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  #1  
Old 12-16-2002, 09:43 AM
rolls royce
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Unhappy 190E ignition switch

help. my ig switch has locked. cannot turn key. have dropped bottom panel on dash (no good)need to get switch out. how do i do this please. will the barrel come out in situ. or do i have to strip the top dash out. looks a major job to me. oh its a 1986 190e 2.3 16v( probably the same as an ordinary 190? regards kc (looks a great site to me wish i had found it sooner)
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  #2  
Old 12-16-2002, 11:33 AM
azhari
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Talking

If u look at the switch, u will notice 2 tiny holes on opposing sides of the switch.

U will need a thin but rigid wire (abt 2mm thk galvanised wire or something like wire clothes hanger, welding rod - u get the idea).

Abt 8 inches long, bend it in half (u-shape). With the key still stuck, insert both ends into the 2 holes and push all the way in until u feel a click. This would release the ignition key switch barrel.

Pull at the key while maintaining "push" on wire and the whole barrel should slide out. Replace the ignition key switch barrel with a new one. Of course, not it means that you have 2 keys, the old one for the doors/trunk and the new one for the ignition. That's how my 190e turned out. No worries.

However, mine is a 1.8 and i didn't have to remove the dash bottom panel. I think on the 2.3, u need to remove the bottom panel first, then proceed as mentioned.

I will scan the diagram of the u-shaped device with it's dimensions (from my Haynes manual) and e-mail it to you soon. Gimme a couple of hours coz it's in the office and now, it is midnight in my home town...

Hang on and prevail!
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  #3  
Old 12-16-2002, 03:42 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Portsmouth UK
Posts: 170
Hi RR

I think you are well in the dwang!

If you cannot turn the key - you will NOT be able to withdraw the barrel with the special tool described above.

A small dollop of PE might do it;-)

Seriously this has been covered many times - do a search.

Good Luck
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NormanB
230 TE (W124) 1989 with 153,000 miles on the clock - hoping for at least another 100K
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  #4  
Old 12-16-2002, 04:02 PM
rolls royce
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ig switch

thanks for your replies. the ignition key is not stuck. it just will not turn. when i insert it regards kc
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  #5  
Old 12-16-2002, 05:03 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Portsmouth UK
Posts: 170
Hi RR

You have me confused. But it is probably me!

Have a look at this thread from another forum UK based and see if it rings any bells for you.

http://forums.mercedesclub.org.uk/viewtopic.php?t=1943&highlight=ignition+barrel

NormanB

PS The 'key point' is you need to be able to turn the key to withdraw the barrel with the 'special tool'.
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NormanB
230 TE (W124) 1989 with 153,000 miles on the clock - hoping for at least another 100K
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  #6  
Old 12-16-2002, 06:09 PM
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smoke gets in your eyes
 
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Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 20,787
RR,

As Norman says, stuck in this context means won't turn. And as Norman says, check the archives.

With the consequence being you or a garage taking a big drill to the ignition tumbler, I'd spend 15 minutes or more jiggling the key in the tumbler until it catches. If you're lucky and it catches, do NOT turn it back to the 0 position until the ignition tumbler is replaced. You should be able to move between 1, 2 and start with no problem. Just don't go back to 0. A sore forefinger is nothing compared to the headache and/or cost of breaking the ignition tumbler.

Sixto
91 300SE
87 300SDL
83 300SD
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  #7  
Old 12-16-2002, 07:19 PM
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Gil Gil is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: NH
Posts: 306
Talking JUST did this!

Hey, I feel for you! I just came outside from fixing my ignition switch.

It locked up on me a few days ago outside of Blockbuster videos. Key would not turn, so I had it towed to a nearby shop, where they said the only option was to drill it out and replace the cylinder, and the expensive part that contains the steering wheel lock, etc. This job would run about $700 at the MB stealer, and the shop where I was wanted about $400(+/-) to do the job.

Quickly, I jumped into a nearby phone booth and changed into the superhero known as Cheap Bastard, who slayed the bill with his miserly habits. Cheap Bastard requested that they drill out the lock, but go no further. After doing this, Cheap Bastard reasoned, the car could be started with a screwdriver until funds could be found to do the job correctly.

I drove away for $95 bucks as Cheap Bastard waved and rode off into the sunset.



Now, I could have stopped there, but instead I ordered a new cylinder and key for about $38, and a new black sleeve thingy (bezel?) that screws over the lock. I saved the original chrome trim ring.

When I got home today, I found the parts on the doorstep and started the installation process, only to find that the real problem was (and likely is in your car) the dead bolt lock in the expensive part (I forget what it's called). It seems even with a new cylinder installed, the key wouldn't unlock the dead bolt and I had to take it out, moving the dead bolt away with a screw driver (it takes some practice, so be a little patient with yourself).

To keep the dead bolt from causing me any more grief, I wadded up a little bit of paper and shoved it in the gap, holding the deadbolt latch permanently in the open position. I then installed the cylinder. Using a "paper clip in the pinhole" as described in other posts, I held down the little latch on the side of the cylinder while screwing down the black bezel thingy over the keyhole.

So now i have a working key (it dsoesn't match, Cheap Bastard bought the universal one versus paying $95 for a custom ordered matching lock.)

True, my steering wheel no longer locks, but since when has that ever been a theft deterrent in the first place?

For about $150 (including the tow), a few hours of my time and some liberally applied foul language, I took care of this and you can too.

:p


Gil

Last edited by Gil; 12-16-2002 at 07:26 PM.
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  #8  
Old 12-16-2002, 08:58 PM
azhari
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On my 190e, I had problems turning the key, especially when the steering wheel locked. It took a little wiggling before it would turn.

So I looked to my trusty Haynes manual for help and found out abt the "special tool". A friend of mine (who works in a metal shop) shaped a couple of pins for me and I was on my way back with a new ignition key barrel for a DIYer.

However, pushing the pin in as instructed, I could not get the barrel to come out (pulling at the key in position 1).

After 2 hours, I gave up on this DIYer and was on my way to a Merc shop.

Even those guys took abt an hour b4 they could get the damn barrel out. Turns out, the retainers at the end had broken, thus pushing the pins would achieve nothing.

Well, 20 bucks for labour? It was well worth the money.

Btw, the barrel cost me 60 bucks and now, I have 2 keys. The old one for the locks and the new one for the ignition switch.

That keyless alarm system i saw at the mall is beginning to look kinda' appealing right now...
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  #9  
Old 12-16-2002, 10:45 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Canton, MI
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Once you get the key to turn to position 2. Look at the following.

If you search, include the word TUMBLER in your search.

Search on "Help! Newbie has Tumbler problem" A picture of the U shaped tool that you will insert into the 2 pin holes as Azhari describes.

If you want the new key/tumbler to match your door and trunk. You must go to a dealer and order it. Bring your Vehicle Registration or some proof of ownership. MB dealer will not sell the new one without proof.


Good luck
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  #10  
Old 12-16-2002, 11:02 PM
azhari
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which now explains why i need 2 goddamn keys instead of 1...
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  #11  
Old 12-17-2002, 06:12 AM
rolls royce
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ig switch

hi guys just got back in from the merc. have taken the drivers seat out. (so as to make room) it looks like i have got to drop the steering column bottom shroud(how??) looked behind the dash all the main cables from the steering go across the lock looks like a bloody nightmare to me / any ideas? as there is no room at all. i wait your replies regards kc
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  #12  
Old 12-17-2002, 07:37 AM
rolls royce
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ig switch

hi me again. the two holes as mentioned in the reports are situated at 5 to 5 (on the clock face) it is solid behind these holes at this position. so i cannot introduce any wire as suggested. the key position is at 12o.clock
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  #13  
Old 12-17-2002, 09:36 AM
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Canton, MI
Posts: 54
If it is solid behind the holes then the key may not be at the number 2 position. Look in your owners manual, I believe it shows the positions.

Are you able to turn the key clockwise past the 1 position? This is the first step. If so do NOT turn the key back to the original position as was previously stated.

You should be able to see the holes.

Look at the thread "Help! Newbie has Tumbler problem". In figure 21.6 it shows the tumbler/barrel. You can see the hole and the slot/hole running through the tumbler. You can also see a little black tab between his thumb and index finger. This black tab is what you are trying to push down with the pin/wire you insert in the hole. Push this tab in and the tumbler comes out.

Not sure if you have a screw off black collar or if it just pops off when you release the tumbler as was the case on my E320. Any 190 owners know?
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  #14  
Old 12-17-2002, 11:26 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Portsmouth UK
Posts: 170
Hi RR

I can see you are making progress of sorts............

While not wishing to piss you off could I respectfully suggest you read what I and others have posted here and read the other 'barrel'/'ignition switch'/'steering lock' posts on this and the other forum I linked you to.

The idea is to benefit from the hard earned experience of others before launching off into the dark and often expensive journeys of discovery.

All the best
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230 TE (W124) 1989 with 153,000 miles on the clock - hoping for at least another 100K
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  #15  
Old 12-17-2002, 12:34 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 56
Sometimes the "custom cylinder" comes with a "free key"

Since rolls royce's alter ego Cheap Bastard mentioned the high cost of the custom keyed lock cylinder, I thought I'd share a bit of custom lock cylinder trivia. My 1986 300E came to us with only one key, so I anted up I think $30 at the dealer to have a key made from the VIN. Even back then the ignition was a little flaky and the key had to be wiggled sometimes before it could be turned. A few months later, the wiggling thing got bad enough that I decided to replace the lock cylinder. Ordered one of those, also custom keyed from the VIN for like $80, and when it arrived, I was surprised to find it came with a nice new key, our third. I told the parts guy if I'd known the cylinder included the key I would've ordered the cylinder instead of the key the first time and saved $30 in the long run. He said they don't *always* include the key, it is just that the way they make the custom keyed cylinders is to make a key first from the VIN, then match the cylinder to the key. Sometimes they leave the key in it, sometimes not. The moral of the story? If you're sure you need a new lock cylinder, and might need a new key, order the cylinder first. You might kill two birds with one stone. Oh, yeah. Getting the cylinder out with a homemade wire thingy ultimately worked, but I must've spent three hours at it off and on over several days before I heard the happy click and out it came.
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