I have taken off the air filter box and ran it that way
taking the turbo inlet tube off was to prove the flapper in the box below the air box was working

Yesterday I took off the speed sensor that reads off the flex plate (starter ring gear)
It had some filings on it but looked fine so I wiped it off and reinstalled

and to make sure it was actually working with the engine running I un-plugged it from the connection up where it is secured to the intake

The engine stopped when unplugged so it's working

A couple of days ago I (with the advise of ROY) I had the intake off (again I'm getting good at it)
so I took out the fuel shut off switch and ran it with no effect

We did this because the stop lever was kinda bobbing a bit while running
Thought maybe it was pulling vac. and kinda "retarding" fuel delivery...... had no effect

I'm going out now to try the WD-40 thing....
No change in RPM

I am unable to just throw parts (more parts) at it like injection pump unless it actually needs it
I had a spinal fusion and I am still not back to work (well they laid me off for some reason after I got hurt) so funds are more than low but I still need to fix it without taking it somewhere

I am at the end of my rope thanks for all your help
I still think with Roy's help and many others of you out there I (we) can figure it out
Because the benz owner community and this forum are the best!

Do not get at the end of your rope. Things are just starting. Has the engine used vegatable oil at all?

Find the return hose from the injection pump and close it off to see if anything improves after the wd 40 test if revs rise with the spray.

I also do not care how the engine ran before the difficulty. Pull the port bolt on the exhaust manifold. The exhaust system just might have suddenly obstructed. This again depending on if the results of the spray test are negative. Has to do with the bogging you mention with increased rack position.

Im wondering if the shut off valve has some how gotten stuck about 1/2 way open, unlikely but its worth checking into. Pull the valve off and make sure everything is OK.

__________________
1985 300TD Turbo Euro-wagon
1979 280CE 225,200 miles
1985 300D Turbo 264,000 miles
1976 240D 190,000 miles
1979 300TD 220,000

GONE but not forgotten
1976 300D 195,300 miles
1983 300D Turbo 175,000 miles

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...e485-1-2-1.jpg

I tried the WD-40 thing but couldn't get a good spray into the trubo without my hand getting hit by the fan but what spray I did get had no effect

If it is still worth a try I can but some purge or diesel in a spray bottle and take off the crossover pipe

and just spray it in there so I don't lose fingers or hand I have enough problems.

As for any WVO or SVO
NO always #2 diesel
I am the third owner and it had no evidence of any conversion


The two prong plug on the back of the IP

I take the plug off while not running
Put multimeter on OHMS (maybe bad wire)
one side of the plug gives me like 715

and the other side says like 1500

just thought I would put that in here it may help in the diagnosis

I guess the question is if any wd 40 spray vapour got to the cylinders. There should have been some effect. The no change is a reason to pull that exhaust manifold bolt unless you feel none of the wd40 made it. I hope it breaks free easily. You might want to try the wd 40 again through the air filter box first.

On second thought if the cylinders are being choked off pretty much by an exhaust restriction the suction to intake the wd 40 may almost be non existant. Normal airflow to and through the cylinders would almost be absent.

Also I now think the injection pump is probably okay. The lack of any response whatsoever to the wd 40. Plus this bog you mentioned on opening the linkage are good signs as far as my limited knowledge.

Do not get discouraged your problem will soon be located one step at a time. We have some members aboard that really know what they are doing. I have watched them help untold people and seldom fail to do so since I was allowed to join the site. You also communicate more than well enough to get through this.

For the time being I am ignoring your ohm readings for two reasons. I think without being absolutly sure that they relate to idle situations only. That circuit seems to be working if the idle rpms are as they were. Plus I still feel right or wrong that your car is not sophisticated enough electronically to create this difficulty.

Of course time may prove me wrong as I do not know it all. I only wish I had worked on an early 603 type engines a bit.

In theory only. If you opened up the linkage on the injection pump a bit. And either yourself or someone else were watching the tailpipe. The inability to burn the additional fuel efficiently Should be reflected by the exhaust getting blacker I think.

In a way the bog you get may just be the cylinders trying to extinguish with the additional fuel by reducing the amount of or efficiency of the burn. You have reduced the available oxygen even further.

I am also glad to see that you are cognizant of the issue of hurting yourself. Sometimes in the heat of frustration we all can do things that are not wise.

Interesting you say no response to WD40. I have started & run a 602 for several minutes on WD40, I dont suggest that any one do it but I know it works. If you spray it into the inlet, even the air cleaner, & not just a quick spray, it should run the motor while you continue to spray it.
Maybe badly blocked inlet manifold from EGR?
If the exhaust was blocked, you wouldnt expect much spin on the turbo.

__________________
Grumpy Old Diesel Owners Club group

I no longer question authority, I annoy authority. More effect, less effort....

1967 230-6 auto parts car. rust bucket.
1980 300D now parts car 800k miles
1984 300D 500k miles
1987 250td 160k miles English import
2001 jeep turbo diesel 130k miles
1998 jeep tdi ~ followed me home. Needs a turbo.
1968 Ford F750 truck. 6-354 diesel conversion.
Other toys ~J.D.,Cat & GM ~ mainly earth moving

Your issue is an issue of fuel starvation.

Remove your shut off valve, like stewart says, and make sure it is not interfering with the fuel rack.

There is obviously an issue with the fuel rack in the pump.

when did this start? and how?

__________________
Pierre Hedary 1985 280SEL, 1970 111.026 in progress
Mercedes technical advice hotline: 407 765 2867
[servicing older Mercedes in the state of Florida with competence and passion].

From the standpoint of an honest MB technician, Vegetable oil is a threat to your diesel engine's mechanical integrity.

I agree.

I agree yet the exhaust obstruction if there is not total as the engine still idles. There is little turbo impellor load at idle as well. The onset of an intake obstruction should not normally be as quick as his problem developed. The onset of a sudden exhaust restriction is not that uncommon though. Especially on 603s.

Very weak low pressure if any fuel supply to the pump might be the next avenue. The engine should have picked up revs with the wd 40 if that were the issue though.

Since I believe the car also starts up normally even though it will not pick up revs. That almost clears the injection pump of any major shift in timing I would suspect. So if it is not an exhaust restriction it may get quite interesting. It almost has to be the exhaust restriction.

I have also noticed that the two of us are frequently on the same wavelengths. I think you can teach me a thing or two over time.

Allready done.

He removed the shutoff valve, and ran the engine, no change...

* NEW Fuel.
* NEW Lift pump, no effect.
* Ran directly off diesel purge bottle, no effect...
* Plugged fuel return line, no effect.
* Bypassed fuel thermostat.
* Disconnected exhaust system from turbo, no effect.

I think he posted instantainiously in the morning while trying to get away. Usually these engines see the wd 40 as additional fuel. His had no mechanical response at all to it apparently. There are two lines of thought underway now. That is good. Normally if the wd 40 reached the cylinders there should have been a change.

The rack is moving at least a little. As he opens the throttle or rack if you preffer the engine goes into a bog type situation. Or some simular description. Well we will soon know one way or another. As long as he gets it repaired is the important thing.

Thanks Roy for posting. I also just went back and reread his first post because of it. Somehow I missed that he already had the exhaust system opened up. Now I am really curious as to why the engine did not see the wd40 as additional fuel. Other than that I can now see the injection pump as a possible problem.

One of us should spray a little wd40 into an intake of a normal engine while ideling to verify no change occurs before condeming the injection pump in any fashion. My older cars are still in winter storage still.

I still tend to believe but subject to change a normal engine should have seen the wd40 as additional fuel. Yet as the method of introducing while already running might not be efficient enough to raise rpm. Only a simple test would absolutly verify this unless the information is already out there.

Clearly, just about everything but the IP is covered.

I'd put a fuel pressure gauge on it to confirm that pressure is maintained when the rack is opened. If so, the IP is the culprit..........although this would be a first.

You can run a few minutes without the water pump..

Please remove the accessory (serpentine) belt, start the engine and try to accelerate..

I assume you mean injector pressure?

Note:
The only issue I can hear on the phone is the accessory drive belt tensioner chatter.

The idle is perfect.
Acceleration shows on the tachometer as a 100 RPM increase, no stumble or other detectable change.