Question about W140 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

pj67coll · #1 04-22-2007, 04:40 AM

Anybody have any experience of W140's? I'm contemplating the possibility of a 99 S320 with about 85K miles. Along with possibly an 84 500SEC with about 135K. Apparently the facelifted W140 S320 is an all aluminum V6. Don't know if I'm all that happy about that. I dont really like V6's to begin with and I'm not convinced of the longevity of an aluminum block. Anybody have any input on this?

- Peter.

softconsult · #2 04-22-2007, 08:30 AM

The best years for the W140 are 97 - 99. Those years are the last 3 years of the model run and therefore are the most sorted out. The S320 is not an all aluminum V-6. It is the venerable M104, Inline 6, variable cam timing, 228 HP. In the opinion of many, one of the best engines MB has ever produced. I had a '93 E320 with that engine that had 254K on it. Engine ran perfectly. My '92 300E M103 has essentially the same engine, with a different head and valve train, 242K and running strong. The M104 engine in the S320 is very easy to work on due to the size of the engine compartment.

The car has the 722.6 Electronic Transmission that is allegedly "Sealed for Life". A '99 will have software upgrades and the latest build specs. This is a good thing. MB now recommends changing tranny fluid and filter every 40,000 miles or so.

What are the issues? Potential A/C Evaporator leak, cost $3,000 as the entire dash must be removed. Head gasket leak, probable replacement required , if not already done. Lower control arm bushings will be due for replacement, say $500.00 installed. That's about it.

I swore I was going to stick with 124's, but then begain to research the S320's. I found one locally with 106K, fully dealer serviced with all records. It is light years more comfortable than the 124, great seats, great stereo, CD in the trunk. Wonderful road car. Gets low 20's on the highway at 75 mph. Has laminated glass on the side windows. Very quiet on the road.

Hopefully, your target car has records. Spend the money for a Pre-Purchase inspection.
I paid $11,800 for mine 8 months ago.

Steve
'97 S320 116K
'92 300E 242K

BENZ-LGB · #3 04-22-2007, 12:13 PM

Steve, do you find that the M104 engine puts out enough power to move a car as big and heavy as the S320?

I have a 300CE and a 300TE (M104 and M103). Power is adequate for the coupe and wagon but I always wondered if it was enough for the bigger W140 sedan.

Personally, I like the W140 bodies--I know most other people did not like them though.

pj67coll · #4 04-22-2007, 01:53 PM

Thank's for the input folks. Softconsult. I'm also curious about the ability of the six to move the W140 decently. Although as a 240D owner almost anything might be an improvement. As for the shape. From most angles I'd say the car is not as elegant as it's predecessors. But I'm prepared to overlook that for it's sheer presence. Rather like a Tiger tank I've always thought.

- Peter.

stevebfl · #5 04-22-2007, 02:30 PM

The six in that car does an amazing job of propelling it. I think it does better than the early 400s. Got to be gearing!

BENZ-LGB · #6 04-22-2007, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pj67coll

... Rather like a Tiger tank I've always thought.

- Peter.

Me too!

It always looked like a small tank to me.

Steve, I think that the double-paned glass applied only to the early models. When MB dropped prices on their line-up (in response to Lexus) I think they dropped the double-paned glass.

rchase · #7 04-22-2007, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BENZ-LGB

Steve, do you find that the M104 engine puts out enough power to move a car as big and heavy as the S320?

I have a 300CE and a 300TE (M104 and M103). Power is adequate for the coupe and wagon but I always wondered if it was enough for the bigger W140 sedan.

Personally, I like the W140 bodies--I know most other people did not like them though.

Yes. The engine puts out about 230hp and the car will really get up and move when it needs to. Keep in mind that in europe they have S280's as the base model.

deanyel · #8 04-22-2007, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by softconsult

The best years for the W140 are 97 - 99.

The most sorted out perhaps but also the most cheapened, and with the most troubled and expensive to rebuild transmission. For 1990s for Mercedes was a mad dash to reduce build costs while trying to minimize degradation of the product. Sometimes they won, sometimes they lost. A mid-90s S320 with HFM and 722.5 transmission is a very nice car, same EPA rating as the later cars, better in many ways for a DIYer, and very much worth considering. Wiring harness issue, yes, but they have virtually all already been updated.

softconsult · #9 04-22-2007, 04:31 PM

Question about power of the 6 in the W140. It's all about gearing. In S mode I think 0 to 60 is between 8 and 9, but let's get real here. Why is that number at all important to most of us non-teenage drivers. If you want to drive it fast then nail it and it will go like hell. Reality is that you are not going anywhere that fast due to traffic in front of you and speed limits.

What I really like is that when cruising at say 70 the rpm's are something like 2,600 ish. Need to pass? Just tap the the lever to the left and it's the perfect passing gear.
I drive around town in W (Winter) mode. Starting in Second gear, you will see a very rapid climb past 3,000 rpm. If the transmission croaks, then $4,000 + 11,800 is still only $15,800. Show me any thing I want to drive for that price.

Cheapened? Not that I can tell, and I really like the look of the restyled versions after what '96.

Steve

TimFreeh · #10 04-22-2007, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by softconsult

I paid $11,800 for mine 8 months ago....

Thats a lot of car for 12k - great value and a smart purchase.

HoustonM3 · #11 04-22-2007, 03:07 PM

No , all the W140's had the double paned glass. Our 98 S500 has it.

BENZ-LGB · #12 04-22-2007, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HoustonM3

No , all the W140's had the double paned glass. Our 98 S500 has it.

Cool, I like that feature.

Does your have the door close assist feature?

I really like the W140s. I like the bulk!

rchase · #13 04-22-2007, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BENZ-LGB

Cool, I like that feature.

Does your have the door close assist feature?

I really like the W140s. I like the bulk!

The door close along with the double paned argon filled glass were standard features on the 140. Here are some other neat standard toys on the 140.

-double paned argon filled side glass
-pneumatic door closing assist
-power rear shade
-power retractable rear headrests
-pneumatic trunk close assist with retractable chrome handle
-power retractable side mirrors
-11 speaker bose audio system with center channel behind rear view mirror and 4 deckmounted subwoofers.
-handsfree phone prewiring in center console with microphone and dedicated speakers
-convenience module which allows remote open and close of all windows and sunroof from keyless remote or from drivers side key. Remote unlock from trunk with key. Dual IR and RF transmission.
-power tilt telescope steering wheel

Hatterasguy · #14 04-22-2007, 07:50 PM

The S320 is a great car, the later ones are about as sorted out and trouble free as your going to get.

The M104 moves it with authority. If you want speed buy the S500, if you want better fuel mileage get the S320. The 420 is in between on both accounts.

softconsult · #15 04-22-2007, 10:43 PM

Here are a few more features.
Side Air-bags with weight sensitivity for Passenger side bag.
Auto-Dimming Rear View Mirror
Tinted glass sunroof with sliding covered headliner.
Rain Sensing WIpers - 2 wipers and Driver side articulates
Wiper Fluid sprays from three sets of two hole units.
Projector Headlights - Close to Euros but not quite.
ASR - Anti slip regulation - It works well.
Speed Sensitive Power Steering - Light around town, heavier on the highway.
I would prefer a heavier feel on the highway, like my 124.
When you lock the car at night, some special lights come on for 30 seconds to light your way.

Ability to chose whether warm or cold or no air comes out of the center vent.
You can use the climate control unit to display real time data from sensors, like coolant temp etc.
There is a cabin filter and a charcoal filter for the cabin. Somehow it will sense the presence of certain pollutants/chemicals and switch to the charcoal filter.

The seats are the best I have ever experienced and they are heated with two levels, at least mine are, think that might be standard.

The paint shows non-of the orange peel you can easily detect on newer MB.

What happened to me is that you really become rapidly accustomed to the the roominess and comfort. I have four vehicles to choose from and the S is almost always the choice.

This car changes my driving mood. It is so smooth that I tend to just cruise rather than sport around as I do in the 124 Sportline.

As to the test drive question, I would do the following:

1. Ask to see the service records and take some time reviewing them.

2. Before you start the car, engine cold, take the top off the expansion tank and eyeball the coolant. Is it Green? If yes then that's a problem, as correct coolant should be sort of light orangish to amber colored.

3. Look at the brake fluid reservoir. Is the fluid dark colored? Dark could equal never changed.

4. Pop off the air cleaner top and eyeball the filter.

5. Take the oil filler cap off and eyeball what you can see. Should be clean.

6. Reach down and run your hand along the serpentine belt. Feel any cracks?

7. Look for white spots around the coolant system. Indicates past leak.

8. Look down the head on passenger side toward the back. See any evidence of oil leak?

9. Start car and test every function from A/C to Heat to Turn Signals. Try every seat control. Including the control that changes the length of the seat bottom. Check seat heaters on both sides.

10. Check the mirrors. Ask the salesman how you fold the mirrors back with the little control stalk.

11. On the drive check to wheel vibration.

12. Listen for wind noise. You should hear very little noise.

This is the reason for a Pre-Purchase Inspection. You may not know or be willing to do all of this inspection. Some of it can't be done without a floor jack or a lift. I always want to know if the center and rear mufflers are intact and not rusted through.

Of course in the midst of all this someone could come along and buy it out from under you.
When I bought mine, there was another guy enroute as I finalized the deal. He actually showed up, so it wasn't salesman BS.

Steve

Steve