Haters come hate. - Page 3 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Maxbumpo · #31 06-27-2014, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rscurtis

A couple of observations. First, at least in the photos, the paint on the hood does not look that great. Second, why does a turbo car have a clock instead of a tachometer? I wonder if it was a NA car that was fitted with a later turbo engine. In that case, it's a bastard, not worth a fraction of that asking price.

The 123 wagons came with the turbo engine in 1981, so I think it is probably original. Don't have access to the online EPC now, but one could run the VIN and get the data-card and know for sure.

uberwasser · #32 06-27-2014, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maxbumpo

The 123 wagons came with the turbo engine in 1981, so I think it is probably original. Don't have access to the online EPC now, but one could run the VIN and get the data-card and know for sure.

I did. You must have missed it.

MTUpower · #33 06-28-2014, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maxbumpo

The 123 wagons came with the turbo engine in 1981, so I think it is probably original. Don't have access to the online EPC now, but one could run the VIN and get the data-card and know for sure.

Most but not all came with the turbo that model year.

Graplr · #34 06-29-2014, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazy4diesel

That is a beautiful car! But, troublesome ACC, automatic transmission, are 2 big detractors for me. How slow would a NA wagon be with an automatic? Yikes!

You can barely tell the difference between an NA and a turbo. If you lived in the mountains it may be more noticeable. My 79 has more than enough pick up. I guess if someone was really concerned with hp they wouldn't be driving an old diesel!. The servos are a weak point but I've read that the originals last the longest and with only 55k on it it could quite possibly last a very long time. Many contribute the leaking to non OEM coolant as well.

uberwasser · #35 06-29-2014, 06:12 PM

The rest of the ACC is pretty reliable, too. With a car like it, I'd buy it and summarily spend another $595 for a rebuild aluminium body servo with warranty and call it a day. Should work well for a very long time.

I'd suggest that there is a noticeable difference in power. I have a '79 and '85 300D and the '85 is no doubt faster.

However the '79 is fast enough. As long as it can reach freeway speeds by the end of an on-ramp it's fast enough for modern traffic. It can go fast enough to pass folks on the freeway, too. Good enough.

Graplr · #36 06-29-2014, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uberwasser

The rest of the ACC is pretty reliable, too. With a car like it, I'd buy it and summarily spend another $595 for a rebuild aluminium body servo with warranty and call it a day. Should work well for a very long time.

I'd suggest that there is a noticeable difference in power. I have a '79 and '85 300D and the '85 is no doubt faster.

However the '79 is fast enough. As long as it can reach freeway speeds by the end of an on-ramp it's fast enough for modern traffic. It can go fast enough to pass folks on the freeway, too. Good enough.

How long of warranty do they come with? I've had two (used albeit) aluminum units leak in short order.

Honestly I don't notice much of a difference between a NA 617 and a turbo 617.

cooljjay · #37 06-30-2014, 02:57 AM

There isn't much of a difference in a NA and turbo after I think it is 81....the early years, there is a big difference between the two.....even between my 78 and 82....there is a big difference in power....

uberwasser · #38 06-30-2014, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graplr

How long of warranty do they come with? I've had two (used albeit) aluminum units leak in short order.

Honestly I don't notice much of a difference between a NA 617 and a turbo 617.

Not sure. 2, maybe 3 years. I'd be curious to know where the leaking came from on the aluminum ones. There is a gasket at the bottom where the body meets the hose fittings that could be replaced. The main issue with the plastic body ones is when they crack - that's not fixable. That's what you avoid when you have an aluminum one. The plastic body servo on my '79 is still going strong and it's pretty old, though not original. I have a used aluminium one waiting in the wings that I'll probably look at cleaning up a bit, maybe proactively replacing that gasket.

As for the turbo vs. N/A I have to say again that I feel there's no mistaking the extra power unless the turbo car you are driving is pretty tired. My '85 was very well maintained and is a strong engine. It pulls way stronger than my N/A. The numbers don't lie - the turbos have an extra 35hp (or 44hp if you are driving an earlier less powerful N/A) and 55lb-ft of torque. It's quite distinct. Neither are race cars, by any means, and I still love my N/A and it's got adequate power for around town.

uberwasser · #39 06-30-2014, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cooljjay

There isn't much of a difference in a NA and turbo after I think it is 81....the early years, there is a big difference between the two.....even between my 78 and 82....there is a big difference in power....

The N/A's got more power at the end of the '79 model year run. An additional 8hp. Torque was unchanged.

cooljjay · #40 06-30-2014, 09:10 PM

Also remember a NA engine will out last a turbo engine, less strain on the engine itself...

crazy4diesel · #41 06-30-2014, 11:04 PM

Yeah, I don't know. I've only driven my now turbo with the 4-speed manual that had been in the 82 NA Euro car. HUGE difference from what I can tell with just the 8 miles I've driven it. And that's with the differential from the 83 US spec turbo as well, and that's a bump from 3.46 to a 3.09 but don't hold me to that. I'm also not entirely convinced to longevity either, the turbo doesn't require nearly as high of revs to get up to speed before shifting gears, and being able to handle the higher gear ratio of the taller rear end has to help also? I'm loving the way it drives with the turbo and the 4-speed manual.

The NA was OK, but where I live there's a steep hill on one onramp to the freeway, and it has a light at the end in the mornings...you are totally screwed to get the NA up to anything that resembles freeway speed when you get stopped by the traffic pattern light. With the turbo...it's still bit spooky, but it's not down right a moment for fresh underwear.