Senate Approves Bill Protecting Gun Businesses

By CARL HULSE

Published: July 30, 2005
WASHINGTON, July 29 - The Senate agreed to shield gun manufacturers and dealers from liability lawsuits on Friday, as Congress broke for a month -long recess after sending President Bush energy and transportation bills that had been years in the making.

Long sought by the gun lobby, the Senate measure - approved 65 to 31 - would prohibit lawsuits against gun makers and distributors for misuse of their products during the commission of a crime. Senate supporters said the plan was needed to protect the domestic firearms industry from a rash of lawsuits that threatened its economic future.

"This bill is intended to do one thing and that is to end the abuse that is now going on in the court system of America against law-abiding American businesses when they violate no law," Senator Larry Craig, an Idaho Republican who is a chief advocate for gun-rights causes in Congress, said Friday.

Democratic opponents of the bill disputed the assertion that a lawsuit crisis threatened the industry and said that the measure was simply a reflection of the influence of the National Rifle Association's influence over Congress.

"This is about politics, the power of the N.R.A. to dictate legislation," said Senator Jack Reed, Democrat of Rhode Island, who led the opposition to the measure.

But Senator Harry Reid of Nevada, the Democratic leader, and 13 other Democrats joined 50 Republicans and one independent to support the bill; it now goes to the House, where its prospects for approval are good when Congress returns. Twenty-nine Democrats and two Republicans opposed it.

The gun measure was just one of the significant pieces of legislation to advance as Congress cleared its plate for a fall that will initially be consumed, in the Senate at least, by consideration of a Supreme Court nominee. Before leaving, Senate Republicans and Democrats also agreed on the schedule for confirmation hearings.

Ending a long policy struggle, the Senate passed and sent to Mr. Bush a broad piece of energy legislation, fulfilling an early domestic policy goal of the administration.

After extinguishing one last policy flare-up, the House and Senate also gave final approval to a $286.4 billion highway measure stuffed with special projects for virtually every Congressional district in the nation. Congress also finished its first two spending bills of the year, delivering $1.5 billion in emergency money to cover a shortfall in veterans' health care spending.

And in an unexpected development, the Senate renewed its version of the antiterror USA Patriot Act.

It was a blistering pace compared to the usual level of legislative activity. "We either do nothing or everything at once," said Senator John Warner, Republican of Virginia.

The House adopted the highway measure on Friday morning 412 to 8; the Senate agreed to the measure later in the day 91 to 4. The bill had been delayed for years by disputes between the administration and Congress over the level of spending and fights over the formula for distributing money among the states. Its authors said it would help to ease traffic congestion around the country, improve safety, provide thousands of jobs and strengthen the economy.

"Modern highways and efficient transportation are essential to maintaining America's competitive edge," said Representative Thomas E. Petri, a Wisconsin Republican who is chairman of the highways subcommittee. "It has been a struggle to craft this bill and to be fair to every region, but its importance would be hard to exaggerate."

Critics in both the House and Senate as well as watchdog groups assailed the measure for its price tag and the wide variety of special projects - nearly 6,000 by one count - from multimillion-dollar highways and bridges to museums and recreational trails, even transportation improvements at the Bronx Zoo.

Senator John McCain, the Arizona Republican who is a frequent foe of such spending, spent almost 30 minutes on the Senate floor, singling out dozens of projects for ridicule, including $2.2 million to make landscape improvements to the Ronald Reagan freeway in California.

"I wonder what Ronald Reagan would say," said Mr. McCain, noting the late president was a critic of such Congressional largesse.

(More at NY Times)

I like your way of recycling, Botnst.

Being able to sue gun manufacturers for making a legal, lethal nonetheless, product just doesn't make sense, since it doesn't appear to be the design of the product that results in the alleged injury . . namely criminal activity. Prevent crime, promote education, but don't expect manufacturers to be the deep pocket for everyone that gets shot.

I come from South Africa where I had to wait a year to get a license for a handgun for self protection. Happily I dont feel the need for one here in Phoenix, one of the highest violent crime rates in the USA notwithstanding. Now however I do own rifles. I like collecting military surpluss firearms and have 13. Mostly Mauser rifles. I used to think that there was a case to be made for limited gun control but no longer. Crime control is what's needed, not gun control. South Africa has a particularly strong gun control mob which has succeeded in achieving exacly nothing in terms of a reduction in violent crime, which is still amongst the worlds highest. Get rid of criminals - not guns.

- Peter.

__________________
2021 Chevrolet Spark
Formerly...
2000 GMC Sonoma
1981 240D 4spd stick. 347000 miles. Deceased Feb 14 2021
2002 Kia Rio. Worst crap on four wheels
1981 240D 4spd stick. 389000 miles.
1984 123 200
1979 116 280S
1972 Cadillac Sedan DeVille
1971 108 280S

All those bored electrons, just sitting there. I try to find things for them to do.

-----

I'm curious about the S African experience with gun control, Peter. Before integration, S Africa had a low crime rate, a similar trajectory to Zimbabwe (Rhodesia for you history buffs). What is it about integration that also increased lawlessness? Are you comfortable discussing it? I understand if your not. In the USA, this gets uncomfortably close to subjects that bring out heated emotions.

B

I'd just like to debunk this myth as long as I've got a gun post to do it on.

Guns aren't supposed to be registered by the government--though they probably are, this is an infringement of your rights.

The only kind of "registration" you ever need when purchasing guns in applicable states is if you want to purchase Class III weapons (automatic rifles, machine pistols, sub-14" barrelled rifles or shotguns, or projectile weapons which fire explosive charges, i.e. grenade launchers). In this case you have to apply for a Class III weapons permit to a local Sheriff. I'm sure everyone who gets one of these permits is tracked carefully (but illegally) by the government.

Any other weapon, be it AR-15, AK-47, or Barrett .50 Cal, requires no "registration" and the purchase requirements are that the buyer must be 18, have no past history of felonies, be mentally competent, and not be an illegal citizen. Don't believe these commonly propogated myths of registration and how "easy" background checks are or that they don't take place. Don't let your constitutional rights slip away.

__________________
"I would rather be ashes than dust!
I would rather that my spark should burn out in a brillaint blaze
than it should be stifled by dryrot.
I would rather be a superb meteor,
every atom of me in magnificent glow,
than a sleepy and permanent planet.
The proper function of man is to live, not to exist.
I shall not waste my days in trying to prolong them.
I shall use my time."

-Jack London 1876-1916

1983 300CDT (running WVO since 12/05)
1981 300SD (parts car)

Actually Botnst that is a misconception. While it's true the crime rate was lower before the end of Apartheid it was not the crime free paradise many people seem to think. I believe SA had the highest murder rate back then too. Several years prior to Integration, the government had placed a moratorium on the death penalty much to the disgust of many. It was essentially as if they were losing the will to govern. Then with the change of governments and the importation of first world liberal politically correct BS, coupled with good old fashsioned third world corruption and incompetance criminals run free with no realistic method of policing them. Even assuming they are caught they are as likely to break out of jail within a few months as hang around in one for a couple of years. I remember an incident before I left where a particularly notorious gang had walked out of a jail which had a broken lock on it's door.

Essentially there was a not so gradual increase in crime for probably the last twenty years but a lot of people like to claim (incorrectly) it all started after the change in governments.

- Peter.

__________________
2021 Chevrolet Spark
Formerly...
2000 GMC Sonoma
1981 240D 4spd stick. 347000 miles. Deceased Feb 14 2021
2002 Kia Rio. Worst crap on four wheels
1981 240D 4spd stick. 389000 miles.
1984 123 200
1979 116 280S
1972 Cadillac Sedan DeVille
1971 108 280S

"This year will go down in history. For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead."

Adolf Hitler, Chancellor's speech, 1935

Germany began active gun control in 1938 by requiring permits to own/carry. The National Socialist (Nazi) party decided who qualified to do so. Obviously, history tells us what happened from there.

1) Are those gun deaths or TOTAL deaths?
2) Hard to believe Texas is not in the top 6
3) What is the rate PER CAPITA? Rank the states on that criteria.

__________________
MB-less

Surprised nobody mentioned this, but places where concealed weapons permits exist have VERY low crime rates.

__________________
MB-less

Yep. I've used this example many times. It still fits. Always will.

Mike

__________________
_____
1979 300 SD
350,000 miles
_____
1982 300D-gone---sold to a buddy
_____
1985 300TD
270,000 miles
_____
1994 E320
not my favorite, but the wife wanted it

www.myspace.com/mikemover
www.myspace.com/openskystudio
www.myspace.com/speedxband
www.myspace.com/openskyseparators
www.myspace.com/doubledrivemusic

A number of years ago, the city of Kennesaw, Georgia (a northern suburb of Atlanta) passed legislation requiring the "head of every household" to own a firearm. Crime rates quickly PLUMMETED. And have remained low ever since.

A number of years ago, England passed some pretty strict gun-control legislation. Crime rates quickly went UP. And continue to do so.

Mike

__________________
_____
1979 300 SD
350,000 miles
_____
1982 300D-gone---sold to a buddy
_____
1985 300TD
270,000 miles
_____
1994 E320
not my favorite, but the wife wanted it

www.myspace.com/mikemover
www.myspace.com/openskystudio
www.myspace.com/speedxband
www.myspace.com/openskyseparators
www.myspace.com/doubledrivemusic

Checked Arizona lately?

Whats up there?

__________________
MB-less

I'm tired of hearing the argument that only tyrants want to take away guns and anyone who is for gun control is a tyrant and wants to take away everybody's freedom. I genuinely believe that those in this country who are for more gun control are for it because they want to make this country safer from gun violence. As flawed as the logic may appear to gun advocates, they should at least admit than no one in this country, including the liberals, is trying to turn the USA into a dictatorship. I personally don't like guns, don't want to own one, and don't want to get shot by one. What am I supposed to do?

__________________
2004 VW Jetta TDI (manual)

Past MB's: '96 E300D, '83 240D, '82 300D, '87 300D, '87 420SEL

don't buy one and be nice those who have.