The 2 cases I mentioned dealt with a couple of older 3rd gen. Honda vehicles(1986-1989) that I once owned. Vent temps on like days(humidity/ambient temps) were recorded when R-12 was installed and gauge readings would indicate a fully charged system. Vent temps were in the 43-45 degree range with ambient temps right at 95F using R-12.

These vehicles are prone to developing faulty low pressure switches, especially after 10 or more yrs. of service - sometimes less. They leak and there goes the juice. I happened to have a full case of Freeze-12 available and decided to give it a go as these were old cars(over 300,00 miles) and I wasn't sure how much longer I'd have them in my stable. When I did this switch, Freeze-12 was approx. 1/3 the cost of R-12.

Systems were evacuated and recharged with Freeze-12. In the same weather conditions, vent temps were now 38-40 degrees with the Freeze-12. A year later all was well - same temps. I sold the cars, so I have no idea how that's worked out.

I'm acquainted with a fellow who owns a small Euro repair shop. While I do not condone his full-time use of Freeze-12, he claims that Freeze-12 produces colder vent temps. I do not believe he's gone as far as I did with the before/after data, but he has reported favorable response from his customers. Supposedly, many have reported their units are colder than in previous times when R-12 was in use. I realize this is not scientific, but it's kind of like the world of computer performance. One can view monitors and performance reporting information all day long, but in the end, the ultimate positive indicator is a phone that's no longer ringing.

In spite of all of this. I'm pretty much of the agreement that if you're going to keep a car long-term, R-12 is the way to go.

I was merely responding to the previous "and they're not as cold" post. One should not make such blanket statements.

__________________
Mike Murrell
1991 300-SEL - Model 126
M103 - SOHC
"Fräulein"

More info than you'd probably ever want to know about vehicle A/C system CFC-12 substitutes - Most info updated recently

http://www.epa.gov/ozone/snap/refrigerants/lists/chiller.html

http://www.epa.gov/ozone/snap/refrigerants/reflist2004.pdf

bnc

This can also happen, all the time:

Car goes into shop for a/c work, has been topped up with Freeze12.
a/c reclaim machine hooked up...
Expensive 30lb cylinder of R12 is ruined because of contamination by the Freeze12.

You can also use propane as a add in to a R12 system, until there is a serious fire/explosion. Don't laugh, I know a used car dealer who had a van catch fire because someone filled the system with propane.

Not to mention, the Freeze12 isn't going to mix well with mineral oil in a R12 system.