Alright pilots what the hell? - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

OMEGAMAN · #1 09-29-2011, 11:33 PM

Here's a link to an article in the vancouver Sun. The comments at the bottom are worth reading as well.
Plane almost upside-down after co-pilot presses wrong button

Aquaticedge · #2 09-29-2011, 11:45 PM

How to make 200 people throw up with one button,

spdrun · #3 09-29-2011, 11:53 PM

Hit the rudder trim dial instead of the cockpit door unlock switch.

VIDEO: ANA 737 rolled near-inverted after rudder trim blunder

tjts1 · #4 09-30-2011, 01:02 AM

Maybe Boeing shouldn't put the rudder trim dial next to the door lock dial. And on second though, what genius decided to make the door lock a dial instead of a conventional switch?

spdrun · #5 09-30-2011, 01:20 AM

Still prefer a good 'ol 737 to a ScareBus 320 where the 'puter has the final say on everything.

Skippy · #6 09-30-2011, 03:28 AM

I wasn't aware a rudder trim change could cause a massive roll. I know we have some pilots on this forum. Any care to comment?

I've often thought that commercial aviation would be a lot more interesting with the addition of steam cats, tail hooks, and arresting cables.

tjts1 · #7 09-30-2011, 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spdrun

Still prefer a good 'ol 737 to a ScareBus 320 where the 'puter has the final say on everything.

I'll take a computer's final say over a tired, lazy, bored, mentally unstable, possibly intoxicated, possibly religious, possibly self destructive human's final say, especially when it comes to flying a few hundred people at a few hundred MPH through the air.

Air&Road · #8 09-30-2011, 07:38 AM

Yeah, I'm a pilot, but my little two place tail dragger has a panel that is slightly different from the one in the picture.

Most small planes do not have a rudder trim tab that's adjustable from the pilots seat. In the case of this ship, I'm wondering if maybe a serious change in rudder trim conflicted with autopilot input.

TwitchKitty · #9 09-30-2011, 09:40 AM

They always blame it on pilot error. The guy probably did it on purpose 'cause he lost a bet on the pre-flight drinking contest.

MS Fowler · #10 09-30-2011, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skippy

I wasn't aware a rudder trim change could cause a massive roll. I know we have some pilots on this forum. Any care to comment?

I've often thought that commercial aviation would be a lot more interesting with the addition of steam cats, tail hooks, and arresting cables.

I have a long-time friend who was well acquainted with steam cats and arresting cables. He says there is nothing like your first carrier landing. He ejected with his crew during several launches when things were just not quite right.
No, thank you.

cjlipps · #11 09-30-2011, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skippy

I wasn't aware a rudder trim change could cause a massive roll. I know we have some pilots on this forum. Any care to comment?

I've often thought that commercial aviation would be a lot more interesting with the addition of steam cats, tail hooks, and arresting cables.

Don't know if this is what happened but rudder input will deflect the nose of the aircraft and accelerate one wing, causing more lift on that wing, which will cause the ship to roll toward the rudder input.

Air&Road · #12 09-30-2011, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cjlipps

Don't know if this is what happened but rudder input will deflect the nose of the aircraft and accelerate one wing, causing more lift on that wing, which will cause the ship to roll toward the rudder input.

Exactly right, but one would EXPECT the autopilot to compensate for it, just as a real pilot would. If a real pilot were to sense the roll, they would correct the roll AND the rudder. You wouldn't THINK that the rudder trim would be so acute as to be outside the limits of the autopilots ability to compensate on all axis.

We need an ATP here to explain this one. I wonder where Dave Morrison is right now? PeachParts Tower to Dave......

Jim H · #13 09-30-2011, 10:59 AM

Does adding Rudder Trim manually cause the autopilot to drop out?

aklim · #14 09-30-2011, 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spdrun

Still prefer a good 'ol 737 to a ScareBus 320 where the 'puter has the final say on everything.

Yeah, because the human is so infallible? For every Sullenberger there are how many of such incidences? I think my odds with the computer, and by the way, COMPUTERS, is better on the whole.

R Leo · #15 09-30-2011, 11:35 AM

IMHO, that borders dangerously on criminal negligence to have two similarly shaped and sized controls with such radically different functions placed so close together.

Boeing FAIL.

ElectroMotive FAIL too...
1/12/97 Kelso, CA Derailment

Quote:

Originally Posted by NTSB

On January 12, 1997, at 11:52 a.m., a Union Pacific Railroad Company (UP) freight train derailed after an accelerated descent beyond the 20-mph speed limit down Cima Hill near Kelso, California. The engineer accidentally activated the engine shutdown switch, which shut off the locomotive unit diesel engines and eliminated the train's dynamic braking capability. The train eventually reached a speed of 72 mph and derailed 68 of its 75 cars. There were no fatalities. The total damage was $4,376,400.

The engine shutdown switch, located on the left side of the console where the engineer's knee might have rested, was found still depressed after the accident. Neither the engineer nor the conductor was aware of what caused the shutdown. Therefore, they took no action to reactivate the system.

Shame, shame, shame...