1986 190E isn't gettin fuel from distribution - Page 4 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

2020pup · #46 05-10-2009, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wispy

I'm surprised nobody to date has mentioned a faulty Coolant Temperature Sensor would certainly add to your woes

I'm listening..Could you explain your thought? Not being smart with you just don't understand. You guys are schooling me on these MB.

slk230red · #47 05-10-2009, 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wispy

I'm surprised nobody to date has mentioned a faulty Coolant Temperature Sensor would certainly add to your woes

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2020pup

I'm listening..Could you explain your thought? Not being smart with you just don't understand. You guys are schooling me on these MB.

I don't think the Coolant Temperature Sensor would keep him from getting fuel to the injectors. My '93 has the 4 pin Coolant Temperature Sensor and I can pull the plug off and the engine will start right up. It throws a DTC code and I can clear it with my LED tester.

1986 2 pin type

1993 4 pin type

I still believe his problem is Fuel Pump/Fuel Accumulator/ or Fuel Distributor related or something similar.

He is able to get it running by spraying gas into the intake, so that means he's getting ignition, and, he verified that the injectors are not spraying fuel when the engine is cranking and the fuel pump is running.

Brent, have you tried jumping the fuel pump relay (7&8) with the other Fuel Distributor installed and pressing down on the plate to see if the injector will spray fuel?

Have you tested the Cold Start Valve (injector)? Just to verify that fuel is spraying out of it, you could pull the plug off and apply battery and ground to see if it will operate and spray fuel. At least that would verify that the fuel pump and fuel distributor is operating that circuit.

2020pup · #48 05-11-2009, 09:14 PM

I know the cold start valve is not working. It gets power but doesn't spray. that wouldn't be a big issue cause it only enriches the fuel at start. That would be no different than me spraying the air intake..right? I'm with you Dave. It's got be a pressure problem. That's the only logic explaination (maybe..haha). Didn't get to close off the accumulator today..Had to open our pool so wife and kids would leave me alone (haha). Oh one more thing Dave or whoever else is reading, Maybe you can explain why I can go out there after it sits for a long while, and it will hit and run for maybe 1/10 of a second. so its got to be getting a little fuel somehow..

slk230red · #49 05-11-2009, 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2020pup

I know the cold start valve is not working. It gets power but doesn't spray. that wouldn't be a big issue cause it only enriches the fuel at start. That would be no different than me spraying the air intake..right? I'm with you Dave. It's got be a pressure problem. That's the only logic explaination (maybe..haha). Didn't get to close off the accumulator today..Had to open our pool so wife and kids would leave me alone (haha). Oh one more thing Dave or whoever else is reading, Maybe you can explain why I can go out there after it sits for a long while, and it will hit and run for maybe 1/10 of a second. so its got to be getting a little fuel somehow..

Report back if you get a chance to verify the fuel delivery tests that I listed in post #42, a thru d. If those items are in spec, then I'm out of ammunition.

Bottom line, if you don't have the required fuel pressure at the injectors, they are not going to open.

Good luck,

Dave

pentoman · #50 05-12-2009, 08:43 AM

What I like to advise in these situations is to unplug the computers or, even better, the EHA. Pretty much rules out the coolant temp sensors etc causing a big problem. I reckon it's unlikely the electronics (fuel pump relay excluded) would fail in such a way as to cause a complete inability to drive the car, but I guess it's possible. They're designed to 'fail safe' and I have run my car with no ECM/ECU before now without big issues.

Did you get round to checking the crank signal going to the fuel pump relay?
There's also a crank signal to the ignition, which I understand comes from a separate sensor, and without this the car will not run. However it also wouldn't fire even just for a1 brief second so you can probably rule that out.

These are just the areas I'm familiar with so would check but listen to everyone else too!!

slk230red · #51 05-12-2009, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pentoman

Did you get round to checking the crank signal going to the fuel pump relay?

I was hoping that pulling the Fuel Pump Relay and putting a jumper accross pins 7&8 to keep the fuel pump running would isolate that problem.

It does sound like the fuel pump is not staying on, but he stated that he verified that by having his wife crank the engine while he checked the fuel pump.

pentoman · #52 05-12-2009, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slk230red

I was hoping that pulling the Fuel Pump Relay and putting a jumper accross pins 7&8 to keep the fuel pump running would isolate that problem.

Yes you're right it would, wasn't sure if he'd done that.

slk230red · #53 05-12-2009, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pentoman

Yes you're right it would, wasn't sure if he'd done that.

I suggested jumping the fuel pump relay in post #22, but never got confirmation that this was done.

OK Brent, tell us that you made sure the fuel pump is running and you still can't get the injectors to open.

2020pup · #54 05-12-2009, 10:30 PM

Ok sorry been kinda busy today. I still working on the pinching off the accumulator line. Everywhere that is easy to get to is a metal line. So I'm going about it little different. Basically going to complete undo the return and the little bypass line. I'm having to special make my loop at work. Will have it done tomorrow. That was the only way i could think to do it.

Dave, I have not jump wire on the relay. Want to make sure I understand. You are saying pull the relay out and use a jumper wire from 7 to 8. Right? Ummmm..are they marked or am I counting right to left..etc.. Dammit is messed up enough just want to make sure I don't fire it too...

tinypanzer · #55 05-12-2009, 10:59 PM

They should be labeled.....

slk230red · #56 05-13-2009, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2020pup

Ok sorry been kinda busy today. I still working on the pinching off the accumulator line. Everywhere that is easy to get to is a metal line. So I'm going about it little different. Basically going to complete undo the return and the little bypass line. I'm having to special make my loop at work. Will have it done tomorrow. That was the only way i could think to do it.

Dave, I have not jump wire on the relay. Want to make sure I understand. You are saying pull the relay out and use a jumper wire from 7 to 8. Right? Ummmm..are they marked or am I counting right to left..etc.. Dammit is messed up enough just want to make sure I don't fire it too...

Yes, put a jumper across pins 7 & 8 of the Fuel Pump Relay Socket. It should be in your manual. Check the attachment.

pentoman · #57 05-13-2009, 10:02 AM

While you're there and have the pump hooked up like that, you can go so far as to remove the injectors, set them squirting into some (safe) liquid receptacles, then watch them squirt as you push the intake air flap down.
Will see if things are working and if you are getting anything out of the injectors.
Haven't tried it yet myself, but plan to, just for fun and to check spray patterns.

slk230red · #58 05-13-2009, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pentoman

While you're there and have the pump hooked up like that, you can go so far as to remove the injectors, set them squirting into some (safe) liquid receptacles, then watch them squirt as you push the intake air flap down.
Will see if things are working and if you are getting anything out of the injectors.
Haven't tried it yet myself, but plan to, just for fun and to check spray patterns.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2020pup

Attachment 67608
Pulled the injectors out and hooked the lines back up to see if i was getting any spray or anything out of them. I got nothing. guess something is wrong in the distribution. also too look at this injector this is all the came out but my book shows a cone shaped seal that goes along with the one that is on it. Is that the case? actually it shows the one that is on the injector now, a cone shaped, and it looks like a regular o-ring

He tried that earlier, but I wasn't sure if the fuel pump was running, that's why I'm trying to get him to put a jumper on the fuel pump relay socket. Hopefully if the fuel pump is running, he can push down on the plate and get fuel to spray out of the injectors.

Fingers crossed!

2020pup · #59 05-13-2009, 06:39 PM

Dammit lives up to its name again..!!! I completely bypass the the return..I jumped a wire from 7-8..fuel pump ran the whole time..It did the same..hit then die..put everything back on the return...jump the wire..fuel pump ran..it would hit then die.. put everything back..going to find big gas jugs.....fill them with gasoline and burn the damn thing

slk230red · #60 05-13-2009, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2020pup

Dammit lives up to its name again..!!! I completely bypass the the return..I jumped a wire from 7-8..fuel pump ran the whole time..It did the same..hit then die..put everything back on the return...jump the wire..fuel pump ran..it would hit then die.. put everything back..going to find big gas jugs.....fill them with gasoline and burn the damn thing

Wait just a gosh darn minute now Brent.....go back and read post #42.

Did you test the delivery rate? All you need is for the injectors to spray fuel and "Dammit" is going to fire up and go.

Did you block the line from the Accumulator? If the Accumulator is leaking, you will lose pressure and volume. There should be one rubber hose on the rear of the Accumulator going to the gas tank.

You've got to isolate this fuel problem!!!