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  #1  
Old 02-19-2003, 10:48 PM
Kyle Blackmore's Avatar
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Exclamation CAUTION- New Police Tool !!!!!!!

Today I received a letter in the mail from the Abbotsford Police Department. Needless to say, I was a little dumbfounded when I read the following..."On January 30, 2003 your vehicle bearing license #xxxxxx was monitored from the area of Matsqui Village to the area of the Abbotsford-Langley border, a distance of 12.1 kms. The speed limit in this area ranges between 50 kmh and 60 kmh, however, your average speed exceeded 79 kmh. Your average speed was determined through a series of calculations based on the time you were seen at one location to the time you appeared at the next observation location. In each instance your license plate number and vehicle description was recorded along with the time and date. The time it takes to travel between these points should not exceed 14 minutes and 11 seconds but your vehicle travelled this distance in 11 minutes and 9 seconds, substantially less than the time it takes to LEGALLY travel the length of roadway that you were monitored upon. This means that you were travelling substantially faster than the speed limit."
The letter goes on to state that as the owner of this vehicle you are legally liable under the motor vehicle act for any violations whether you were driving or not. It also states that they reserve the right to prosecute any time within the next twelve months should it be deemed necessary. If only I had known that I was in a time distance rally!

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  #2  
Old 02-19-2003, 10:53 PM
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Man, that is some absolute "Big Brother Bull$h!t"...That crap better not come to US roads...People will be on the side of the road with a mask and a hammer, smashing those Orwellian devices! The red-light cameras and photo-radar have not gone over well in the US either.

Especially holding the OWNER responsible, whether he/she was driving or not? That is crap. What happened to the premise of "innocent until proven guilty"?

Mike
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  #3  
Old 02-19-2003, 10:54 PM
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Holy crap! The gestapo is even in Canada! I've never heard of this ploy. Hope our finest don't get wind of this. All I've seen here so far is the cute little trailers they park along the road with a built in radar and a big readout of how fast your going. So far, they aren't using them to issue tickets, just as a "reminder"
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  #4  
Old 02-19-2003, 11:14 PM
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You guys better wake up. If you ever travel on the PA Turnpike read the back of the ticket. It states something like " If your travel time is less than the minimum travel time as indicated by your ticket, you can be prosecuted".
Ever heard of the frog in boiling water??

Great editorial about it in Car & Driver. Red light cameras bring Washington, DC $66,300 in revenues - EVERY DAY!!
If you try to contest the ticket it will cost you a non-refundable $20. Neat Scam, isn't it?? If you request camera maint. records to se if it was properly calibrated, you WILL BE DENIED!!
The funniest part is that the cameras actually increased the number of accidents. One jurisdiction actually decreased the number of accidents AND the number of peolple running the red lights to a 1/10th of it's previous rate. How?? They increased the yellow light interval from 4.1 to 5.5 seconds. Needless to say that the revenue from the tickets was never the same.
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  #5  
Old 02-19-2003, 11:21 PM
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This is not a slippery slope. We have crashed down the bank and are drowning in the pool.

Right to privacy has basically been tossed into the garbage post 9-11. One big excuse to take away our rights. Bin Laden wins again.

I agree with smashing those damn cameras. However, wouldn't that be a criminal act, Mike? Hhhhmmm.

Back to B.C. You fools elected Campbell. Kick that tyrant out of office.
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  #6  
Old 02-19-2003, 11:22 PM
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The big problem with these cameras is they leave no margin of error to the drivers....Every wrong move you make = ticket..
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  #7  
Old 02-19-2003, 11:37 PM
Kyle Blackmore's Avatar
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I don't believe they were using cameras but I have noticed a couple of cars parked at the Abb-Langley border and just outside of Matsqui village.In fact this morning a Pathfinder in front of me pulled off and drove up beside the cars.There would seem to be two people at each end,I don't think they're police,maybe some auxillary Barney Fife wanna-be's.I wonder if the Pathfinder received his letter yesterday (and who knows how many more commuters going with the flow),and stopped to ,umm,have a word with them.I wonder how many more letters I'll receive ,tomorrow I'm modifying my route to avoid the Gestapo.
John, I did NOT vote for our DUI Premier (what's with Hawaii's laws anyways,DUI a misdemeanor?), though he and your Ralph could keep each other company in the drunk tank somewhere far away.
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  #8  
Old 02-19-2003, 11:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kyle Blackmore

John, I did NOT vote for our DUI Premier (what's with Hawaii's laws anyways,DUI a misdemeanor?), though he and your Ralph could keep each other company in the drunk tank somewhere far away.
Ralph is a drunken buffoon, plain and simple. The problem is that we have the "red-neck" factor at work here, and since they are all drunks too, they vote for Ralph. Campbell should have resigned after all the stupid speaches he gave about "accountability."

What an A$$.
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  #9  
Old 02-19-2003, 11:49 PM
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actually, some people (reportedly) are getting tickets for being in two places at the same time

These tickets are dismissed. I still don't get how these cameras pass the muster of "innocent untill proven guilty."
Agreed on loss of privacy after 9/11, although it's nothing new.
BTW- we were "guilty without a chance of proving innocence" for both the IRS and Insurances for years now...
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  #10  
Old 02-19-2003, 11:56 PM
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Just be glad that they haven't declared speeders enemy combatents yet.
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  #11  
Old 02-20-2003, 01:32 AM
Kyle Blackmore's Avatar
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Stewing about it all night and now my blood's just boiling !!I can't believe our taxes are being wasted in this totalitarian manner.This should get the editor's page going in the local paper,lord knows how many people are getting these letters.I'm a slowpoke in the Turtle,getting passed by 5-10 people along this route every morning.It's not a highway, just a two lane country road with curves and hollows, lined with farm and home driveways that commuters use.I received a laser speeding ticket along this route about 5 years ago and was offered the chance to avoid the demerit points and fine ($181)if I attended 'Bad Drivers' school.I had to read a manual and take a 10 question test,all of 30 minutes .Apparently the Abbotsford Police take 'Aggressive driving' seriously.
John,doesn't Canada have a long history of drunken politicians going back to Sir John A, too much pressure,eh?
Mike, if it comes to court I'll use you as my defense."No really Judge,I was just driving along when that Doubledrive song came on the radio and it just made me drive faster and faster till I was almost catching up to the guy in front of me."
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  #12  
Old 02-20-2003, 01:57 AM
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They already issue citations based on photo images here in California. Just get caught on film using one of the "Fastlane" toll lanes without the fastpass transponder. This ticket will even find you if you are driving a rental. Bummer part is, the registered owner (or rentor in the case of a rental) gets the pinch, whether the owner was driving or not.
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  #13  
Old 02-20-2003, 03:17 AM
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Here in Denmark we have had these camera-vans for a while now. (a van with black tinted windows with a laser and a camera pointing out the back, parked road-side) -They're EVERYWHERE!

If you get caught doing 51 km/h in 50 km/h zone, you get a $75 ticket. -There's NO slack!
Worst thing is that the owner of the vehicle can be forced by law to give up the name of the driver. -Basically they make you rat out your own family or friends.. That really sux!

The thing is.. These vans (and the threat of not knowing where they are) are supposed to increase the safety of traffic by making people drive slower. But what happens is, that whenever a driver see a van parked road-side, he/she slams the brakes a creates a dangerous situation. That's not very cool..

Freestyler
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  #14  
Old 02-20-2003, 05:22 AM
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Kyle wrote:

"The letter goes on to state that as the owner of this vehicle you are legally liable under the motor vehicle act for any violations "

Has any one challenged this yet?

How can they make you responsible for the speed of your vehicle if you may not be the driver?

What about company "Pool" cars, do the companies just pay up? What about busses or trucks, the owner is unlikely to also be the driver.

The only way you could (should) be prosecuted is if the police can prove the car was in your control 24 hours a day....this is a rediculous situation, your wife/son/daughter/nieghbour/guy at the repair shop could all have been driving it, maybe without your knowledge.

This definately needs challenging. In the UK the police need to prove who the driver was before they can prosecute.
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  #15  
Old 02-20-2003, 06:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by PaulG
Has any one challenged this yet?

How can they make you responsible for the speed of your vehicle if you may not be the driver?
Yes! It has been challenged. Only two weeks ago the danish supreme court made it clear that the owner of the vehicle can be forced by law to give up names of relatives or friends who was driving the car when the photo was taken. -And the guy who took this to supreme court was a police officer..!

This is the ONLY law that can force you to actually witness against your close family. -Not even in a murder case is this possible. -And i think it stinks!

Freestyler

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