Norinco 9mm

[jplinville]

Mom found a few more of dad's guns during my visit this weekend, 3 brand new S&W J-frames in .38, and a Norinco 213 9mm. I knew he had the J-frames, but assumed he sold them prior to passing away...the Norinco was a surprise.

It's a Chinese copy of a Tokarov, but in 9mm. They were banned for import during the Clinton era, and this didn't have import markings.

The safety is assbackwards from other handguns I own...instead of turning off the safety when the switch is pushed forward, you have to pull it back to go safety on. It's an awkward handgun, for sure.

Apparently this has never been shot, at least by my dad...the internals still have a coating of cosmoline on them. It looks like it was just wiped off, covered in a rag, and put up. All of the blue is still there, and has no scratches, other than where the safety interlock is.

Has anyone here had any experience with these? I've read that they are somewhat accurate. I also read, depending on the site, that it either will go 2,000 or 20,000 rounds before needing parts replaced. I read that the 2,000 round quote is a misinterpretation or translation of the original manual that came with them.

Either way, it's getting a good cleaning then taken to the range for a warm-up.

She's keeping the J-frames...

[Nate]

Any interest in selling?

I'd give it a good home, if you're interested.

PM me, and let me know.

Thank you!
~Nate

[The Clk Man]

Originally Posted by jplinville

Mom found a few more of dad's guns during my visit this weekend, 3 brand new S&W J-frames in .38, and a Norinco 213 9mm. I knew he had the J-frames, but assumed he sold them prior to passing away...the Norinco was a surprise.

It's a Chinese copy of a Tokarov, but in 9mm. They were banned for import during the Clinton era, and this didn't have import markings.

The safety is assbackwards from other handguns I own...instead of turning off the safety when the switch is pushed forward, you have to pull it back to go safety on. It's an awkward handgun, for sure.

Apparently this has never been shot, at least by my dad...the internals still have a coating of cosmoline on them. It looks like it was just wiped off, covered in a rag, and put up. All of the blue is still there, and has no scratches, other than where the safety interlock is.

Has anyone here had any experience with these? I've read that they are somewhat accurate. I also read, depending on the site, that it either will go 2,000 or 20,000 rounds before needing parts replaced. I read that the 2,000 round quote is a misinterpretation or translation of the original manual that came with them.

Either way, it's getting a good cleaning then taken to the range for a warm-up.

She's keeping the J-frames...

Did you mean Bassackerds?

[jplinville]

Originally Posted by The Clk Man

Did you mean Bassackerds?

That, too.

So far, I've learned that these were no longer lawful to import after 1994, and that the Chinese never did get the safeties working in the proper manner. Finding information on these is like trying to find a needle in a haystack. Not impossible, but not easily found.

[Txjake]

Put me in line if you want to sell

[pj67coll]

Tokarevs were apparently not designed to have safeties.

- Peter.

[Hatterasguy]

I haven't heard much about them, but all communist guns are about the same.

Horrible ergo's, pretty simple to fix when they break, and pretty reliable. Remember they were designed for peasant soldiers.

[LUVMBDiesels]

Originally Posted by pj67coll

Tokarevs were apparently not designed to have safeties.

- Peter.

Mine, a 7.62 X 29 1953 Tok from Romania, was manufactured without a safety, but the importer put in a real simple safety. As for reliability, I put about 10000 rounds of non corrosive ammo through mine before it started to have issues with the sear and began to fire full a full round clip on one trigger pull. Since it cost me less than $200 it is not worth fixing, so now it is a paperweight

If your gun is patterned after mine, clean it well after each time you shoot it, stay away from corrosive ammo from China and do not over lubricate it. They like to run "dry"

[jplinville]

Originally Posted by LUVMBDiesels

Mine, a 7.62 X 29 1953 Tok from Romania, was manufactured without a safety, but the importer put in a real simple safety. As for reliability, I put about 10000 rounds of non corrosive ammo through mine before it started to have issues with the sear and began to fire full a full round clip on one trigger pull. Since it cost me less than $200 it is not worth fixing, so now it is a paperweight

If your gun is patterned after mine, clean it well after each time you shoot it, stay away from corrosive ammo from China and do not over lubricate it. They like to run "dry"

It's designed to shoot the 9X19 round, which is a 9mm Luger, 9mm NATO round. No worries about corrosive rounds...just finding rounds. LOL

I finally got it to push the hammer back when racking the slide...something that was nearly impossible earlier today. I couldn't hold the slide and push the frame, I had to bring it up to my chest and push them both with a bit of a snap to make it happen...now it's finally doing it as it should.

I'm not sure what I'm going to do with it yet...I may keep it as a curio, I don't know yet.

It's an interesting enough firearm...very attractive with all the bluing present. Most of my handguns are two toned stainless and black or straight stainless and one is nickel plated, so this one is different than the rest.

[jplinville]

This is what I found on Wiki...

TT pistol - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Production in China

The TT pistol was copied in China as the Type 51, Type 54,[6] M20, and TU-90.

Norinco, the People's Liberation Army's state weapons manufacturer in China, manufactured a commercial variant of the Tokarev pistol chambered in the more common 9×19mm Parabellum round, known as the Tokarev Model 213, as well as in the original 7.62×25mm caliber.

The 9mm model features a safety catch, which was absent on Russian-produced TT-33 handguns. Furthermore, the Model 213 features the thin slide grip grooves, as opposed to the original Russian wide-types. The 9mm model is featured with a magazine well block mounted in the rear of the magazine well to accept 9mm type magazines without frame modification.

The Norinco model in current production is not available for sale in the United States due to import prohibitions on Chinese firearms, although older handguns of the Model 213 type imported in the 1980s and 1990s are common.

7.62×25mm ammo is also rather inexpensive and locally produced or imported from China, also made by Norinco.

[elchivito]

I'd take one of those Smiths off your hands in a heartbeat. I don't like snubbies as a rule but the wife would like it I'm sure.
I only have experience with one of Norinco's fine products; a copy of an 870 pump 12 gauge. Complete piece of caca. Paid a kid a hundred bucks for it brand new, shot it once and sold it at a gun show for a hundred and a quarter.

[Diesel911]

Originally Posted by jplinville

Mom found a few more of dad's guns during my visit this weekend, 3 brand new S&W J-frames in .38, and a Norinco 213 9mm. I knew he had the J-frames, but assumed he sold them prior to passing away...the Norinco was a surprise.

It's a Chinese copy of a Tokarov, but in 9mm. They were banned for import during the Clinton era, and this didn't have import markings.

The safety is assbackwards from other handguns I own...instead of turning off the safety when the switch is pushed forward, you have to pull it back to go safety on. It's an awkward handgun, for sure.

Apparently this has never been shot, at least by my dad...the internals still have a coating of cosmoline on them. It looks like it was just wiped off, covered in a rag, and put up. All of the blue is still there, and has no scratches, other than where the safety interlock is.

Has anyone here had any experience with these? I've read that they are somewhat accurate. I also read, depending on the site, that it either will go 2,000 or 20,000 rounds before needing parts replaced. I read that the 2,000 round quote is a misinterpretation or translation of the original manual that came with them.

Either way, it's getting a good cleaning then taken to the range for a warm-up.

She's keeping the J-frames...

I have one.
As others have said the original had no Safety; it used a 1/2 cock notch.
They added the Safety so it could be imported. If the Safety is applied on Mine it take some force to move it.

I have not fired mine extensively because if I remember it needs Full Metal Jacketed Bullets to fire reliably. So that made it more expensive to shoot or re-load for.

While all Steel the gun is rather light weight and the force to Pull the Trigger is harder than say a GI 45. That makes it harder to shoot accurately.

I mentioned the weight already and it is a very thin compact Gun that would make it easier to conceal if you had to carry one.
It would be OK as a self defense Gun for in the House but functionally a GI typ 45 is a better weapon.
The Chinese copy of the Tokarov is likely good enough for executing some poor Villager with a shot to the back of the Head or some close range assanations.

On mine the Gun appeared to be made on worn out Machinery as the Machining of the Slide Rails and the Slide are slanted. In order to compensate for the slant the Sight needed to be drifted to one side to the extent that one end of the Sight was out of the Dove Tail. In My case I ground off the part that protruded.

Otherwise mine seems to be decently made and fitted.
When I was at the Range another Shooter was having trouble with His. We took it apart and found that the Locking Ribs/Lugs on top of the Barrel were badly peened over. Indicating that the Barrel was not being shoved high enough up into the Slide to lock properly and the Metal appeard to be too soft.

I fogot something on mine there was a lot of sharp machined edges and I took a Jewlers File and fine wet/dry Sand Paper to the sharp edges and used some cold Blueing on it.

[jplinville]

I took it to the club today, and ran a box of FMJ through it. It had great repeatability, although the sights were off about 6"...nothing that a bit of filing can't fix. The pattern was tight at 15 yards I found the trigger to have a nice crispness to it, making it fun to shoot.

From what I've read and it was repeated to me at the club today, mine is the less common model with a spacer in the mag well, forcing the use of the shorter magazine. This isn't one that can be easily converted to the 7.62 round...so 9mm only, it is.

Since I'm taking some courses for gun smithing, I'll use this as a practice handgun for customizing.

It's not something I'd purposely buy.

[Hatterasguy]

If your interested in selling it let me know, they are not worth much but it would fit nicely next to my Makarov in the Soviet part of my collection.

Or the S&W's...

[jplinville]

Keep dreaming on the wheelguns...they're already spoken for. First, they're getting loaded and placed in different places in mom's home. In time, I'll get one, and both of my brother will each get one. We're thinking that dad picked them up to hand down to us...but didn't get the chance to do it before he passed.

As for the Norinco, I was told by a buddy that owns a gun shop in Ohio that he's selling ones like mine for about $300, and the local guy said that the last one he had sold for $275. With that pricing in mind, about the only thing I'm going to do is source a set of wrap-around Tokarev grips, clean up some of the rough machining (top rail, hammer, etc.) and have it black oxided. I know a guy in Ohio that will black oxide (blue) it for me for nothing. The machining on the top rail is horrid...it looks like it was drug across a piece of asphalt, then blued. The current bluing looks good, and barely has any wear at all.

In the end, the work I do to it won't garner a higher price, but it will make it smoother and somewhat more attractive.

I'll post pictures of it later.