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PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum (http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/index.php)
-   Diesel Discussion (http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/forumdisplay.php?f=15)
-   -   Kit to allow use of 5 speed W124 manual gearboxes in a W123 (http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?t=304414)

greazzer 09-02-2011 05:15 PM
Hey,

I posted on a mold / casting forum. Hope to get some hits. I could not find any hard numbers, but saw some stuff indicating that the mold may be as low as $2,000. Assuming that is true, then that is not too bad. Spread those costs over 50 units, then thats $40.00 a piece plus units. Let's see if I get any hits. Thanks Mark

SirNik84 09-02-2011 06:04 PM
I was just poking around the 4x4 labs site, and it seems their in Grass Valley. about an hour from my house... I may have to go up there in a week or so and take a look at their products and talk to them.

JB3 09-02-2011 06:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SirNik84 (Post 2783717)
I was just poking around the 4x4 labs site, and it seems their in Grass Valley. about an hour from my house... I may have to go up there in a week or so and take a look at their products and talk to them.
4x4labs is where I got my adapter kit for my chevy transmission. Its a nice kit, they do a nice job. Spoke to the owner a couple times on the phone, very nice guy. Came complete with hardware, adapter plate, custom flywheel, and pilot bearing bushing in order to mate the 617 to a NV-3500/T5 tranny.

here are some pics of it-

The plate bolted to an OM616 (for this to work on the OM616, you need a remote oil filter, its designed for the OM617

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/...rsion/0026.jpg

all the parts-

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/...rsion/0013.jpg

custom flywheel and spacer. Drilled for the MB crank, and will take two different size chevy clutch options, as well as replaceable friction surface-

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/...rsion/0032.jpg

And the T5 variant bell attached-

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/...ersion/004.jpg

SirNik84 09-02-2011 07:03 PM
I sent 4x4 labs an email asking if they've ever heard of using a Toyota W series transmission in a Mercedes. I'm getting kind of excited about this idea, even thought I have no budget for it and I've only had the SD back on the read about 9 months since I overhauled the power train... You'd think I'd want to enjoy the thing for a while, but now I'm thinking I might rip it apart again.:rolleyes:

JB3 09-02-2011 07:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SirNik84 (Post 2783740)
I sent 4x4 labs an email asking if they've ever heard of using a Toyota W series transmission in a Mercedes. I'm getting kind of excited about this idea, even thought I have no budget for it and I've only had the SD back on the read about 9 months since I overhauled the power train... You'd think I'd want to enjoy the thing for a while, but now I'm thinking I might rip it apart again.:rolleyes:
dont feel bad. Ive got 5 engines (2 benz) and 9 transmissions (6 benz) in my work space as part of a huge back log of projects, as well as a complete 115 stock 4-speed death trap that hasn't been driven in a month.
I think actually driving a project vehicle is over rated. :D Wheres the fun in that? if you can drive it around, what makes it different from any old car?

SirNik84 09-02-2011 07:22 PM
I've just gotta not rip the SD apart until I get this thing fixed, I gotta get to work somehow. lol
http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p...724_160329.jpg

But I'm thinking about getting a Toyota trans at pick n pull this weekend because they're having a half off sale.

Stretch 09-04-2012 01:53 PM
Walkenvol has just posted a nice link for those of you thinking about using non MB gearboxes

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/3004820-post13.html

boneheaddoctor 09-04-2012 01:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Army (Post 3004987)
Walkenvol has just posted a nice link for those of you thinking about using non MB gearboxes

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/3004820-post13.html
Thanks for the update...Going to check that out.

panZZer 09-04-2012 03:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by winmutt (Post 2782732)
FW is $600.
i have a 5 cyl 38lb flywheel here in n Texas for $400.00 plus shipping

Stretch 03-29-2013 11:42 AM
Alternative bell housing anyone?????
 
2 Attachment(s)
Sorry for the thread revival - this isn't for a W124 gearbox - but it might be useful for an alternative.

Thinking out of the box - thinking MARINE engines there are lots of these things about for no much money

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/...1&d=1364568021

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/...1&d=1364568053

This one is currently for sale here in Holland for just under 80 euros.


There are lots of these little bell housing / clutch covers out there for the OM617.

Is that worth thinking about?

boneheaddoctor 03-29-2013 12:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stretch (Post 3122225)
Sorry for the thread revival - this isn't for a W124 gearbox - but it might be useful for an alternative.

Thinking out of the box - thinking MARINE engines there are lots of these things about for no much money

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/...1&d=1364568021

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/...1&d=1364568053

This one is currently for sale here in Holland for just under 80 euros.


There are lots of these little bell housing / clutch covers out there for the OM617. Any details on it...such as who makes it..part # etc....

Is that worth thinking about?
Cool, THAT would be very easy to make an adapter plate for...any more information on these? WHo makes them..part numbers etc?

Simpler=Better 03-29-2013 12:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stretch (Post 3122225)
Sorry for the thread revival - this isn't for a W124 gearbox - but it might be useful for an alternative.

Thinking out of the box - thinking MARINE engines there are lots of these things about for no much money

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/...1&d=1364568021

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/...1&d=1364568053

This one is currently for sale here in Holland for just under 80 euros.


There are lots of these little bell housing / clutch covers out there for the OM617.

Is that worth thinking about?
That's cash money. How many can you get your hands on? I need at least 1

Stretch 03-29-2013 03:13 PM
Here's the link for the one for sale I saw

Marktplaats.nl - OM615 t/m OM617 - Accessoires en Onderhoud

The advertiser says he's only got one left. I'll contact him and ask for the manufacturer and part number.

The shipping will be at least the same amount. This isn't a cheap from Europe to the US option unless I / we can work out who makes these things.

Stretch 03-30-2013 10:33 AM
Well the seller (very kindly) got back to me and told me that he had bought the adapter from these people

Dintra Transmissies in Putten, het adres voor aandrijftechnieken voor jachten en schepen

They do loads of nice coupling stuff too.

Just for the record - tthe English language catalogue is a bit out of date; but the most recent Dutch version has loads more stuff in it.

The adapter plate can be found on page 65 of the Dutch version of the catalogue for the price of 280 euros {and that's probably a price without 21% sales tax}

(So if "anyone" wants the one for sale at 79 euros + 13 euros to get it to me and then wants to pay for additional postage from me to you I'm happy to act as a go between so long as I know you - you also need to do this in the next 48 hours or so - otherwise someone else might snap it up)

Walkenvol 04-01-2013 09:00 AM
For those like me who don't know the exchange rates, 1 euro = 1.28 dollars

Stretch 04-21-2013 04:09 AM
Butcher a 722.1 bell housing instead?
 
1 Attachment(s)
I recently measured the bolt holes on the bell housing on a 722.112 automatic transmission for someone on BW =>

Droolworthy? 5-Speed For Your Diesel - Page 2 - Benzworld.org - Mercedes-Benz Discussion Forum

This might help someone looking for similar information here.

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/...1&d=1366528138
The dimensions are =>

A-H => 9cm
G-B => 20.5cm
F-C => 17.5cm
E-D => 15.25cm
D-H => 22.8cm
E-A => 23.8cm
D-G => 19.8cm
E-G => 10.5cm
D-B => 11.5cm
E-B => 22cm

All measurements made with a tape measure. All measurements made from a subjective centre of bolt hole!

The vent is at the top of the transmission (just in case you were wondering)

Mölyapina 03-18-2015 09:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JB3 (Post 2782235)
so check this out-

here we have the chevy astro 5-speed next to a 115 iron 4-speed. Ive thrown the MB shifter in there with the shift rods to show just how the location of the shifter itself is the big issue with just firing any RWD 5-speed out of dozens of vehicles in one of these MBs

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/...rison/0025.jpg

Super inaccurate measurements, but look how the MB shifter is around a foot behind the actual box, and the chevy transmission shifter is actual about 5 inches forward of it. (they are both at the same line in front on the table) In this configuration, if you put the basic chevy box in an MB car, the shifter would be in your ashtray, or climate control

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/...arison/003.jpg
http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/...arison/005.jpg

You can see from this side how the chevy 5-speed shifter handle is about 10 inches over to the driverside of the tranny through the astro-specific whoseawhatsit piece-

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/...arison/006.jpg


HOWEVER, here is my favorite pic- If you rotate the shifter extension on the chevy box, it puts the handle in almost the right place. There is no doubt in my mind that the correct attachment is available for some application that moves the shifter to the rear over the tailcone, or is customizable, making this type of chevy 5-speed that is common for camaros or something like it a possibility in an MB body.

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/...arison/007.jpg

The trick is finding just the right old domestic or asian car that moves the shifter back in some way right over the end of the tailcone. I know from some other threads if you are buying a rebuild T5, you can buy pretty much any kind of extension you want, in multiple lenghts, but thats big money.
Camaro T5:

http://agtmotors.com/uploads/Image/T5%20trans%20rss.jpg

Does this shifter placement look like it could fit the bill?

Mölyapina 03-18-2015 11:07 AM
Even if it doesn't, we could probably use the method this guy used to shorten his shifter to lengthen it:

A possible solution for cable speedometers. - Lugnutz65ChevyStepside

Lengthen the rod, build a remote shifter holder...

I suppose that same technique could also be used to adapt a W59.

Mölyapina 03-18-2015 11:16 AM
Here is a Wikipedia page on the Toyota W transmission:

Toyota W transmission - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It looks like the ratios on the W59 are very close to the MB ratios:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia Gods of Accuracy
Ratios:
  • First Gear: 3.954:1
  • Second Gear: 2.141:1
  • Third Gear: 1.384:1
  • Fourth Gear: 1.00:1
  • Fifth Gear: 0.81:1
If I got it right, I think the W59 was used in trucks starting in 1996.

If either the shifter fits or we could lengthen it as in the link in my previous post, this tranny could well be a good bet. It was used with the 5VZ-FE, which made 190 HP/220 lb-ft, so it should hold up just fine to the OM617.

Palo63 02-19-2016 04:48 PM
5 speed transmission 717 411
 
Hi I have the transmission for sale, it is located in Guatemala Central America, but if there is someone interested......let me know.......i only want 600.00 US...plus shipping.......

Mölyapina 02-19-2016 05:57 PM
717.411 was sold in the US in the 190Es... it's not a $600 tranny over here.

If you do want to list it for sale, the used parts section of the forum would be the best place to do so.

benzguy300 02-19-2016 09:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palo63 (Post 3572659)
Hi I have the transmission for sale, it is located in Guatemala Central America, but if there is someone interested......let me know.......i only want 600.00 US...plus shipping.......
The 717411 sells here in California for around $350.00


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