W123 Estate biggest in its class

[CDTurbo001]

Thoroughly enjoying my new 300CD, of course my curiosity is up as to practical, similar vehicles for wifey in place of the Cruze - which has been a good car, just small for a carseat and so-so on living up to the word "utilitarian". Also, the interior room and seat comfort don't hold a candle to the Benz.

Go-to is 300TD, but they're on the rare/desirable side and she prefers stick. Staying within 70's and 80's models, there are some offerings from Volvo, BMW, VW, etc. - but was the TD the biggest European wagon, sold in the US, of its day?

[t walgamuth]

I think you'll find the Volvo wagon the 245 has a load of room inside....perhaps more than the benz because of its square back end.

[JB3]

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

I think you'll find the Volvo wagon the 245 has a load of room inside....perhaps more than the benz because of its square back end.

this.

I had both at the same time for a while. The 300TD cannot compare with a 245 for wagon utility. Its good, but the 245 is far better, plus it doesn't have a finicky expensive hydraulic suspension you do not need.

the 700 series and the 900 series also had excellent cargo space.

Find your wife a 5 speed volvo 245.

[Mxfrank]

The biggest, plushest Euro station wagon of the era was Peugeot 505. But tell the truth, how much of a maintenance headache do you want for a DD? A Subaru Outback will more than fill the bill, be safer and cheaper to maintain.

[t walgamuth]

Subarus have a great image in the market. Too bad the quality is not there compared to an old benz. The upholstery is thin and cheap. There are a lot of head gasket problems too. My favorite machine shop always has a few subie heads floating around.

[panZZer]

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

Subarus have a great image in the market. Too bad the quality is not there compared to an old benz. The upholstery is thin and cheap. There are a lot of head gasket problems too. My favorite machine shop always has a few subie heads floating around.

What peculiar engines them iz.

[CDTurbo001]

Originally Posted by panZZer

What peculiar engines them iz.

Yeah... and a power curve even more peaky than a '617 turbo.

[Adriel]

Had a '92 Volvo 245, black on charcoal. Absolute hot box here in the desert. It was to get me some transportation until Tram finished the 300TD-T. Kind of wish had kept it, but a friend needed a vehical, not as much hauling capacity, prefer diesel, and having two vehicals at the time was expensive.

Regularly got 23M.P.G. mostly city and if needed, had get up and go, though 99 percent of the time drive conservative (they can go around as not paying for fuel). Good basic family wagon, super reliable plus solid, and for most just the ticket. That engine is so easy to work on and around.

Oh and they do fit in compact parking spots, unlike the 300TD-T.

[CDTurbo001]

Yeah, I have 3 friends+young families with Subies, the in-laws have a '95 Legacy wagon in the fencerow, and there's an '02 Outback sitting outside my shop right now, and I'm a little skeptical if Subaru is *quite* all it's cracked up to be, over decades and a few hundred thousand miles. If you're interested in keeping one well maintained it seems the gearboxes all need fluids changed frequently, parts aren't necessarily cheap (IAC valve for the Outback is $300!!!) or readily available, head gaskets on a lot of the engines used in recent times - maybe not a worse/more expensive car to own long-term than a W123, but no better and heavier on complex repairs than straight-up maintenance the W123's need to stay solid.

Peugot? Ehhhh, not sure I want to dive THAT deep into the Euro wagon hole yet!

[P.C.]

If you want to try to maintain and operate a 35 year-old Peugeot stateside, best that you first brush up on some of the better French swear words...

[t walgamuth]

I had a pug wagon. It drove nice but getting parts for it was a nightmare. I owned it a few months and fixed some stuff then sold it and got my money back more or less. but it really drove and handled nicely.

[Zulfiqar]

owning a subaru means that you have to pull the engine someday in its life, its a right of passage to change the headgaskets.

TBH, once you get the hang of it you can pull a subaru engine quicker than any mercedes. (unless you are submarining the mercedes pull)

[CDTurbo001]

Probably true about the boxer four - I measured the 2.5 in the '02 Outback the other day and it's 31" wide but only 17" long. Keeps the bell housing bolts way out in the open.

Good word about the 245. I shall keep that in mind. Any known OM617 swaps into one?

[JB3]

Originally Posted by CDTurbo001

Probably true about the boxer four - I measured the 2.5 in the '02 Outback the other day and it's 31" wide but only 17" long. Keeps the bell housing bolts way out in the open.

Good word about the 245. I shall keep that in mind. Any known OM617 swaps into one?

Doable, but you will have to do a lot of work for the 617 oil pan to clear the volvo engine cradle. It is in exactly the wrong position for the 617. Directly under the low oil pan, and possibly some suspension geometry issues modifying it. I encountered this issue in another (chevy chassis type) swap and went to considerable trouble to notch and rebuild the engine cradle so I could drop the engine down low enough to fit. Apart from things hitting in the wrong place and making things strong enough, there is plenty of room from what I remember. Its a long engine bay.

Honestly, the volvo red blocks are bulletproof. If you do decide to find one for the wife, just keep it stock. It will last every bit as long as the 617, and will be easier to repair.

[Jorn]

Originally Posted by JB3

Doable, but you will have to do a lot of work for the 617 oil pan to clear the volvo engine cradle. It is in exactly the wrong position for the 617. Directly under the low oil pan, and possibly some suspension geometry issues modifying it. I encountered this issue in another (chevy chassis type) swap and went to considerable trouble to notch and rebuild the engine cradle so I could drop the engine down low enough to fit. Apart from things hitting in the wrong place and making things strong enough, there is plenty of room from what I remember. Its a long engine bay.

Honestly, the volvo red blocks are bulletproof. If you do decide to find one for the wife, just keep it stock. It will last every bit as long as the 617, and will be easier to repair.

The B230 is pretty bullet proof, but because of the lack of oil squirters in the early B230's at around 180/200K miles there will be piston slap. The '92's and up had oil squirters and don't have that problem.