1987 300TD Euro Lights on ebay - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

zu! · #1 09-03-2015, 11:11 AM

Hello. I've decided that I'd rather not be driving around pretty much blind at night and started researching on upgrading these lights. However, I'm a little confused as there seems to be a blinding array of lights available.

Is there a difference between the 1987 headlights as opposed to, say, the 1994? Didn't they all share the same body type? I've seen the Depo ones go from $139 to $170 a pair. What would the difference be? Some say that it won't fit my 1987 body.

I get that there're differences between the ones with wipers and the ones without wipers, and my understanding is that all I'd need is another body panel without the hole, or I could just fill up the hole on my existing one.

But what about the vacuum control? Can I just install the light without it? And finally, the oft-cited "citylight". How is that activated? Does it come on with the lifting of the ebrake like other cars?

Thanks!

MBeige · #2 09-03-2015, 12:20 PM

Due to design changes necessitated by model facelift between 1987 and 1994, the later models will fit the earlier ones, but the earlier ones will not fit the later models, due to the design of the grille. There is a curvature in the later headlight design that makes them incompatible with the earlier hood/grille shape.

If your car has no wipers, you can opt to get direct replacement lights without wipers. But if you'll want to install wipers, you need to get the correct Euro-light wipers that are sleeker which are more of a "__/" shape compared to the NA wipers, which are more of an "L" shape.

Vacuum control: you typically do not need it, but if you wish to install keep in mind there are differences once again between early models and facelifted models, between diesels and gasoline engine models (due to vacuum supply). If you have a wagon, the vacuum control switch is different also because of the self-leveling-system (a sedan with SLS also applies here), so that makes it 4 options for vacuum control alone. They are pretty cool when they work properly, and if you anticipate carrying heavy loads at night where the lights will point up due to the weight in the back, consider what effect this does on other drivers coming your way (they get dazzled by the glare from your lights). The vacuum control allows you to lower the beam back to the correct level to allow others to see the road, and not get dazzled.

City lights are basically park lights. In Europe and rest-of-world (ROW), the turn signals are typically not used as park lights. So a small 4W bulb is inside the main beam reflector and is activated by activating the park lights the same way. Instead of the turn signals illuminating steady, the city lights illuminate inside the headlight assembly. Some call it DRL's but they're too weak to be DRL's.

You need to use the correct 6-pin headlight wiring harness plug and move the wires around so the lights illuminate properly for the Euro assemblies. This is the time you can move the park light into the headlight to use the city light function. Others in the North American market like to use both the turn signal and city light, or just the original park light and do away with the city light. I like the city light function, it also gives the turn signals more contrast when driving at night (OFF/ON, as opposed to them going ON/BRIGHT). The standard turn signal bulb is 21W/4W, the 21W is what turns on the turn signal light, 4W is for the parking light. If you decide to use the city light, just move the wire over to the main headlight plug. If you want to place an extension instead, just place electric-tape on the contact point of the dual filament bulb to cancel out the park light.

This is how the city light looks in daylight - see how barely noticeable they are. The image with my w123 was taken with less ambient lighting, hence the city lights being more visible.

I always loved this shot, taken with just the city light illuminated.

Here's my w123 with vacuum-adjustable lights, you'll hear me clicking through the dial switch and see the light beam move up and down accordingly. This is just about 10 to 15 ft from the wall, on the road the change in beam level will be amplified.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/mbeige/15921008185/in/album-72157653462588206/

JimFreeh · #3 09-03-2015, 01:10 PM

Agreed.

I leave the power to the parking lights intact, and run a jumper to the city light function. I prefer to have the side marker function of the front parking light intact.

Back in the day.... I've spent close to 700 to get the OE lights and vacuum setup. Fantastic difference between the US lights and the euros.

On a number of W124s since, I've used Depot lights and have been pretty pleased. Do note, however, that Depot lights do not have the vacuum elements installed on all sets.

The Depot lights sans vacuum are the bargain bet when cost is an issue. Vacuum is fun, but it's a toy not a requirement. I did vacuum for three sets, then quit, it wasn't that big a deal.

The 94-95 US lights are as good as the euros, I've never felt a need to exchange any of my 94 or 95 lights, unlike the 86-93 lights.....

Jim

Jim

zu! · #4 09-03-2015, 06:52 PM

Thanks very much guys! So, just to be clear...if I purchase lights meant for the 90-95 model, then it will fit my 87? I was looking at this one in particular:

Depot 1994-1995.

And yes, i will get the 6-pin plugs, which I've put in a request for at my local dealership. I asked for the plugs that fit into the rear lights. Haven't heard back from them yet.

I also asked for the little strips that go underneath the lights. I will just get rid of the headlight wipers for a sleeker look.

Thanks for the in-depth explanation of city lights. I suppose I could plug in a higher wattage bulb then? So, to have them on, I would then turn the switch to the first detent and then when signals come on, the 21W signal light would give a big contrast for the best signalling effect.

One other question...if I want to wire relays and have more powerful bulbs in my housings, how does that impact the wires AFTER the plug...ie those inside the housing that connect to the actual bulbs. Could I change those wires to thicker wires as well?

MBeige · #5 09-04-2015, 05:42 AM

See my responses below.

Thanks very much guys! So, just to be clear...if I purchase lights meant for the 90-95 model, then it will fit my 87? I was looking at this one in particular:

Depot 1994-1995.

Your 1987 will have the same lights as those up to 1993. 1994-1995 are the different years/design. 1990 lights will still be the same as your 1987. If you're going to get 1994-1995 lights, might as well get original used Bosch/Hella units from MB - better quality and fitment than DEPO.

And yes, i will get the 6-pin plugs, which I've put in a request for at my local dealership. I asked for the plugs that fit into the rear lights. Haven't heard back from them yet.

I also asked for the little strips that go underneath the lights. I will just get rid of the headlight wipers for a sleeker look.

Typically a dealer-only item, or can be sourced from the parts yard. Easy fix - I would worry about this last.

Thanks for the in-depth explanation of city lights. I suppose I could plug in a higher wattage bulb then? So, to have them on, I would then turn the switch to the first detent and then when signals come on, the 21W signal light would give a big contrast for the best signalling effect.

I have used 5W bulbs in place of the 4W, these are the same bulbs used in the overhead map light of your dome light and has a pointed tip. Some have used higher wattage bulbs and melted the plugs.

One other question...if I want to wire relays and have more powerful bulbs in my housings, how does that impact the wires AFTER the plug...ie those inside the housing that connect to the actual bulbs. Could I change those wires to thicker wires as well?

Seems like you're doing two things here, use relays and more powerful bulbs. You can achieve brighter lights by minimizing voltage drop. See below:

Comprehensive Headlight Thread - Mercedes-Benz Forum

As for using more powerful bulbs, there may be some additional wiring needed after the plug but the voltage drop from using those wires is minimal. Folks have used higher wattage bulbs in the past and they only served to melt either the plastic plug or the reflector inside. Perhaps even the plastic surrounds too.

I wouldn't recommend using too much wattage over stock specs. Remember, your 1987 uses 45W low, 65W high. The H4's on the Euros use 55W low, 65W high. That's already a 10-watt increase over the standard NAM lights. Combine that with superior beam distribution and you can see why folks switch to Euro lights. Others can chime in on what higher wattage combo works for them, and which bulbs to use. Contact Daniel Stern from Daniel Stern Lighting Consultancy and Supply for more info.

zu! · #6 09-04-2015, 03:20 PM

Mbeige, thanks for your detailed response! Much appreciated! I did not know my headlights were just 45W on low beam. Heck, no wonder it seems like I'm staring out into the murky darkness. Sometimes, I've found myself switching my lights off and on just to be sure they're bloody on!

I'll get the stock 55W units and see how they go. Winter's a-coming and I want to get this project finished and done with before the darkness of vancouver starts rolling in.

MBeige · #7 09-05-2015, 12:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zu!

Mbeige, thanks for your detailed response! Much appreciated! I did not know my headlights were just 45W on low beam. Heck, no wonder it seems like I'm staring out into the murky darkness. Sometimes, I've found myself switching my lights off and on just to be sure they're bloody on!

I'll get the stock 55W units and see how they go. Winter's a-coming and I want to get this project finished and done with before the darkness of vancouver starts rolling in.

You're absolutely welcome. I hope my little brief explanation has shed some light (pun intended) on what you wish to do with your car's headlamps.

Good luck! Don't forget to aim the lights correctly for optimum performance.

And if you are deciding on which H4 bulb to use - remember that any tint on the glass will reduce the amount of light. There are a lot of manufacturers out there - Hella, Narva, Philips, Sylvania (German manufacturer, not US), etc.

Also, the Depo lights will not use the same 4W city light bulb that Bosch or Hella uses. I believe they use a 168 "wedge" bulb, but I haven't used any Depo lights myself so I can't confirm that.

For inspiration, here's my mechanic's 1990 300TE w/ 320k miles and Depo lights. Those wipers are from a Volvo, unsure if they work or not.

gatorblue92 · #8 09-07-2015, 06:23 AM

The 94/95 lights will work but they don't look "just right" like the 86-93 lights do because of the contour of the hood on the 94/95 cars. I have Genuine Bosch lights on my 91 300TE and the Depo knock offs on my 93 400E and while there are some minor differences in fitment I don't think its worth it to spend the extra $400+ on the Bosch lights when you can get the Depo lights for less than $200 shipped on e-bay. Unless you are set on keeping your headlight wipers I would also get the wiper delete trim panels at the same time for a cleaner look.

US lights

Euro lights with holes for wipers.

Euro lights with correct wiper delete panels.

lsmalley · #9 09-07-2015, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gatorblue92

The 94/95 lights will work but they don't look "just right" like the 86-93 lights do because of the contour of the hood on the 94/95 cars. I have Genuine Bosch lights on my 91 300TE and the Depo knock offs on my 93 400E and while there are some minor differences in fitment I don't think its worth it to spend the extra $400+ on the Bosch lights when you can get the Depo lights for less than $200 shipped on e-bay. Unless you are set on keeping your headlight wipers I would also get the wiper delete trim panels at the same time for a cleaner look.

US lights

Euro lights with holes for wipers.

Euro lights with correct wiper delete panels.

I actually like the last photo with the wiper delete panel in place, but I would've kept the clear/amber side markers for a more updated look.

gatorblue92 · #10 09-08-2015, 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lsmalley

I actually like the last photo with the wiper delete panel in place, but I would've kept the clear/amber side markers for a more updated look.

I kept going back and forth on that and I decided I prefer the amber since its more correct with the euro lights. I really need to find a set of the correct euro amber corners but all the ones I have seen make URO parts seem good

babymog · #11 09-08-2015, 04:21 PM

The amber were stock US with side reflectors up through '93, without side reflectors amber are Euro, I prefer the clear with amber side reflectors which are US '94/'95

vstech · #12 09-15-2015, 11:56 AM

If your lights are dim, be sure to inspect the relay wiring behind the fusebox. ..

zu! · #13 09-18-2015, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gatorblue92

The 94/95 lights will work but they don't look "just right" like the 86-93 lights do because of the contour of the hood on the 94/95 cars. I have Genuine Bosch lights on my 91 300TE and the Depo knock offs on my 93 400E and while there are some minor differences in fitment I don't think its worth it to spend the extra $400+ on the Bosch lights when you can get the Depo lights for less than $200 shipped on e-bay. Unless you are set on keeping your headlight wipers I would also get the wiper delete trim panels at the same time for a cleaner look.

US lights

Euro lights with holes for wipers.

Euro lights with correct wiper delete panels.

Gartorblue...that wagon could be a carbon copy of mine! Although I wished I had THOSE fancy rims ;-) Man, those rims are to drool for. Must cost an arm and leg eh!

OK update time: The dealer finally got back to me on the wiper-delete panels as well as the 6-pin sockets. Looks like a no-go from the dealer, cos the parts guy needs a VIN number from a vehicle that had one. Where am I going to find a VIN number like that in North America...It's a bloody Euro thing. I think they're worried about part fitment and that its not a modification Mercedes recommends.

Ideas anyone?

zu! · #14 10-09-2015, 10:27 PM

So I ordered the plugs, and pins...geez, cost me almost $40. When did Mercedes parts get so expensive? Two plugs, two plug backs and 4 pins.

Given up on finding the body panels without holes (besides it might probably cost me an arm or leg) maybe just leave the hole there for now, or maybe the old wiper might fit.

Days are getting dark. I'll be trying to do this this weekend.

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zu! · #15 10-12-2015, 09:14 PM

I fixed all the new wiring, heavy gauge wires, relays...the works. Tested voltage at those brand new sockets etx,..wow, virtually zero drop in voltage. City lights look great, everything works as it should.

But the damn lights don't fit. I'm going to blame my haste and poor eyesight. I was watching a few different eBay sales and I guess I eventually tapped the wrong one for final sale:

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=111760251446&globalID=EBAY-US

I guess all I saw was the 84-94 and thought, yep that's the one. I'm buggered. Can't go back to the old lights. Not after all the work I put in to wire it up right.

Wow. Whatta Thanksgiving weekend to remember.

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