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Old 06-04-2001, 03:26 PM
Kuan's Avatar
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Speaking of radial engines, I heard that you could put a bullet through one of those barrels and the thing would still keep going. Could someone confirm or deny this?

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Old 06-04-2001, 04:01 PM
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Whats a VW VR6 engine?
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Old 06-04-2001, 10:05 PM
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Location: ajax, ontario, canada
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i've seen a documentary of the P-47 Thunderbolt, and a testimony of a pilot who took a couple of rounds in the engine, and was able to make it home.

a VR6 engine is VW's narrow-angle V6 engine fitted into some Golf, (previous-generation) Passat and Corrado models. Because the V angle is very small, the engine has only one head for the 2 banks. This makes it compact enough to fit transversely into these small cars.

because of the single head servicing the 2 banks, you can imagine the design of the intake and exhaust plumbing passages cast into the head.
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Old 06-05-2001, 02:14 AM
BB BB is offline
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So if you had a choice?

Ok so this topic is pretty interesting lets say that Mercedese was reading these columns and trying to get into the heads of its clients,
what would be the layout that you as a customer would wish for if you had a say in the style of motor of future benzes and why that type? EG smoothness or travel comfort(Straight) Or V format for torque and low down grunt maybe a supercharger for top end performance and cruising (Towing and heavy loads / lots of people etc)

Boxster for staight out sporting about(Maybe throw in a turbo or two)You could get away with smaller motor but still have the power, it would save on fuel if nothing else.

Just a thought, what say the others?
W123 280Te 1982 Modified & still going
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Old 06-05-2001, 05:10 PM
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Mercedes V8

Originally posted by bobbyv
the typical American 90-degree V8 can be brought into perfect balance via the use of counterbalance weights.

A Ferrari V8 however is different. Although it is also a 90-degree V8, it has a flat crankshaft (i.e. the throws are all on one plane). Although not perfectly balanced, it has an even firing order (i.e. the engine pulses are regularly spaced), which gives it better high-rpm breathing and that distinctive shriek that cannot be mistaken for the typical American V8.

I was fascinated when I heard this. I had always wondered why Ferrari manage to sound so different to the American V8. Makes me wonder, which type of V8 is the SL 500 V8? the American style or like the Ferrari?

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Old 06-05-2001, 05:36 PM
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I would take an inline (8 cylinder?) with a turbo. I would LOVE that!
Is the reason they never made inline 8s (mass, i mean, or did they), was because of the lack of proper space to place the engine?
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Old 06-05-2001, 06:20 PM
Dirty Ern
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My dad had a 49 Buick Roadmaster (2 door fastback style), and if my memory serves me right, it was a huge overhead straight 8. I was still teething on my Allstste scooter at the time and didn't have time for anything else.
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Old 06-05-2001, 08:32 PM
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Chrysler, Packard, Pontiac, Buick all had straight engines in the 30s 40s and early 50s. I think the Duesenberg had a straight 8 Lycoming aircraft engine. Mercedes had straight 8 engines but possibly not in production models.
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Old 06-05-2001, 10:57 PM
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i believe the Benz V8 engines use the traditional, American-style V8 arrangement ... refinement is more important than raucious sounds for the intended audience ...

i hope Benz brings back the inline-6. I hope they will improve on the M104 (engine gaskets, wiring harness, etc.). But if the existing V-sixes continue to live up to their initial reputation of reliability and build quality, then i would just not look under the hood ... a supercharger in between the banks will also help make me forget the inline-6 ... ;-)

the Lexus IS300 had to have the inline-6 to be a worthy competitor to the BMW 3-series. Volvo has a turbo inline-6 mounted transversely (the only one in the world mounted this way). Even GM has a new 4.2li inline-6 which outperforms many V8s.

until then, i hope there will be many many more kms in my 2.6 M103 ...

[Edited by bobbyv on 06-06-2001 at 12:05 AM]
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Old 06-06-2001, 02:00 PM
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Not only did we used to have inline 8's, but some folks built V-16s. When a friend of mine saw one he asked the owner how he would diagnose a miss. A moment later he realized that he probably simply wouldn't care.

Aren't there W9's out there?

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Old 06-06-2001, 02:40 PM
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They did build straight eights and Mercedes were the finest exponents of the art. Many pre-war GP cars were fitted with straight eights and Mercedes had the best of all. Alfa Romeo used a straight eight, as did Auto Union (now absorbed by Audi). I take it your mother has a 993?

The finest engine must surely be the V-12, and probably the finest V-12 is the Jaguar V-12 in 6.0 litre form. Normally aspirated: forced induction always seems to detract from engineering purity, hence the supremacy of BMW's M3 or M5 motors or, indeed, the V-12 they fitted to the McLaren F-1 (now that might pip the Jag).

As for interesting engines, how about the latest VW W-8 and Audi W-12? Bentley will apparently get a W-16 from the VW fold. Bugatti (also VW) will apparently utilise a 1001 bhp W engine, either 16, 18 or 24 cylinders, depending who you believe. This W configuration is in fact a double U format: two narrow angle V engines joined at the crank. A servicing nightmare!

Mercedes has, of course, threatened a 1000 bhp V-24 for the Maybach but this has apparently been shelved in favour of a less satisfactory twin turbo V-12.

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Old 06-06-2001, 03:23 PM
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now what would they call that engine - a VW double-U ?

a marketing nightmare!


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Old 06-06-2001, 03:24 PM
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I had a 92 Jag XJS convertible with the 6.0L V-12 (traded it in for the 500SL). The engine was smooth and seemed to be able to accelerate to stratospheric top speeds, but you didn't have to worry about neck injuries when you tromped on the pedal...I guess Jaguar meant for the car to be a touring vehicle, and not a weekend drag strip contender...
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Old 06-06-2001, 06:02 PM
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G-Benz: you will remember that your Jag was fitted with a 3-speed GM slush box (strange, given that even then, Jag was owned by the General's arcg-rival, uncle Henry). The old 6.0 litre V-12 (or the 5.3 for that matter) had so much torque that a gearbox should have been an optional extra.

Sure, for all out punch it wasn't competing (7.3 secs to 60 if memory serves) but for smoothness and refinement, the Jag, despite its 20 year old technology (now 30 yr old) was better than anything that went before or since). I remember Georg Kacher, German auto journalist, prefering the Jag soft top over the 600SL simply because it was the more refined, and hence luxe, sports tourer.

All that said, I passed a copule of XJ-Ss in driving rain and otherwise foul conditions on the M62 today (the UK's highest motorway at 1,112 feet(!!!)) and I was glad I wasn't driving one myself. G-Benz, you will have seen under the bonnet, and that engine truly was "the plumber's nightmare". But the car had charm in abundance.
JJ Rodger
1999 SL 500
1993 320 TE
1986 500 SEC
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Old 06-07-2001, 12:15 AM
Chris Ecklund
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Boxing Anyone?

The Honda Goldwing has used the flat 4 for some 20 years, and I have owned 3 of them. I will never forget when they showed a silver dollar on the engine case with it running.
The low centre of gravity makes it ideal for motorcycles, and in my opinion, this makes it the perfect engine for a bike.My Goldwing 1000c.c. was actually easier to handle than my honda 750 which hade an inline 4 sideways in the frame. Most people cant feel the difference, but if you had a flat engine in your car, I think it would definetly handle better around corners.

Yes, when sitting still and revving the throttle, the bike will lean to the right side!!!!

Airplanes have used the flat 4 for 30-40 years in applications around the world, Continental, Lycoming, etc... Small compact, excellent balance, etc..

The in-line 6 has perfect primary balance.
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