example cheap.

DieselAddict · #4 06-11-2009, 07:53 PM

I was disappointed with the seats in the W220. I'd expect much better from an S-class. I especially didn't like the narrow curved top of the seat that was pressing on my shoulder blades. It's like they made the seats for skinny little Asian guys, rather than beefy Germans. No other Mercedes seems to have seats like that.

Hatterasguy · #5 06-11-2009, 08:03 PM

I don't really care for the W220 at all. But you can probably pick up an 06 S350 with some good warranty left pretty reasonable.

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=263210809&dealer_id=54463915&car_year=2006&rdm=1244764764197&num_records=25&model=S350&systime=&make2=&highlightFirstMakeModel=&start_year=1981&engine=&keywordsrep=&keywordsrep=&keywordsfyc=&keywordsfyc=&certified=&fuel=&body_code=0&awsp=false&search_type=both&distance=0&marketZipError=false&search_lang=en&showZipError=y&sownerid=88841&first_record=26&make=MB&color=&keywords_display=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&min_price=&drive=&default_sort=priceDESC&seller_type=b&max_mileage=&style_flag=1&sort_type=priceDESC&address=06460&advanced=&end_year=2010&pager.offset=25&transmission=&doors=&max_price=&cardist=1492&standard=false

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=263436324&dealer_id=1016102&car_year=2006&rdm=1244764764197&num_records=25&model=S350&systime=&make2=&highlightFirstMakeModel=&start_year=1981&engine=&keywordsrep=&keywordsrep=&keywordsfyc=&keywordsfyc=&certified=&fuel=&body_code=0&awsp=false&search_type=both&distance=0&marketZipError=false&search_lang=en&showZipError=y&sownerid=88841&first_record=26&make=MB&color=&keywords_display=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&min_price=&drive=&default_sort=priceDESC&seller_type=b&max_mileage=&style_flag=1&sort_type=priceDESC&address=06460&advanced=&end_year=2010&pager.offset=25&transmission=&doors=&max_price=&cardist=1424&standard=false

SWB S class which I think drive better around town than the long. Great V6 with almost as much power as the S430 but with less weight and better mileage. Fully sorted 722.6 gear box, and by 06 the W220 was as sorted as it was going to get.

IMHO thats the S class to buy. Unless you need the rear leg room, or want a ton of power. But that V6 puts out almost 300 already...

Take the $4,500 that uncle sam will give him off the price and it looks half way decent.

Jim B. · #6 06-11-2009, 08:47 PM

The problem with the W220 model is that in the years 2000-2007 Mercedes Benz quality control and build quality was utterly dismal, overall.

Add to that the SERIOUS proliferation of sensors, computers, and other wildly complex impedimentia, and you've a recipe for almost certain, eventual financial disaster.

Added to this, they are bland and undistinguished.

I hate to have to say it, but a Lexus LS430 from that same era would be a much better, buy, on many different levels.

It is pretty safe to say the market agrees with me in that respect.

Fulcrum525 · #7 06-11-2009, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim B.

.......1992 W140 S320

or a rod bender 1992 350SDL. First year 12 cylinder, and the bad diesel.

Ok just have to nitpick a few things there Jim.... It would be called a 300SE if it was 1992 and the Diesel W140's never came in LWB so it would be a 300SD or an S350 after 1993.

Jim B. · #8 06-11-2009, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fulcrum525

Ok just have to nitpick a few things there Jim.... It would be called a 300SE if it was 1992 and the Diesel W140's never came in LWB so it would be a 300SD or an S350 after 1993.

"I'm drowning here, and you're describing the water!!"

~~Jack Nicholson, "As Good As It Gets" (1997)

Fulcrum525 · #9 06-11-2009, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim B.

"I'm drowning here, and you're describing the water!!"

~~Jack Nicholson, "As Good As It Gets" (1997)

Never seen it

Hatterasguy · #10 06-11-2009, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim B.

The problem with the W220 model is that in the years 2000-2007 Mercedes Benz quality control and build quality was utterly dismal, overall.

Add to that the SERIOUS proliferation of sensors, computers, and other wildly complex impedimentia, and you've a recipe for almost certain, eventual financial disaster.

Added to this, they are bland and undistinguished.

I hate to have to say it, but a Lexus LS430 from that same era would be a much better, buy, on many different levels.

It is pretty safe to say the market agrees with me in that respect.

Their not that bad.

If you want an S class thats new enough to not be a project your choice is a W220 or a W221.

Fulcrum525 · #11 06-11-2009, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

Their not that bad.

If you want an S class thats new enough to not be a project your choice is a W220 or a W221.

Save up a little bit more and get the W221. I still prefer my W126 over the W221 but compared to the W220 there is no question as to which is better.

Hatterasguy · #12 06-11-2009, 09:38 PM

Their both a lot of money, right now I'm kind of digging the new 7 series. For starters the shifter is in the right place.

Jim B. · #13 06-11-2009, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

Their not that bad.

If you want an S class thats new enough to not be a project your choice is a W220 or a W221.

W126: "Die beste oder nicht" ("The best or nothing")

W220: "Their not that bad."

frosty · #14 06-11-2009, 10:26 PM

I'd love to own a W140 S-class. That model aged well and still has lots of road presence. I can probaly afford one but can't afford to keep it! Maintenance cost is in the stratosphere! I like the current S-class but it's way beyond what I can afford. Never did like the model after the W140 and before the current model. My not knowing the chassis number pretty much reflects my lack of interest in the later M-B models.

Btw, noting says mafia or p.i.m.p like a well-kept W126.

pawoSD · #15 06-11-2009, 10:39 PM

I'm still afraid of the W140....maybe someday. I'm going to get a real nice LWB W126 as my next one....*maybe* an SDL.....or a rod bender and do an engine swap....thats a good way to pick them up cheap, as Tyler recently did.