does my 1987 560sl have a seat sensor for an airbag? - Page 3 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

blackmercedes · #31 03-09-2004, 07:26 PM

I still think the alternator is slowly going south.

kimmy · #32 03-09-2004, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by blackmercedes
I still think the alternator is slowly going south.

Is this expesive? And is there a check you can do to see if it is good or not? Because my shop checked the alternator months ago as one of the first thoughts of the problem. Still what should I do with her tonight, take off the + plole or leave it on?

MikeTangas · #33 03-09-2004, 09:06 PM

I would take the positive lead off for the night. Perfect chance to see if the battery drops off overnight on it's own. Check the battery before making the connection then watch and listen closely while reconnecting. If there is a serious draw you will hear and see the spark upon making connection.

If you are feeling adventurous tomorrow you could always take a look at the back side of the alternator to see if you can access the two screw that retain the brush pack/voltage regulator. As long as you can access that it is pretty much a plug-n-play repair. FastLane has them for ~$15 on for the cheapo and ~$30 for the high dollar unit. Both are good.

Gilly · #34 03-09-2004, 09:06 PM

Sounds more like the battery to me, but it sounds like a tough one, and without being able to do some tests of my own, it's all speculation.
I like the voltage reading you're getting. In relation to this and what John said he had going on, the voltage output should be 13.8 to 14.2v. What John had was 13.7. This is very important, 13.7 isn't correct and should have been caught early on and the regulator brushes inspected. It wouldn't hurt on Kimmys car to at least take a look at the brushes, but I'm fairly convinced there is a problem with the battery which may even be an intermittent open circuit in the battery, or some other manufacturing concern (not filled up with electrolyte?). But it's possible it may pass a battery test at times, not 100% sure, but I would still "best guess" it's the battery. Someone already pointed out if it were the alternator, that the car should eventually die, needs sufficient electrical power to run the ignition and fuel pump/s. Although possibly the regulator is putting out correct voltage, but a problem with the alternator itself, not putting out sufficient amps? Any electrical engineers out here, does that sound feasable? A proper charging system test should be done, but first I'd closely scrutinize the battery. There isn't anything I can think of that would deplete the battery (to the point you'd need a jumpstart) in 15 or so minutes, at least nothing you wouldn't notice. A trunklight bulb, clock, radio, etc doesn't deplete a battery in 15 minutes folks. Maybe the starter would (sure, 15 minutes of starter operation, yeah you can't do that for 15 minutes without killing the battery, maybe the headlights, which is generally considered the 2nd largest electrical consumer, but should still last 15 minutes on a good battery).

Gilly

Gilly · #35 03-09-2004, 09:08 PM

DON'T disconnect the positive lead, use yer heads. Disconnect the NEGATIVE lead. I LIKE the idea of seeing what'll happen if you disconnect the battery, but disconnect the negative before you short out the wrench and fry your hand.

Gilly

MikeTangas · #36 03-09-2004, 09:21 PM

My bad Gilly...I knew to type negative but for some stupid reason I typed positive.

Always disconnect the ground side. Ah there's my excuse...I was thinking of the MG..

Gilly · #37 03-09-2004, 09:32 PM

Some day I'll have that little Sprite done and I'm gonna melt a wrench, I just know I am........

Gilly

kimmy · #38 03-09-2004, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by MikeTangas
I would take the positive lead off for the night. Perfect chance to see if the battery drops off overnight on it's own. Check the battery before making the connection then watch and listen closely while reconnecting. If there is a serious draw you will hear and see the spark upon making connection.

If you are feeling adventurous tomorrow you could always take a look at the back side of the alternator to see if you can access the two screw that retain the brush pack/voltage regulator. As long as you can access that it is pretty much a plug-n-play repair. FastLane has them for ~$15 on for the cheapo and ~$30 for the high dollar unit. Both are good.

Mike I just went out and took off the + connector, and I nearly had a hear attack when everything was all quiet and all of a sudden when it came off a noise came out of ? sounded like the battery but know it can't make a noise, it was almost a GRRRrrrrr, for lack a better way to explain it. Almost as if something was running out, ya know a little slower towards the end. I know that there is a short of some kind with the trunk light. When I open the trunk the light comes on at the half way point and off again when fully open. If I put my fingers into the wires (where they go inside near the hinge) and move them around it comes on and off flickering, but won't stay on. Could this be the problem? My car started again just now after being parked almost 3 hours. I would love to fool with it tomorrow but I am affraid that I wouldn't know where to find the alternator and wouldn't know what it was if it was looking me in the face. Good thought though. I'll do the test in the morning and keep ya posted.
Again, thanks a million.

kimmy · #39 03-10-2004, 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by kimmy
Mike I just went out and took off the + connector, and I nearly had a hear attack when everything was all quiet and all of a sudden when it came off a noise came out of ? sounded like the battery but know it can't make a noise, it was almost a GRRRrrrrr, for lack a better way to explain it. Almost as if something was running out, ya know a little slower towards the end. I know that there is a short of some kind with the trunk light. When I open the trunk the light comes on at the half way point and off again when fully open. If I put my fingers into the wires (where they go inside near the hinge) and move them around it comes on and off flickering, but won't stay on. Could this be the problem? My car started again just now after being parked almost 3 hours. I would love to fool with it tomorrow but I am affraid that I wouldn't know where to find the alternator and wouldn't know what it was if it was looking me in the face. Good thought though. I'll do the test in the morning and keep ya posted.
Again, thanks a million.

kimmy · #40 03-10-2004, 07:12 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by kimmy

Mike, Here are the morning results after disconnecting + last night. I checked battery prior to hook up and it was 12.13. Then I hooked up and tried to start the car. She made a very feeble attempt but did not start. But usually if is so dead I hear nothing at all, not even a click. I checked it after hook up and it was 11.90. Now when I put the cable back on I listened very carefully and could hear a tiny sizzle sound ever so slightly. Now I am more baffeled than I already was. Let me ask you a question. I may have done a really stupid thing but think you should know. I didn't realize that the battery was not charging when the car is sitting running in the drive. So just before winter a couple of times, (thinking that this was all due to never starting the car) I would put it outside on the drive and let it run, sometimes many hours. I somehow feel my tail going between my legs. Did I do something really bad by doing this????? Please say no, Please say no, Please say no!!! I feel cleansed almost, just getting that out. I began to think about it realized how dumb I was. Now having said all that, what would be your next thought for me. I gotta think your running out of idead. Anyone out there got an idea for me.

kimmy · #41 03-10-2004, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gilly
Sounds more like the battery to me, but it sounds like a tough one, and without being able to do some tests of my own, it's all speculation.
I like the voltage reading you're getting. In relation to this and what John said he had going on, the voltage output should be 13.8 to 14.2v. What John had was 13.7. This is very important, 13.7 isn't correct and should have been caught early on and the regulator brushes inspected. It wouldn't hurt on Kimmys car to at least take a look at the brushes, but I'm fairly convinced there is a problem with the battery which may even be an intermittent open circuit in the battery, or some other manufacturing concern (not filled up with electrolyte?). But it's possible it may pass a battery test at times, not 100% sure, but I would still "best guess" it's the battery. Someone already pointed out if it were the alternator, that the car should eventually die, needs sufficient electrical power to run the ignition and fuel pump/s. Although possibly the regulator is putting out correct voltage, but a problem with the alternator itself, not putting out sufficient amps? Any electrical engineers out here, does that sound feasable? A proper charging system test should be done, but first I'd closely scrutinize the battery. There isn't anything I can think of that would deplete the battery (to the point you'd need a jumpstart) in 15 or so minutes, at least nothing you wouldn't notice. A trunklight bulb, clock, radio, etc doesn't deplete a battery in 15 minutes folks. Maybe the starter would (sure, 15 minutes of starter operation, yeah you can't do that for 15 minutes without killing the battery, maybe the headlights, which is generally considered the 2nd largest electrical consumer, but should still last 15 minutes on a good battery).

Gilly,
If you go back and read my post, I gave it some closer thought and I changed what I had said about the 15 minute thing. The reason I said that was because I had been letting the car run in the driveway for a long time thinking was getting charged and after I turned it off, it wouldn't start back up again. But I have since learned that was not giving me a charge. Actually yesterday after driving her only 7 miles, it got turned off for 15 min. or so and started up again. Then after 3 hours of around town I parked her and kept going out to see exactly how long it would take for her to drain. She started 1 hour after, even started 6 hours after. Then I disconnected the + cable (I did not see your post until this morning about disconnecting the - one first. My bad. I was carefull not to touch anything though, and I did not get hurt. (Can you clear this + and - thing up for me please. I always wonder if I am jumping correctly and hold my breath every time I do anything with the battery. I HATE IT, I guess we fear the unknown.) Anyway, can you check out the post I placed with results of this mornings findings? Thanks, and please don't give up on me guys. I know you can figure this one out.
Kimm

Gilly

blackmercedes · #42 03-10-2004, 08:59 AM

Do us one teeny favour? Ignore the "quote" button and just use "reply." You're just reposting over and over again.

With the battery dying overnight in disconnect, I would think it's the battery.

#43 03-10-2004, 09:33 AM

12.13v after sitting overnight? - you have a bad battery - if it were half decently healthy it would have been around 12.50 volts. I have 6 cars in the family to keep repairing and this test on batteries has never let me down in 7 years. If you still don't think it is the battery - try the test on a car that is working properly and compare readings. If you are still hesitant - borrow a battery from another car that is good and try the overnight voltage test and then try to start the car with the borrowed battery. I am willing to bet it will start right up. Load tests are great for final diagnoses - but is tied into the current draw of the battery - which the load test checks - however - there is a correlation with the voltage at the same time. So a battery that has a static voltage after 12 hours at rest of 12.56 or more - will most likely load test good. A battery that has a static voltage of 12.13 volts does not have enough reserve and will most likely load test bad. A real good battery will have a static voltage of 12.76 or higher. Here in Canada we have been using Crappy Tire batteries that usually last 2-3 years before going bad - but the low price and closeness of the stores keeps me going back. Every one of their batteries that I have static votage tested as bad - they told me that I was wrong and to prove their point - charged the defective battery and then left it to sit overnight - then load tested it - BAD. That is why I am so confident that the voltage test will work- experience.
Morris

#44 03-10-2004, 11:23 AM

I would think it's the battery as well. You probably could use a new one anyway after all that's happened. Get a battery with a 12 or 24 month replacement warranty.

You also have an oil leak and a trunk light issue. Want to sell the car?

kimmy · #45 03-10-2004, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gstigler
I would think it's the battery as well. You probably could use a new one anyway after all that's happened. Get a battery with a 12 or 24 month replacement warranty.

You also have an oil leak and a trunk light issue. Want to sell the car?

Nice try, the car is NOT FOR SALE. It's gonna take more than an oil leak and trunk light to give up on my baby. Ge wiz, I'm glad I'm not one of your cars. By the way the Battery is new. I bought it after this all started happening. I thought I just needed a new battery. Guess that's not the problem. I am convinced that it is a draw. I just don't know how to go about finding it. Any thoughts???
Kimm