haven't been here in awhile, but after checking out the new sonderklasse and the new GL450 on saturday, i had to express my disgust at what has been taking place at daimler.

i am of the bruno sacco school of car design. he has not been replaced, it seems.

firstly, these cars are ugly.

and if you thought that benz was going to de-electronify them after their last five years of electronic self-abuse, you would be wrong. in fact, it appears as if daimler has thrown more of its chips onto the table. a bad wager when it comes to my future purchasing decisions.

the GL450 has one interior design flourish that is so astoundingly ill-considered that i almost suffered from cardiac arrest. it is hard to describe it, but it involves the center console.

oddly enough, i just opened the SPORTS SUNDAY section of today's NYT. there is a review of the new S550. i think that the author of the review explains daimler's latest salvo in its electronic war on drivers quite adequately. i think you can read this on the NYT's website.

so, i shall continue to pleasure myself when driving by driving my old masterpieces of manufacturing and design['86 560SEL, '87 560SEC, '95 E320 Cabriolet, '97 S500 coupe, and the old guzzler, '79 450SEL 6.9].

i did view the new Maser Quattroporte the other day. gorgeous. if it is minimally electronified, and if i were looking for a new 4-door, it would be the one for me.

Huh,.....I thought that's what girlfriends are for.

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2007 C 230 Sport.

Hi albert champion, have you actually driven a new S-Class, or a GL, or are you basing your opinion on looks alone (or a newspaper article???). The W221 is the real deal!!! I'm not aware of any electrical problems inherent to the new S-Class or the GL. Perhaps you can elaborate? And whatever you do, please don't go into cardiac arrest!!!

i think you know what i mean about the pleasures of driving, distinct from being driven by electronified cars.

yes and no, i was going to drive the new s550. until i tried to use its computerized nonsense. you can track my posts on this automotive development in the archives, i bet.

but, succinctly, i don't like it. as bad, as user-unfriendly, as the system on the big bimmers, the big audis.

after a brief examination of the owner's manual, i vacated the car. leaving the salesman stammering. he hadn't the foggiest notion of how to modify the program either.

the gl450 is more of the same electronic nonsense. but as i said, the center console design is such a folly that it astonishes me that it got by the committee.

i prefer my automobiles analog. perhaps you don't know my story. i had a 2000 s500, a ml500 on order. when they arrived, and i went to take delivery, noticing the lcd KOMMANDO system, i refused them. best decision i ever made. garage queens, i think.

i am a geezer now, officially. i don't like d-c's slavish affection for unnecessary electronics. if mbna offered "option delete" i would delete them all.

i think that my older benzes are the best vehicles ever manufactured or designed. virtually bulletproof. i have a great mechanic. he keeps them in great shape.

the only modern vehicle of a sporting nature that i like is the jaguar xj8. virtually analog. i can rent one anywhere and drive it out of the hertz lot with no mysteries, no confusion, no hours studying a manual.

you cannot do that with any vehicle manufactured by d-c, bmw, audi, lexus, nissan.

the sad thing about the jag is that in its aluminum revision, its suspension is not as supple as its predecessor, which had the silkiest suspension i ever encountered.

my prediction: the new sonderklasse are going to be another version of electronic garage queens. it will not be restoring the sonderklasse reputation. daimler will continue to swirl down the sewer.

and my old benzes will be like gold. the real automotive cognescenti will begin to prefer them to the new ****.

i shall close this way - increasingly as i drive my antiques around metro houston, more and more people come up to me and tell me how beautiful they think they are.

if you own what i own, maintain them as i have. don't let them get away from you. if you don't own any of these, look for the well-maintained ones. acquire them, then take care of them. they will make you very happy.

my 560sel has 254,000 miles. immaculately maintained. except for bugs and rock chipping on the front, it looks and runs as if new. i have always called this the refrigerator of an automobile.

my 560sec, has 93,000 miles. looks new.

the e320cab has 19,000 miles. is virtually new.

the c140 has 43,000 miles. a killer. the last best benz coupe. quiet. fast. the last bruno sacco design.

then there is 6.9. a beauty. 55,000 miles.

none of these cars are garage queens. when they are driven. they are driven. AND DRIVEN HARD.

over the long-term, the 1986 560sel has been the most inexpensive vehicle that i have ever operated. and still one of the most fun to drive.

and i would love to get some of my earlier benzes back. i wish that i had never traded up my 1973 220 sedan. or my 240d sedan. or my 1976 450sel.

i should have kept them. little did i know that daimler engineering was going to devolve.

little did i recognize 30 years ago what watershed automotive creations those models were.

too soon old, too late smart.

I TOTALLY agree with everything you said.

I feel, that with the recent quality control concerns Mercedes has had for the past several years coupled with the lightspeed impositions of all the electronic and computer innovations, that customers must accept with the new Mercedes models, the older models are simply better for hard use in day to day driving situations.

Do you really "need" parktronic, DVD movie players, soft close doors, dashboard video games "DISTRACTO" etc?

That said, I think the NEW ones are generally smoother quieter and faster and not to take away from distronic, active suspension, faster brakes, and such I think they would be PERFECT to RENT, for a special occasion or vacation, and would delight in that, but would love to give them BACK when it was over.

Just like a big boat, small airplane, motorcycle or a helicopter.

Not my interest to be style to be saddled with daily ownership, care and feeding of the things.

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1991 560 SEC AMG, 199k <---- 300 hp 10:1 ECE euro HV ...

1995 E 420, 170k "The Red Plum" (sold)

2015 BMW 535i xdrive awd Stage 1 DINAN, 6k, <----364 hp

1967 Mercury Cougar, 49k

2013 Jaguar XF, 20k <----340 hp Supercharged, All Wheel Drive (sold)

I can't think of reading of any other post that I agree with more.

Albert Champion is my hero.

Albert, please think of me should you decide to sell any of your fleet.

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Paul S.

2001 E430, Bourdeaux Red, Oyster interior.
79,200 miles.

1973 280SE 4.5, 170,000 miles. 568 Signal Red, Black MB Tex. "The Red Baron".

me too.

tom w

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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

I have a feeling that oppurtunity might never arise...

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-Marty

1986 300E 220,000 miles+ transmission impossible
(Now waiting under a bridge in order to become one)

Reading your M103 duty cycle:
http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/831799-post13.html
http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/831807-post14.html

Agreed completely- after 20 years doing this, and being sick with what MB did to the cars I started with (the 123/126,et al) and watching the disasters we built for some years- the 221 really is all that- this is 2006, so the car has to have all the gadgets- the difference is, they work this time!!
I'm sure ILUVMILS can concur- this long after launch with the 220,211,163..the list could go on...we were up to our a@#@s with broken cars- since the 171- every car has been almost flawless- the 221 is finally a real S-Class again- worthy of the 126 heritage.

The W221 is an awsome car, looks great, and the interior simply puts the older S's to shame. So much nicer then my W126's. Get used to the electronics every single car on the road has them, unless you buy a stripped out Toyota. I find MB's to be well done and rather simple to figure out.

If I had the money I'd buy an S550 and slip it right next to my SDL, it would surely be a nice garage.

Plus they seem to be reliable, all the guys over at MBworld with them are reporting zero issues so far. I guess MB got it right this time.

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1999 SL500
1969 280SE
2023 Ram 1500
2007 Tiara 3200

The problem with the 221 compared to the 126 is that it is ugly. The 221 has wheel arches that don't belong on the car. It looks like a 3rd grader used the "rectangular" end of a marker pen to draw the wheel arches.

The 126 was perfectly designed when new, and is a timeless classic.

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Paul S.

2001 E430, Bourdeaux Red, Oyster interior.
79,200 miles.

1973 280SE 4.5, 170,000 miles. 568 Signal Red, Black MB Tex. "The Red Baron".

You can't automatically assume that a car as new as the 221 is reliable. It was just released a few months ago, not much longer before that in other parts of the world.

Didn't hear about the faults of the 211 until quite some time after they debuted.

You should be a salesman for the Mercedes-Benz new car dealer. I respectfully disagree with your viewpoint. I have the opportunity to compare these cars back to back every week. Although our opinions are subjective.

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1987 300SDL (324000)

1986 Porsche 951 (944 Turbo) (166000)

1978 Porsche 924 (99000)

1996 Nissan Pathfinder R50 (201000)

Just reporting what I am hearing, and what I think thats all. If you ever read what the new owners are saying most of the new S's seem to be pretty trouble free so far.

Their is a percentage of people here that will hate any car made after the W126. So be it. I'm 20, I will be buying MB's 50 years from now. W126's are yesterdays news, nice cars but their time has come and gone. I want nav, I want a 20 speaker sound system that I can hook an Ipod, or cell phone to. I like how on my Uncles late model BMW, when you pick up the phone the stereo cuts out. I want features like that. I want climate control and heated and cooled seats, Xenon lights, ABC, AWD ect. I like the new cars a lot, their style and design work for me.

Lots of people hate the W220. I like them a lot. I think the W211 is one of the best looking E's yet. The new CLK, CL, and SL are simply awsome.

The GL and R are the only disapointments I find in MB's currant line up.

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1999 SL500
1969 280SE
2023 Ram 1500
2007 Tiara 3200

That's fine.

Opinions are subjective of course...I LOVE the 220, and I don't see why many claim the interior is cheap. It is a nimble, and sporty S-Class that harkens back to the W116 road feel. A W116 with COMAND.

I used to own a 210, which was an excellent car, very quick, and got mileage rivaling a 123 turbodiesel. Only with 275 hp.

So, although I may seem like an old kodger with 3 W126's, completely biased and such, I'm really not entirely so.

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1987 300SDL (324000)

1986 Porsche 951 (944 Turbo) (166000)

1978 Porsche 924 (99000)

1996 Nissan Pathfinder R50 (201000)

Not saying your an old fart...

Different strokes for different folks I guess.

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1999 SL500
1969 280SE
2023 Ram 1500
2007 Tiara 3200