Where Do I Sign Up To Join The 5 Speed Club?
 

I went to Pull-A-Part to look for a piece of diesel injector line to make a pump timing tool. I didn't find any, but I did find some other stuff there.

There were a few Euro-spec Mercedes in the yard. The first car I saw was a Euro W116. I took the manual window regulators and velour door cards to install in my 300SD. It had the same saffron interior color as my car but the window cranks were missing. Someone also took the wooden switchless console piece, but at least I have one already. I got a wooden SLS switch housing. Why, I don't know. Maybe I can be creative and put something else in it. I took the velour headrests. The front seats were structurally good but the fabric was shredded. Someone had already taken the rear seat. I took the rubber trunk triangle holders so I can install my trunk triangle. The car had headlight wipers, but I didn't get them because it would have taken too long to remove the wiring harness. I might go back for them later, though.

There was a 450SLC there as well, but I didn't see anything I needed on it. The next car I saw was a W123 240D. It had a saffron interior like my 300SD and it had the matching window cranks, so I got those also to go with the W116 regulators. After that there was a W126 560SEL. I didn't see anything I needed on that one.

After that I saw a Euro W123. It had vacuum-adjust Euro lights, a black cloth interior, rear headrests, and a manual sunroof. I removed the entire sunroof assembly to convert my 300SD's power sunroof to manual. I looked down at the shifter and noticed it was a manual. Then--I couldn't believe it--it was a 5 speed! Yes, a 5 speed--Getrag 717.400. I pulled the transmission, shift linkage, and pedal assembly. I also removed the VIN and options plates.

What a haul! At first I thought I was going to sell the 5 speed transmission, but now I am thinking it would go well in my 1980 W116 300SD behind my 5 cylinder turbo diesel. That's a gear for every cylinder! It's going to have manual windows, sunroof, and heat, so a manual transmission wouldn't be out of line. I have my doubts that the pedal assembly will work and I still need a 617 flywheel, but I am seriously considering doing the swap. The automatic transmission leaks, takes at least 5 minutes before the car will move, and it shifts too late, so it may be on its way out anyway.

So, I take it a Getrag 717.400 5 speed is fairly uncommon? :P

Here are some of the other goodies I got there:

welcome to the club.

You sign up right here. Ship me the tranny so I can issue a cerificate that you sent me a genuine five speed transmission.:D Nice find.

Wow, what a find? you scored, Iam envious.

Did you read the write up Bruce Kennedy did on swaping in a manual sunroof?
http://www.peachparts.com/Wikka/W123SunRoof

Did you cut out the little ramps that makes the roof pop up?

Charlie

Oh, awesome, thanks for the link! I actually took the entire assembly, frame and all, so the ramps are still attached to it. I do happen to have a set of ramps from another manual sunroof as well as the handle, so I guess I have enough to do 2 cars.

You didn't have time to pull headlight wipers yet you pulled a transmission???

Sixto
87 300D

wow, look a the condition of the gearbox! That is really an impressive find! What are the ratios on a 717.400?

The wiring harness for the motors goes inside the cab and I would have to remove the dashboard, etc. I might go back for them. I didn't mess with them much because I wanted to see what else was in the yard and then when I saw the 5 speed I had to have it.

If you change your mind about installing the 5 speed put me on top of the list of people that will take it off your hands! Cheers.:D

a getrag tranny without a dogleg first. huh. you'd want to avoid that if you plan on tracking your non-6.9 w116 anytime soon

the important thing now it to figure out what kind/weight of flywheel to use

WOW!!! Nice score!!:)

So, I guess you are looking for a flywheel, huh?

5spd Manual...3.82-2.20-1.40-1.00-0.81 R3.71, originally posted by "Forcedinduction"

Was the flywheel on the original car? If so, worth grabbing it. After testing my 5-speed for a while, I am more and more convinced that a heavier flywheel in 5th gear would be useful even on the 240.

I am working on rigging up a heavier one on the same type of swap squiggle dog is talking to the turbo motor. I have a feeling that the turbo motor may be unhappy in 5th gear with a light flywheel, but I have nothing to support that theory.

Okay. :)

I will have to research what this dogleg is. I have a flywheel from a 220D, which will bolt up, but I think I'd rather have a 300D flywheel.

Thanks. Yep, I could use one.

The flywheel was still on the donor car but it was a 280E inline 6 cylinder, so the flywheel won't work on a diesel. It still may be a somewhat rare flywheel, though.

Man how difficult is it to pull a transmission out of these cars? You made it sound like such a casual endeavor!

It should only take about 30 minutes to pull the trans.

Give these guys a call:

Universal German Auto, Sales, Service & Dismantling Inc.
11066 Tuxford st Sun Valley CA 91352
(818) 767-6455 - (818)767-6499

I got my 300D flywheel from them for $125.00

Id go back and grab it anyway, I just got a 190E gas flywheel in the mail that is nearly the same weight at a 240D diesel flywheel. It might be worth looking at and weighing.

We just got a 5 speed E300 ! ;)

You shouldnt bother with the aluminum case getrag's they are not as strong as the earlier two piece-Ill be glad to dispose of it for you;)

It was very easy and took about 30 minutes to get it all disconnected--except for one bolt on the top of the bellhousing that took nearly two hours to remove. I had to pull the steering column and bend some other parts out of the way to get a wrench to fit in there.

Will do!

It appears I will need to get the adapter plate from the 280E. The transmission has two studs sticking out of it that get in the way and a couple of the bolts don't line up. I could still make it work by removing one of the studs, but I think I will get the 280E adapter plate. Hopefully the plate will bolt up to the 617 engine.

The 280E flywheel will have a different bolt pattern and size so it won't fit the diesel engine.

Check out ebay uk and ebay germany for the Fly. Any L series truck like 207d 208d 209d 307d 308d with a 4 cyl deezl has the five cyl 617 37lb fly. Just type in mercedes benz diesel I always see the motors pulled on ebaymotors.de -just the communication problem asking if they will sell the fly wheel seperately and ship. There's a gwagen guy there who had his act together I got one here from him for $450

Yeah, I've seen them there from time to time, usually around $300 plus shipping. It will probably take me a while to save up that much money, but I hope to get one eventually. I got really lucky on this 5 speed.

Yeah that's the worst one.. I remember pulling a trans from a 300TD and we would up having to pull the entire motor and trans out because one of the starter allen bolts was stripped. After that I never pulled a tranny out of a 300D/TD without pulling the motor with it :)

There is a 240D manual in the local yard here, if you do decide to go with a 240 flywheel. I wouldn't mind getting/shipping it for you.

Awesome find BTW! I thought finding a solid aluminum body 4 speed was good, you took the cake man! Best of luck with it.

I've got a 220D manual flywheel. It's rusty, though. From what I've heard using a 300D flywheel is nearly a must with a turbo + 5 speed. Here's hoping I can find one at the same time I can afford it!

Oh, and removing that top bolt (both of them, actually) from an inline 6 cylinder engine that nearly touches the firewall requires being very agile and in pain.

I've been wondering if the propeller shaft would be worth getting. It's a different body style than my car, though. Then I thought about maybe wanting the rear axle but once again, it's a different body style car with a different weight and engine type. And, I'm broke after purchasing the transmission!

The shaft would be worth getting since it's probably going to be shorter than a 4 speed unit. The getrag 5 speeds are longer than the 4 speeds. Does the starter go in the same spot as it does on a diesel? I thought the diesels were different?

The car I pulled the transmission from is a W123 and my car is a W116, so it may not work in my car anyway, but who knows... The diesels and gas engines have the starters in the same spot and in fact a diesel starter will fit on a gas engine. It's the mid-1980s and newer cars when they changed the side the starter was on.

The shaft would be worth getting for a 123 installation, a 116 installation will require a drive shaft that is considerably longer than one from a 123 installation. The 123 shaft would probably be very saleable to someone who is doing a 5 speed instal and it could offset your costs.

Your 116 auto shaft may be quite close as the 717.400 is close to the length of the auto tranny.

I'll consider picking it up. You're right, the 717 is very close to the length of an automatic.

I went back to Pull-A-Part today and got the adapter plate from the 280E. It bolted up perfectly to my spare 617 engine and then the 717 transmission bolted up perfectly to the adapter plate. The transmission fits like it was made for it! It turns out that the 280E flywheel has the same bolt pattern. It looked wimpier (thinner) than my 220D flywheel so I didn't get it.

I am excited about having a 717 bolted to a 617, or a 5 speed transmission bolted to a 5 cylinder engine!

Is there a special wrench to do that? I have some awkward wrenching to do like that ahead.

Yeah, I thought finding the lot of NOS parts in Atlanta was the bomb....but nothing like what Squiggle Dog scored.

Maybe Iam missing something here. Is the 280 adaptor plate all that much different, than the adaptor plate for the 617?

I swaped a 240D 4 spd into my 85 cali 300D. removed the automatic, bolted up the 240D FW, clutch etc... and used the same auto adaptor plate. i had the manual adaptor plate, and not a nickles worth of difference.

Also the 85 300D has the tach pick up on the adaptor plate, and was lucky i didn`t have to change it.

So is the manual 5 speed bolt pattern the same as the 240 4-spd? should be I would think. so what is the fuss about getting the 280 plate?

Just asking.

Charlie

The best wayI've found is a 3/8" drive 6-point built in swivel socket, you can get a new one from Sears for about $8, that way the swivel joint is tight and stiff. Then you need about 30" of extentions, I use 1/2" with two or three 6" long ones at the tool end. With the shorter extentions you can get an arc rather than a straight line that one long extention will form. A 1/2" -3/8" adapter and a 1/2" ratchet, swivel head makes it easier. From undermeath drop the tranny cross member so the tranny hangs, I get the stick of extensions with the socket at the end onto the bolt head first and then pop the rachet in place. You can get a hand up along side the tranny and hold the thing in position while you work the ratchet.

The two top bolts are in between the cast webs of the bellhousing so its harest to get the tool in place, using a tight swivel makes it easier to get a little angle set up between the socket and the extention in order to get the socket on the bolt head easier. Try to get the top two bolts first that way there is no force on them as you remove them, usually once they are broken free they can be turned out just using the extentions and socket without the ratchet.

Yes, the 280 adapter plate is different from the 617 plate. The 617 plate is the same as the 220D, 240D, 300D, 300SD, etc. The 5 speed uses a different adapter plate than the 4 speed.

The 5 speed transmission has 2 guide pins that get in the way when installing it in the 617 adapter plate (won't allow it to seat). The bolt holes on the left side don't line up either, but the top, bottom, and starter holes line up. I could have made the 617 adapter plate work if I removed the guide pins on the transmission and left a couple holes without bolts. But the 280 adapter plate works perfectly on both ends.

What he said. No real easy way of doing it in the car. Try removing an automatic sometime. The bolt heads are recessed to make it impossible to remove the transmission unless the engine is pulled. Even the service manual says it is not possible to pull the automatic transmission without pulling the engine!

OK, thanks. you mentioned it up above, and it didn`t quite sink in then :o.

so then I guess the 280 plate, and if I found a 123 with a 5 spd, it would have the same plate then. I was always under the impression the 5 spd would just bolt up to a 617 w/o swapping plates. good to know.

Charlie

I am guessing any W123 with a 5 speed (even a diesel) will have a 280 plate (R 110 XXX XX XX). Unless the 5 speed for the diesel engines has a different housing, but I don't think so.

As for 4 speeds, they should be interchangeable with the 115 part number adapter plate. Even the 4 speeds from the fintails bolt up to the 617 fine (I discovered this when I installed a 617 into a fintail before giving up on the car due to rust).

on the w201 chassis, the getrag tranny was a different length than other manual or auto trans models. the rear half of the prop shaft is the same length, but the front half is a few inches longer because the getrag tranny is shorter than the regular manual. this also means that the shifter linkages are a different length. in other words, if putting this tranny into a w123, you will need the front half of the prop shaft and linkages as well.

easiest way, in my opinion, to remove the upper bellhousing bolt(s), short of having a custom made wrench, is to disconnect the prop shaft, loosen the motor mounts, and tilt the engine backwards. you can now access the bolt from under hte car in less time than it takes you to squeeze the custom tool in that crevice.

course, if you have a four cylinder car, there's really no problem reaching hte upper bolts

The Getrag 5 spd Dog-Leg is 21 1/2 in long

The 5-spd OD is 18 1/2 long

The 4-spd 240D is 16 1/2

So how is the Getrag shorter? than which regular Manual?

I don`t know the length of Squiggle Dog`s 5-spd.

Charlie

you know what, i meant longer and shorter prop shaft, not shorter and longer prop shaft. good catch

This transmission came out of a W123, so there would be no problem putting it into another W123. I plan on putting it into a W116, so I don't know if the W123 5 speed propeller shaft would be the correct length in a W116. The linkages may need adjustment, too.

What is this dogleg that I am hearing about? Once I have the correct length propeller shaft everything should bolt together, right?