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  #1  
Old 10-24-2006, 04:14 AM
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Head gasket change questions M117

Ok, i'm finally going to get around to changing my m117's head gaskets.
Couple of questions really.. What should I order?

Definately:
Head gasket sets,
Intake boot thing,
New fluids,

Maybe:
Head bolts?
Valve stem seals?

All other engine related maintinance is up to date, ie chain, guides and cam oiler plastics. My engine doesnt produce blue smoke, so i'm not sure if I should do the valve stem seals.

When I had my parts car, I tried taking off the intake manifold, but the allen headed bolts refused to budge and rounded, any tips on avoiding this again?

Finally, what do I do with regards to the chain before taking the head off?

Ben

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  #2  
Old 10-24-2006, 08:10 AM
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Location: Tucker, Ga USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben12345 View Post
Ok, i'm finally going to get around to changing my m117's head gaskets.
Couple of questions really.. What should I order?

Definately:
Head gasket sets,
Intake boot thing,
New fluids,

Maybe:
Head bolts?
Valve stem seals?

All other engine related maintinance is up to date, ie chain, guides and cam oiler plastics. My engine doesnt produce blue smoke, so i'm not sure if I should do the valve stem seals.

When I had my parts car, I tried taking off the intake manifold, but the allen headed bolts refused to budge and rounded, any tips on avoiding this again?

Finally, what do I do with regards to the chain before taking the head off?

Ben
Start by marking locations of chain vs the gears at TDC..use a mark that WONT wash off.

I wouldn't spend that much time & not have a valve job & guide replacement done!

ALL of the idle balance rubber hoses to the injector insulators & anything rubber & plastic should be replaced.
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  #3  
Old 10-24-2006, 09:31 AM
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What would a machine shop charge for a valve job and a head resurface?

This car is my daily beater, so I dont want to go over the top with it. It runs great apart from it using water.

Do I zip tie the chain to the cam sprocket and remove the sprocket from the camshaft?
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  #4  
Old 10-24-2006, 10:13 AM
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Expect to pay 250-350 a head for machining. I agree, to have the heads off and Not so the guides is a false economy.

There are also 8 large seal rings on the intake plenum. Plan on doing those as well as what was mentioned above.

I'd also pick up some industrial grade paint stripper..it will do a good job cleaning out the intake manifolds of all the built up carbon.

I'd also block off the air injection passages while you are @ it. they have a habbit of clogging/making a mess over time so I typically block them off and remove the air pump.

Jonathan
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  #5  
Old 10-24-2006, 10:16 AM
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Around this area $500-$600 for valves & guides.

Spending 20 hrs & not at least having them inspected would be a big waste of time!
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  #6  
Old 10-24-2006, 10:25 AM
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Well, i'm planning on having the heads resurfaced anyway, so i'll ask them to look at the valves and guides when I take them in.
The whole car only cost me £80 ($150 or so) and i've been using it for 2 years, so it doesn't owe me anything.
One one hand, i'd just like it up an running on the cheap, but the engineer in me wants it all done right.

Edit:
Should have said, the car is a euro, so doesnt have air injection.
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  #7  
Old 10-24-2006, 11:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben12345 View Post
Do I zip tie the chain to the cam sprocket and remove the sprocket from the camshaft?
IIRC the sprocket won't go through the head. I don't know if there is a risk of the chain slipping off an unseen sprocket. What I did ages ago is use a third hand to keep tension on the chain while lifting the head then use the third hand to pull the chain under the head when the head was several inches above the block.

How about new exhaust manifold nuts? I believe they use deformed copper nuts that don't hold so well the second time around.

Do you have the offset hex bit that lets you get to the head bolts blocked by the cam?

http://www.shoptoolsshoptools.com/shopexd.asp?id=2912

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  #8  
Old 10-24-2006, 11:52 AM
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Are the nuts M8? I have a box of locking copper M8's, otherwise i'd have to order them too. I dont have an allen socket thats like that, but my short (1")allen socket seemed to fit ok when I retorqued the head bolts not too long ago.

So I have to break the chain on each sprocket and wire the ends for a helper to hold onto?
Is there a position on the crank where the pistons are all in such a fasion that the camshafts are free to rotate without valve to piston interferance? IIRC on my Porsche V8 its 45'.
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  #9  
Old 10-24-2006, 11:56 AM
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Don't break the chain, just slip it off the sprocket after you remove the tensioner.

IIRC there is no non-interference position of the cam.

Sixto
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  #10  
Old 10-24-2006, 04:43 PM
david s poole
 
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117 top end o/haul

three things have been missed.there are chain rail pins that need to be pulled.requires tool or creative thinking using 6mm bolts and spacers.the aluminium block needs to have the head bolt holes drilled,tapped and heilicoiled.[with steel bolts in alu threads it's not a case of if but when the threads will break]lastly completely o/haul the intake manifold.replace anything with rubber including the large rubber below the fuel distributor plenum.watch out for the allen head bolts in the intake they will strip out very easily.best to have 6 point star socket handy that you can hammer into the bad bolts and then they will come out.
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  #11  
Old 10-25-2006, 03:45 PM
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That brings me onto my next question.. What is the thread pitch of the M10 head bolts? I need to order a tap and coil inserts to suit.
I think the cause of my head gasket going was the problem of one of the head bolts stripped out of the head. I found this out when trying the old retorque head bolts trick.
I'm also ordering some screw and stud extractors for the intake bolts as a last resort if the torx bit trick doesn't work.
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  #12  
Old 10-25-2006, 06:18 PM
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You are going to need a special jig for drilling/taping the block. The bolts don't thread in perpendicular to the face of the block. I believe the jig runs about 500$ here in the US.
I know Ashenmacher sells a kit w/ the correct drill bit/tap and MB has the correct heli coils.

Jonathan
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  #13  
Old 10-26-2006, 07:58 AM
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I just called MB to get a price on the jig and special piloted tap. The jig runs at 447GBP so we're looking at about $800. The Ashenmacher jig I have sourced for $377 so about £200 plus shipping and import duty to the UK. This is still alot of money for something i'm only going to use once (well twice).
I'm going to try calling around to some so-called MB specialists locally and see if they have one they'd rent out to me... I'm not optimistic though.... the w116 and w126 is a rarely seen car here, especially with a V8
Is there any trick I can use to not use the jig?
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  #14  
Old 10-26-2006, 10:21 AM
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I've done the job some 15 times and I wouldn't trust it Not using the jig. If you screw up then your going to be up quite the creek.

Jonathan
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  #15  
Old 10-26-2006, 10:36 AM
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I called into the Mercedes specialists, and they have never done the job. They said that they would use the machine shop in our next town. They do most of the machine work for the local garages around here and have a good reputation. They said that the machine shop would come out to drill and helicoil the block in situ. Whats anybodys views on this?

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