W124 Sunroof Issue - Tilt okay - No Slide - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Addbhp · #1 04-14-2009, 06:47 PM

This issue just started this weekend. I still have the tilt/vent function, but the ability to slide back isn't working. The sunroof drops down, but won't move back. When the tilt works, the liner panel also started to get hung up last week, but by starting the slide back function, which worked last week brought the panel down. Car is a 1990 300e. With spring finally here and no AC I really love my sunroof. Did a seach but all links to images have expired. I only have the car manual, no repair manual so as much detail would be great.

babymog · #2 04-14-2009, 11:11 PM

Might be simple binding cable. Did it work slowly before, or quickly and consistantly?

Addbhp · #3 04-15-2009, 07:00 AM

Was working perfectly before last week, when the lining wasn't dropping fully when closing from the tilt. But had been nice and smooth, greased last year, no noise.

If a cable is binding, how would I access that?

sean33612 · #4 04-15-2009, 11:12 AM

lol, i have a 1991 300e and it does that sometimes, the tilt would always work perfectly, but sometimes after it closes, you could find that the sunroof on the right side dosent close down all the way, its not noticible, but when you push the padding it goes up so that you see the gap, but even with that the sunroof slides perfectly, its just at random times it wont slide. youll hear the belt running for bout 2 sec then it stops, but it dosent even move in that 2 sec, it just wouldent budge, but there are random days which it works fine.

Addbhp · #5 04-15-2009, 03:41 PM

I got a slightly better look at lunch at the passenger side lining, looks like it has come unattached, and is not rising with the tilt function, will try tonight to see if reattaching that helps, although not exactly sure how it's connected to the metal panel.

JonL · #6 04-15-2009, 04:08 PM

My W201 roof acted like that for a short while, now it does nothing. It seems that the mechanism that raises the back of the roof has broken and is jamming the roof. The FSM says that the roof must be partially opened to remove it, and I cannot open my roof at all so I am in a bit of a quandary. I've managed to slip the interior trim back and I think I can remove some of the hardware that will allow me to take the roof panel out, but I'm waiting 'till the weather is consistently warm to fool with it some more. Perhaps your roof is on its way to a similar fate?

Jeremy5848 · #7 06-29-2009, 12:09 PM

My 1987 300D Turbo (W124, OM603) is currently at the local dealer for exactly that problem. They completely rebuilt the sunroof last September using all the latest upgraded parts.

I use the pop-up feature a lot but rarely slide the sunroof open. A week ago, in cleaning the car, I decided to open the sunroof and found that it would move only an inch or two and then stall. I immediately closed the sunroof (the tilt still worked, BTW) and took the car back to the dealer.

They found that some of the new parts had broken (the cast pot-metal track pieces) and are replacing them on warranty. So far, they have not been able to find a cause. The sunroof motor has never been replaced and they are not eager to do so since it would cost me over $400 plus labor. However, they can't find anything else to point to.

At the moment, I'm waiting to get the car back (they even gave me a loaner for the weekend, a 2009 C350). The service manager's advice of last Friday was "don't use the sliding part of the sunroof, since we can't figure out what is causing the parts to break."

I pass on this tale for the information of others and also to ask if anyone has had a similar problem that was eventually traced to the motor or clutch.

Jeremy

Jeremy5848 · #8 06-30-2009, 12:30 PM

OK, the dealer's mechanic has figured out the problem. Turns out that the breakage of the bridge was caused by old damage in the headliner panel, which they did not catch and replace last September when they did the overhaul of the sunroof.

In the W124, the headliner panel (124 780 02 40) has two fabric "side flaps" (I'll call them) that act as wind blocks when the sunroof is popped open at the rear. In my headliner, one of the side flaps was worn and the other was actually broken loose at one end. This end jammed in the track on one of the few occasions when I actually opened the sunroof, causing one of the bridges to break.

This is a much better hypothesis than "bad motor," which neither I nor the service manager liked. The good news is that the part is still available and the dealer will install it for free and not charge me for the broken parts, which is reasonable since they should have caught the headliner problem last September.

The bad news is that the headliner has to come from Germany and even with 15% MBCA discount will cost me $500.

If I were doing this job all by myself I would try to repair the existing panel but since the dealer is doing the work, I want to leave them with absolutely no excuses if there is ever another failure.

This is the first concrete reason I've ever read for why 124 sunroofs break, aside from old, dirty, lack of grease, cable broke, etc. I pass it along in case it might help someone else. There are threads here and elsewhere with good DIY instructions for taking the sunroof apart. If yours still opens, you might consider removing the headliner panel just to see what condition it's in. Might save you some later grief.

Jeremy

remotemark · #9 06-30-2009, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeremy5848

This is a much better hypothesis than "bad motor," which neither I nor the service manager liked. The good news is that the part is still available and the dealer will install it for free and not charge me for the broken parts, which is reasonable since they should have caught the headliner problem last September.

The bad news is that the headliner has to come from Germany and even with 15% MBCA discount will cost me $500.

Jeremy

You can get a brand spanking new headliner from World Upholstery or GAHH for half that. There are even less expensive quality ones, too.

Jeremy5848 · #10 06-30-2009, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by remotemark

You can get a brand spanking new headliner from World Upholstery or GAHH for half that. There are even less expensive quality ones, too.

Apples and oranges. I'm not talking about the headliner per se but a part of the sunroof. That has to come from Mercedes (or from a junkyard).

oso · #11 06-30-2009, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeremy5848

Apples and oranges. I'm not talking about the headliner per se but a part of the sunroof. That has to come from Mercedes (or from a junkyard).

So what was the ballpark cost of having the dealer do it? I have the same car you do and sounds like the same problem you had.

ps2cho · #12 06-30-2009, 04:32 PM

How can you get the headliner off if it does not open?

babymog · #13 06-30-2009, 06:10 PM

That's a part I've thrown away a couple of times, used should be under $20 and a good 10minute replacement job.

Jeremy5848 · #14 06-30-2009, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oso

So what was the ballpark cost of having the dealer do it? I have the same car you do and sounds like the same problem you had.

I managed Friday to get the service manager to admit that he had at least 12 hours of shop labor into the job, not counting this latest stuff on the inner panel (the "headliner" part). I don't know what their shop time is these days but it's gotta be at least $125/hour and maybe $150/hour.

When the service manager agreed to give me the labor free (he owed me a favor) I don't think he thought it would be that big a job. The parts (last September) cost me (less MBCA 15% discount and plus 7.5% sales tax) $870 out the door. The headliner part will be another $500 from me plus another hour of labor (which I don't have to pay). Ballpark total $3000 if you have to pay California dealer rates for everything. I suspect a more experienced mechanic could have done the job faster but the parts would have been the same. Older threads here and elsewhere have estimated $1000-$2000 for a sunroof job.

Mine is probably a worst-case situation – my sunroof had a lot of broken parts that had to be replaced (took over a page just to list them). If I were to do the job myself or with an independent mechanic, I'd take a small 12 volt battery to the local Pick and Pull and test sunroofs until I found one that worked (they can't all be broken). I don't know what P&P charges for a complete sunroof but probably not more than $100.

If you can get a sunroof to open, it's fairly easy to pull apart. An experienced mechanic with the right alignment jigs could then put the pieces together in your car in just a few hours. Some parts could maybe be repaired--dealer isn't gonna do that but you could. That would save a lot of money. You could probably have the same job done for $1000 or less with junkyard parts and a semi-retired wrench willing to work for $50/hour.

As these cars get older and older, there are fewer people who remember how to work on them, and some parts get hard to find. I'll bet Mercedes raises the price on the few leftovers, too. List price for that inner panel with the headlining is $6XX and there really isn't that much to it.

Jeremy

Jeremy5848 · #15 06-30-2009, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ps2cho

How can you get the headliner off if it does not open?

There are a couple of threads here and on other forums talking about just such a situation. You have to unclip the headliner at the front and then reach back inside with a tool to unclip the back without breaking anything. It's doable but not easy. If I were to do it myself I'd want a helper who had been there before.

I apologize to whoever originally posted the attached picture as part of a DIY write-up. I like to credit my sources but I failed to note where this picture of the headliner piece came from. The filename is "18liner1.jpg." As you can see, it's not just a piece of fabric (but just like Mercedes to charge $600+ for it).