A thorough debunking - Democratic Underground

Oh my

Not quite...
Its the uncertainty that this Administration will increase regulation and other reporting burdens that causes businesses to not have a gung ho attitude. All this dem talk about raising taxes--no real tax increases quite yet, but the threat is enough of cause people to hold their money

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1982 300SD " Wotan" ..On the road as of Jan 8, 2007 with Historic Tags

So far you have insisted:

1) Lower tax rates will create jobs- wrong

2)less regulations will create jobs- wrongo

3) Now it's the uncertainity thats not creating jobs.


Why don't you pick ONE and see how it plays out


If anything created uncertainity it is the bush era tax cuts and subsequent extensions of them.

If your in business this much is certain, your taxes are going up.

Taxes are regulation. Lower my taxes, you'll see me put more left-over money into my business - advertising, inventory, building expansion, whatever. Which gives more people more jobs (not just my people, but the companies I do business with too). This isn't rocket science, Local2ED.

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- Brian


1989 500SEL Euro
1966 250SE Cabriolet
1958 BMW Isetta 600

Actually, it is, sort of. Figuring out the optimum tax rates, deductions, exemptions, subsidies, etc., involves incredibly complicated issues. As much as we wish it were simple, it's just not the sort of thing that solved with 9-9-9 plans.

You will expand it if demand is there.

How much you want to chase a dollar is up to you.

I have NEVER backed away from an investment because of a tax liability.

If I can make money I will not shy away because I have to pay a tax on it.

If I gross a $100 profit and net $1.oo on it ,It is a dollar more than I had.

It's all how much do you want it.

Actually, it's harder than rocket science . . . far less variables.

I KNEW IT.

I finally got a "job creator " to admit it.

The whole premise off lowering taxes hinges on a PROMISE to NOT POCKET the profits but to somehow create a demand for your product, which by the way wasn't there before your taxes were lowered, which will in turn cause you to hire people.

That is one magic loogee.

Another very good site.

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Back to rocket science: if you didn't know WHAT the tax liability would be, you are making dumb mistakes. Read what people say. UNCERTAINTY is the killer, and the incompetence of this administration is breeding uncertainty. That and the fact they are trying to destroy capitalism at every turn.

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MB-less

When hasn't business, large or small, faced uncertainty and risk? The weather, the price of raw materials, the ability to get to market, exchange rates, the competition . . . there have always been large and small risks. The stranglehold on business expanding, growing and hiring is that there's presently no demand, combined with companies continuing to squeeze more productivity out of workers without raising pay.

True, but until this administration, the profits that occurred, if and when they occurred, were not the stuff of stigma, and jealousy.
This administration wants the business owner to accept all that uncertainty with no prospect of a reward if it goes well.
I have difficulty defending the Wall Street arbitrage types because I see little real value in what they do. Maybe its just me and my uncomprehending mind, but I don't see how they contribute much to anything.
And remember, crony capitalism, and corporatism are not really capitalism.

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1982 300SD " Wotan" ..On the road as of Jan 8, 2007 with Historic Tags

So from what I gather from the business climate is this:

1) We can't turn a profit unless we pay ZERO taxes.

2)We really,really want to be in business but only if SOMEONE ELSE assumes OUR RISK.

Why shouldn't Business accept all of THEIR RISKS.

Profit is the reward.

Claiming you lost money this year buy ONLY making $750 mil. instead of $900 mil. IS NOT LOOSING MONEY OR NOT MAKING A PROFIT.

I think something somewhat similar happened during the S&L crisis in terms of the financial sector. Going farther back, attempts at trust busting around the turn of the century were also similar, although we haven't had anything as far reaching recently. The modern versions are relatively nuanced due to different industries and easier situations to form cartels/externalize costs, but the basics are still the same.

I also agree with you 100% about crony capitalism/corporatism. Companies will attempt to avoid competition because that drives down prices and profits as well as externalize costs because that increases profits, and while companies in an abstract sense may adhere to market principles, they are still run by people who can be influenced to the usual suspects (greed, envy, and so on). Look at the whole AT&T/T-Mobile merger. Somehow reducing competition in a field is supposed to decrease long run prices for customers? Please...