Jets now to run on Bio fuel - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

punky · #1 09-30-2008, 05:47 PM

Link here

http://www.enn.com/press_releases/2663

BoomInTheTrunk · #2 09-30-2008, 06:36 PM

i hope this doesn't go through big because food price might go up.

#3 09-30-2008, 09:50 PM

The article does not say what they use to make it. But I agree, biofuels sound great but it means taking food off people's plates when new stock is used as the fuel source.

probear · #4 10-01-2008, 01:10 AM

Hopefully, they will continue the development of the algae oil source. The vertical farms take little room, the algae is fast growing and produces the most oil for time/area. I don't feel like it would take a lot of research to really develop this.
Of course, like all other energy sources, it is not the total answer, just a part. Every little bit helps.

And I also agree with FI on the food issue. That is why I think using corn for ethanol is a really stupid idea (among other reasons....)

BoomInTheTrunk · #5 10-01-2008, 01:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ForcedInduction

The article does not say what they use to make it. But I agree, biofuels sound great but it means taking food off people's plates when new stock is used as the fuel source.

I believe it said crops and wasted oils

Skippy · #6 10-01-2008, 01:59 AM

Very cool from the technical standpoint. JP-8 has to flow down to something silly like 50 (F) below zero. To persuade vegetable oil to do that is no small feat. I noticed they didn't say how much this stuff costs to produce.

chetwesley · #7 10-01-2008, 02:07 AM

I just hope someone tells them to keep a couple extra fuel filters handy

C Sean Watts · #8 10-01-2008, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skippy

Very cool from the technical standpoint. JP-8 has to flow down to something silly like 50 (F) below zero.

Not at all silly when you consider the temps at altitude. On average decrease, 10 (C) per 1000 feet.

I'm not trying to play 'gotcha' but -50 is not a very big margin when the OAT (ambient air temp) is -40. The freeze point of Jet-A (used in airliners) is only three or so degrees higher. *note at ~ -40 degrees, Celsius and Fahrenheit are equal*

qwerty · #9 10-01-2008, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by C Sean Watts

Not at all silly when you consider the temps at altitude. On average decrease, 10 (C) per 1000 feet.

Speaking of silly!!! That would put the typical freezing level well below 4000' MSL.

The generally accepted figure is 2* C per 1000' of altitude change in the troposphere. At airliner altitudes, you can expect a temp very close to -55*C.

toomany MBZ · #10 10-01-2008, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by probear

Hopefully, they will continue the development of the algae oil source. The vertical farms take little room, the algae is fast growing and produces the most oil for time/area. I don't feel like it would take a lot of research to really develop this.
Of course, like all other energy sources, it is not the total answer, just a part. Every little bit helps. There is a fella nearby starting a company to do just this. He is getting help from a university, but with start up capital very low, we'll see.

And I also agree with FI on the food issue. That is why I think using corn for ethanol is a really stupid idea (among other reasons....)

I agree with the not food stuffs idea, I hear about some organic material that has potential and is considered a weed in some parts, switch grass. I also understand it takes little water, no fertilizer and grows in poor soil.

However, before jets, lets get commercial vehicles, semi's, dump trucks, locomotives, cranes etc. items such as those on "alternative" fuels.

There is an ethanol plant going up a couple of miles away from my house, hopefully BEFORE they build the facility, they take into account something other than corn can be used.

dmorrison · #11 10-01-2008, 06:22 PM

Yes, Qwerty is right. Standard adiabatic lapse rate is 2C per 1000'. However the standard is never what you actually see in the atmosphere ( the standard temp is 59F, that does not happen every day). That is why balloons are sent up twice a day to measure the actual temperature. Satellites can now do a lot of measuring now.

The British Airways 777 that landed short of the runway in London had ice form in the fuel control due to it's flight over the north pole. They flew in -70C air for quite some time.

"Biojetfuel" will have to have additives to prevent freezing. Fuel temp of +30C after a 4 hour flight on my aircraft usually drops to -5-10 range.

It will be developed for commercial use but it all depends on the cost of a barrel of oil.

Dave