Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Tech Information and Support > Tech Help

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #16  
Old 06-12-2016, 10:06 PM
lsmalley's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: California
Posts: 2,155
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue85' View Post
Bookmarked. This is excellent. A bit more extensive than the cigar, but excellent. I'm hoping you performed the tests already and started finding out where that leak is.

__________________

1990 190E 3.0L
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 06-13-2016, 12:01 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Southern California
Posts: 2,293
It would really be helpful if you can post the emission test report. Various values give a good clue as to what the problem(s) may be. Also search for emission research posts started by me, which include easy ways to lower M103 emissions like shorting the R16/1 resistor socket, disablinlg the vacuum advance, and verifing that the installed spark plugs are non-resistor type.

My 190E 2.6 has a five-speed manual and normal idle in Neutral is 700 @ 15". An automatic idling is drive will show lower speed and vacuum, but I don't have any data as to what is correct. These engines have a pretty aggressive camshaft with a fair amount of overlap compared to most of that era, so idle may not be perfectly smooth and may contribute to relatively high HC emisssions.

It's actually likely that the problem(s)may be minor, so don't start tearing everything apart until you research M103 emission test issues as recommended above.

Duke
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 06-13-2016, 01:11 PM
Home appliance genius
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: cleveland
Posts: 1,160
You might be chasing your tail. Have someone hold 700 rpm while you check for vacuum. Low vacuum is a symptom of low idle, if you have 18 ish inches of vac then your system is ok.

Buy a bottle of redline fuel system cleaner and try that with an Italian tune up.

If you already did the ignition tune up with quality parts, and the vacuum system holds ok, the next thing to change the fuel injectors.
__________________
Eugene

10 E63 AMG
93 300te 4matic
07 BMW X3
14 Ford F-150 Fx2
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 06-19-2016, 05:14 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: northern Vt
Posts: 66
Update for anyone looking for answers in the future. In this particular case, injector holder "O rings" have improved vacuum while driving, I ordered the wrong injector seals, so the old ones are back in at the moment. I suspect that new injector seals will solve the rest of the vacuum issue.

I also replaced what I call the throttle body boot. I doubt that had any real effect, so my advice to those that happen upon this thread, would be to do the injector seals and O rings first, as well as the IAC valve hoses.

I did search for the vacuum leak with ether, while having a multi meter hooked to the O2 sensor, My results did not show any change with ether, but it could have been errors on my part. Also guessing that some of the injectors are leaking down when the engine is shut off, as it sputters a bit upon a cold start. Replacing the injectors when the new injector seals arrive, and I expect the car to start and run well after.
__________________
'83 240D
'85 300D
'86 300SDL
'88 300E
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 06-25-2016, 05:29 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: northern Vt
Posts: 66
Update: Dirty injectors were the cause of the misfire...

Injector O rings solved a lot of the vacuum leak, but not all of it. I ordered the wrong injector seals so had to pull the injectors twice. Now that the injectors have the correct seals, (rather than the old hard ones) my vacuum leak has increased back to where it was.. drat!

Do the white nylon (mine are yellow now) injector holders shrink or warp in a way that can be a source of vacuum loss?
__________________
'83 240D
'85 300D
'86 300SDL
'88 300E
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 06-26-2016, 07:00 AM
optimusprime's Avatar
Trevor Hadlington
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Worcestershire in England
Posts: 1,453
Please let us know of progress .
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 06-26-2016, 07:05 AM
optimusprime's Avatar
Trevor Hadlington
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Worcestershire in England
Posts: 1,453
Pull off the temperature sensor conecting plug .And try starting the car from cold with out it .
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 06-26-2016, 12:53 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: northern Vt
Posts: 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by optimusprime View Post
Pull off the temperature sensor conecting plug .And try starting the car from cold with out it .
I am not understanding how this will effect engine vacuum, but I pulled both and the engine starts and runs the same. Engine was cold at the time of test, and I am assuming that the plugs only effect fuel enrichment when performing a hot start?
__________________
'83 240D
'85 300D
'86 300SDL
'88 300E
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 06-27-2016, 05:32 AM
optimusprime's Avatar
Trevor Hadlington
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Worcestershire in England
Posts: 1,453
No the temp sensor is in the same circuit as the ovp and cold start system .If temp sensor is faulty it can send wrong message to the ecu, so it weakens the mixture .It can work both ways if stuck , it can send a rich mixture .But if you sure its vacuum , them i would just keep looking till you find it .It can be any place .You have a vacuum holder under front fender next the charcoal filtter ...
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 06-27-2016, 05:54 AM
optimusprime's Avatar
Trevor Hadlington
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Worcestershire in England
Posts: 1,453
Blue have you got a vacuum reading yet .Is it low ,?if so what was the reading.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 06-27-2016, 06:13 AM
optimusprime's Avatar
Trevor Hadlington
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Worcestershire in England
Posts: 1,453
Thinking about this .As you said the car failed on emissions .Now, did anyone play with the adjuster for mixture settings? .If you say its a vacuum problem ,then you must have some reason to say this . Did the engine ever run right ? thats after you had it. Do you have a vacuum reading.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 06-27-2016, 06:22 AM
optimusprime's Avatar
Trevor Hadlington
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Worcestershire in England
Posts: 1,453
This was taken from this site we are on.
A lean condition can be traced back to a cracked or broken or torn boot in the system Take off the oil filler cap as the engine is running .If engine is in good shape it will drop engine speed and run rough.. No change is a sure sign of vacuum leak .
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 06-28-2016, 10:23 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: northern Vt
Posts: 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by optimusprime View Post
Blue have you got a vacuum reading yet .Is it low ,?if so what was the reading.
Vacuum gage on the dash reads about the middle when idling in drive at a stop light. Idle speed is about 500RPM. Vacuum gage reads about 13" idling in park.

I did a vacuum test with ether, and found NO trace of a vacuum leak, still I tell myself their has to be one somewhere, based upon the dash gage. Also there is an occasional misfire at idle, and I am assuming it is a lean misfire. I replaced the cap-rotor-wires-plugs 200 miles ago. Actually when running with out the OVP relay in while looking for the vacuum leak with ether, the engine ran pretty well. I assume it was running rich, but I did not notice a misfire...?

I will go looking for that vacuum canister on the front fender.

Oh I also looked at the injector duty cycle, and made a small adjustment. That did help the vacuum reading somewhat while driving. I am assuming the previous mechanic made adjustments to correct for other issues. Still need to do more reading about the duty cycle, to understand what is going on. I was attempting to get it in the 44-49% range. I need to focus on aspects of an up and coming trip, so this post is incomplete and a bit rushed.
__________________
'83 240D
'85 300D
'86 300SDL
'88 300E

Last edited by blue85'; 06-28-2016 at 10:45 AM. Reason: clarifying previous post
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 06-28-2016, 08:12 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: northern Vt
Posts: 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by optimusprime View Post
.\You have a vacuum holder under front fender next the charcoal filtter ...
Not finding any evidence of a vacuum can on ether fender, in the engine room or underneath. What am I overlooking?
__________________
'83 240D
'85 300D
'86 300SDL
'88 300E
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 06-28-2016, 09:48 PM
Home appliance genius
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: cleveland
Posts: 1,160
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue85' View Post
Not finding any evidence of a vacuum can on ether fender, in the engine room or underneath. What am I overlooking?
I don't think you have a vacuum leak. Check your vacuum at 650 rpm. You should get a reading of 15-18. If you get that reading, no leak.

__________________
Eugene

10 E63 AMG
93 300te 4matic
07 BMW X3
14 Ford F-150 Fx2
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:02 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2024 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page