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  #46  
Old 02-13-2013, 04:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t walgamuth View Post
perhaps they are straight cut on first and reverse.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jooseppi Luna View Post
Aaah, straight-cut! The reverse gear in our Corolla is straight-cut, and it's definitely louder than the forward gears. Darn. Did all the gears make the same noise, or are some of them helical-cut?
I wanna say it's first, second and reverse are straight cut as they were the loudest if I recall.


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  #47  
Old 02-13-2013, 04:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jooseppi Luna View Post
So it looks like a camper transmission with the 4.7:1 first gear would hit 2000 RPM at 12 MPH in first with the 2.47:1, while hitting 2000 RPM in fifth at 57 MPH (ASSUMING that 5th in the campers is 1:1). This sounds like the ideal fit! If it isn't too noisy (or if it can be silenced with sound insulation on one or both sides of the tunnel), and fits, I may start looking for a camper transmission

Oh! Would a W123 clutch fit? It would be a pain to look for a camper clutch.
I got a 2.47 LSD carrier that you can buy from me and install in the proper case.

I think it's a 10 spline input shaft. You should be fine with a w123 616/617 clutch.
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  #48  
Old 02-13-2013, 05:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t walgamuth View Post
I could be wrong but I would expect straight cut gears only if no synchromesh is used. I would expect it only in a tractor or a race car.
Apparently straight-cut gears are sometimes made with synchronizers -- see here. I kind of like the gear whine, but I could see it getting tiring for an extended period of time. Also, why would (yeah, I'm responding to DeliveryValve now...) first & second be straight-cut while the rest is helical-cut? Do the lower gears need more strength?
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"Senior Luna, your sense of humor is still loco... but we love it, anyway." -rickymay ____ "Your sense of humor is still loco... " -MBeige ____ "Señor Luna, your sense of humor is quite järjetön" -Delibes

1982 300SD -- 211k, Texas car, tranny issues ____ 1979 240D 4-speed 234k -- turbo and tuned IP, third world taxi hot rod

2 Samuel 12:13: "David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” And Nathan said to David, “The Lord also has put away your sin; you shall not die."
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  #49  
Old 02-13-2013, 05:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Sternschnuppe View Post
Campers/vans (I mean X07 D and X09 D models of the TN/T1 series which were equipped with OM616/617) were equipped with two types of gearbox:
with 6,15:1 first (low) gear ratio
and with 4,7:1 first (low) gear ratio
Is the difference the fact that one is a 5 spd and one a 4 spd with the 5 spd having a much lower first gear?
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1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13
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  #50  
Old 02-13-2013, 05:19 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jooseppi Luna View Post
Apparently straight-cut gears are sometimes made with synchronizers -- see here. I kind of like the gear whine, but I could see it getting tiring for an extended period of time. Also, why would (yeah, I'm responding to DeliveryValve now...) first & second be straight-cut while the rest is helical-cut? Do the lower gears need more strength?
First and reverse often don't have synchro especially on an older truck application. Newer trannies, like my six speed in my big dodge is six speed and all except reverse are synchro.
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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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  #51  
Old 02-13-2013, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kerry View Post
Is the difference the fact that one is a 5 spd and one a 4 spd with the 5 spd having a much lower first gear?
Do you mean the difference between the two camper transmissions or the difference between the 716 and the camper transmissions?
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"Senior Luna, your sense of humor is still loco... but we love it, anyway." -rickymay ____ "Your sense of humor is still loco... " -MBeige ____ "Señor Luna, your sense of humor is quite järjetön" -Delibes

1982 300SD -- 211k, Texas car, tranny issues ____ 1979 240D 4-speed 234k -- turbo and tuned IP, third world taxi hot rod

2 Samuel 12:13: "David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” And Nathan said to David, “The Lord also has put away your sin; you shall not die."
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  #52  
Old 02-13-2013, 05:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t walgamuth View Post
First and reverse often don't have synchro especially on an older truck application. Newer trannies, like my six speed in my big dodge is six speed and all except reverse are synchro.
Yeah, I get the lack of synchronizers, but why would there be a mix of straight and helical forward gears?
__________________
"Senior Luna, your sense of humor is still loco... but we love it, anyway." -rickymay ____ "Your sense of humor is still loco... " -MBeige ____ "Señor Luna, your sense of humor is quite järjetön" -Delibes

1982 300SD -- 211k, Texas car, tranny issues ____ 1979 240D 4-speed 234k -- turbo and tuned IP, third world taxi hot rod

2 Samuel 12:13: "David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” And Nathan said to David, “The Lord also has put away your sin; you shall not die."
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  #53  
Old 02-13-2013, 05:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kerry View Post
Is the difference the fact that one is a 5 spd and one a 4 spd with the 5 spd having a much lower first gear?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jooseppi Luna View Post
Do you mean the difference between the two camper transmissions or the difference between the 716 and the camper transmissions?
...or it could be that the mind-blowingly powerful torque-monster OM616 got a lower first?
__________________
"Senior Luna, your sense of humor is still loco... but we love it, anyway." -rickymay ____ "Your sense of humor is still loco... " -MBeige ____ "Señor Luna, your sense of humor is quite järjetön" -Delibes

1982 300SD -- 211k, Texas car, tranny issues ____ 1979 240D 4-speed 234k -- turbo and tuned IP, third world taxi hot rod

2 Samuel 12:13: "David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” And Nathan said to David, “The Lord also has put away your sin; you shall not die."
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  #54  
Old 02-13-2013, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jooseppi Luna View Post
Do you mean the difference between the two camper transmissions or the difference between the 716 and the camper transmissions?
Between the camper/van transmissions. They were sold in 4 spd and 5spd version as well as automatics.
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1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13
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  #55  
Old 02-13-2013, 05:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jooseppi Luna View Post
...or it could be that the mind-blowingly powerful torque-monster OM616 got a lower first?
No. I've owned a 307d and a 409d, both with 5 spds. 7 is a 616 and 9 is 617. 5 spd transmission was the same.
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1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13
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  #56  
Old 02-13-2013, 08:46 PM
DeliveryValve's Avatar
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Join Date: Jun 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jooseppi Luna View Post
Apparently straight-cut gears are sometimes made with synchronizers -- see here. I kind of like the gear whine, but I could see it getting tiring for an extended period of time. Also, why would (yeah, I'm responding to DeliveryValve now...) first & second be straight-cut while the rest is helical-cut? Do the lower gears need more strength?
I'm only speculating, but I imagine the strength is needed to get a potentially loaded heavy vehicle going from a stand still. As soon as it gets up and going, strength in the gears are not that critical.


.
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  #57  
Old 02-13-2013, 09:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeliveryValve View Post
I'm only speculating, but I imagine the strength is needed to get a potentially loaded heavy vehicle going from a stand still. As soon as it gets up and going, strength in the gears are not that critical.


.
That makes sense. I won't be driving in the city that much, so I could probably live with that if the price difference is over $1000...
__________________
"Senior Luna, your sense of humor is still loco... but we love it, anyway." -rickymay ____ "Your sense of humor is still loco... " -MBeige ____ "Señor Luna, your sense of humor is quite järjetön" -Delibes

1982 300SD -- 211k, Texas car, tranny issues ____ 1979 240D 4-speed 234k -- turbo and tuned IP, third world taxi hot rod

2 Samuel 12:13: "David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” And Nathan said to David, “The Lord also has put away your sin; you shall not die."
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  #58  
Old 02-14-2013, 05:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeliveryValve View Post
I'm only speculating, but I imagine the strength is needed to get a potentially loaded heavy vehicle going from a stand still. As soon as it gets up and going, strength in the gears are not that critical.
Poking at your memory again, do you remember whether there were even jumps between all gears or whether there was a larger jump between 1st and 2nd than between the other gears?
__________________
"Senior Luna, your sense of humor is still loco... but we love it, anyway." -rickymay ____ "Your sense of humor is still loco... " -MBeige ____ "Señor Luna, your sense of humor is quite järjetön" -Delibes

1982 300SD -- 211k, Texas car, tranny issues ____ 1979 240D 4-speed 234k -- turbo and tuned IP, third world taxi hot rod

2 Samuel 12:13: "David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” And Nathan said to David, “The Lord also has put away your sin; you shall not die."
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  #59  
Old 02-14-2013, 06:02 AM
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From Wikipedia:

"Mercedes-Benz Buses" page, section "Mercedes-Benz in Argentina", second paragraph (color added):
Quote:
Mercedes-Benz released updated local colectivo based on modified L 3500 truck chassis – LO 3500, OP 3500, LO 311, LO 312– with a separately manufactured body fitted at a later stage by different coach builders. In 1963 Mercedes built the 10,000th colectivo (model LO 312), and continued with other models, such as LO 1112, (120 HP), LA 1112 4x4 (traction in all wheels) and the LO 1114. Due to the family relationship with the truck, the Mercedes-Benz colectivos had a diesel engine with power transmitted to the rear axle by a five-speed constant-mesh gearbox.
__________________
"Senior Luna, your sense of humor is still loco... but we love it, anyway." -rickymay ____ "Your sense of humor is still loco... " -MBeige ____ "Señor Luna, your sense of humor is quite järjetön" -Delibes

1982 300SD -- 211k, Texas car, tranny issues ____ 1979 240D 4-speed 234k -- turbo and tuned IP, third world taxi hot rod

2 Samuel 12:13: "David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” And Nathan said to David, “The Lord also has put away your sin; you shall not die."
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  #60  
Old 02-14-2013, 06:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jooseppi Luna View Post
So it looks like a camper transmission with the 4.7:1 first gear would hit 2000 RPM at 12 MPH in first with the 2.47:1, while hitting 2000 RPM in fifth at 57 MPH (ASSUMING that 5th in the campers is 1:1). This sounds like the ideal fit! If it isn't too noisy (or if it can be silenced with sound insulation on one or both sides of the tunnel), and fits, I may start looking for a camper transmission

Oh! Would a W123 clutch fit? It would be a pain to look for a camper clutch.
...and the 6.14:1 with the 2.24:1 would hit 10 MPH in first at 2000 RPM while hitting 63.75 MPH in the presumed 1:1 5th gear at 2000 RPM.

__________________
"Senior Luna, your sense of humor is still loco... but we love it, anyway." -rickymay ____ "Your sense of humor is still loco... " -MBeige ____ "Señor Luna, your sense of humor is quite järjetön" -Delibes

1982 300SD -- 211k, Texas car, tranny issues ____ 1979 240D 4-speed 234k -- turbo and tuned IP, third world taxi hot rod

2 Samuel 12:13: "David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” And Nathan said to David, “The Lord also has put away your sin; you shall not die."
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