Gratitude - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

aklim · #16 08-23-2006, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maroon 300D

I was raised Catholic and I would say it's more than a stereotype. It's more of a fear thing, really. There's just something about told from birth that you will be damned to hell for eternity if you're not a good boy.

I believe in God but have serious doubts as to whether any one person's or group's version is really the way it is.

Man is not perfect. Therefore we will miss something or other. This means that if they catch 99% of the crooks (an impossible figure but lets say, for the sake of arguement) 1 out of 100 will get away. What religion promises is that "Thou shalt not get away with it". If I break a human law, there is a chance I will escape so I might roll the dice. However, if there is an eternal power that will mete out justice (tho if I already get punished here, isn't that double jeapody?) that will tell me that somehow, I am going to get punished. So I had best behave. Just like speeding. I know that 999 out of 1000 times I will escape so I will roll the dice. However, if I know that getting caught means summary execution and the odds are pretty good that I will get caught, I might be more careful about speeding.

Personally, if offered eternal life, I doubt I would want it. Without death and it coming to an end, what is the point of life? How will you appreciate say an event if it comes everyday? Kinda like people telling me about the miracle of birth. It is an every second event. How is that a miracle? A miracle would be if someone could stop Hurricane Katrina about 10 feet from New Orleans shoreline.

aklim · #17 08-23-2006, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmercoleza

Nearly anyone who stumbles across a well-engineered MB would deduce that somebody designed and built it. To say otherwise would be a denial of outright fact.

However, a simple cell, which is far more complex, more efficient, and CANNOT be created in a controlled laboratory environment despite scientific advances, somehow evolved by accident?

Humans appreciate art and feel love, and may live and/or die for such. However, neither of these things is required for survival of the fittest.

Calling oneself a Christian does not make it so.

Just because there are hundreds of opinions out there doesn't mean they are all right.

IIRC, that is the teleological arguement. Arguement by design.

True. True. However, How far could we devide an item 500 years ago? Take a piece of pure gold. How much could you cut it down to at that time? Today, we can take it to subatomic levels. At Newton's time, the atomic level was very difficult already. So, if today you cannot figure out a way to do a task, does it mean you cannot do this task or does it mean you cannot do this task TODAY?

When you are hungry, does art matter to you? Love or not? When you are well fed, you can talk about how this, that and the other. If I don't even have a roof over my head, does the specs of the latest S class car matter?

True. Otherwise I would be King Stud.

Doesn't mean they are all wrong too.

Mistress · #18 08-23-2006, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmercoleza

Nearly anyone who stumbles across a well-engineered MB would deduce that somebody designed and built it. To say otherwise would be a denial of outright fact. However, a simple cell, which is far more complex, more efficient, and CANNOT be created in a controlled laboratory environment despite scientific advances, somehow evolved by accident?

Humans appreciate art and feel love, and may live and/or die for such. However, neither of these things is required for survival of the fittest.

Calling oneself a Christian does not make it so.

Just because there are hundreds of opinions out there doesn't mean they are all right.

Andy Warhol, Vincent van Goh and Michaelangelo would differ on that opinion who can survive without art? Humans are a work of art....of course then one would have to define what art is and not even Congress can do that (they tried in 1933 with Branchussi and couldn't) ha!

gmercoleza · #19 08-23-2006, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

True. True. However, How far could we devide an item 500 years ago? Take a piece of pure gold. How much could you cut it down to at that time? Today, we can take it to subatomic levels. At Newton's time, the atomic level was very difficult already. So, if today you cannot figure out a way to do a task, does it mean you cannot do this task or does it mean you cannot do this task TODAY?

Should scientists figure out how to make a cell from scratch, whether tomorrow or 100 years from now, that cell would still be the product of effort and design on someone's part. It would not have appeared on its own.

aklim · #20 08-23-2006, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmercoleza

Should scientists figure out how to make a cell from scratch, whether tomorrow or 100 years from now, that cell would still be the product of effort and design on someone's part. It would not have appeared on its own.

Lets go along with that for a while. How do you know that creator is still around and what his will is? Maybe he made this like we make sandcastles on a beach and walked away? Maybe the creation is a freak of nature?

Botnst · #21 08-23-2006, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Siduri19

Andy Warhol, Vincent van Goh and Michaelangelo would differ on that opinion who can survive without art? Humans are a work of art....of course then one would have to define what art is and not even Congress can do that (they tried in 1933 with Branchussi and couldn't) ha!

What tells us of the humanity of Cro-Magnon?

sfloriII · #22 08-23-2006, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeitgeist

...Catholics on the other hand, seem to have signed some kind of unbreakable contract with the chief apparition and guilt distributor. I pity the poor fools.

None needed. Guilt just keeps me on the right track!!

In addition to not having a supreme being, do you also lack a conscience? I ask because I think it's nearly impossible for any "good" person to lack one. Sadaam and Hitler may be examples of those who successfully erased theirs, but I'd challenge any good person today to say they have no conscience (which produces guilt). And by "good person" I really just mean anyone who knows how to be civil in society, etc.

Botnst · #23 08-23-2006, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sfloriII

None needed. Guilt just keeps me on the right track!!

In addition to not having a supreme being, do you also lack a conscience? I ask because I think it's nearly impossible for any "good" person to lack one. Sadaam and Hitler may be examples of those who successfully erased theirs, but I'd challenge any good person today to say they have no conscience (which produces guilt). And by "good person" I really just mean anyone who knows how to be civil in society, etc.

I agree. What you describe is a psychopath.

B

Larry Delor · #24 08-23-2006, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Siduri19

the opposing thumb is way over rated...

Not if you are a guy.

Larry Delor · #25 08-23-2006, 08:17 PM

If a supreme being made all this "stuff" that is around us, and the universe that we are a part of (something I think we can all agree on, is vastly complex), then what makes us so arrogant as to think that we could comprehend its essence? What makes us think that we could wrap our minds around such complexity??. It is probably something akin to telling an amoeba to fix the oil leak on my 300D.

Kuan · #26 08-23-2006, 09:08 PM

Amazing. Somewhere out there, there exists a being so powerful that it can remain physically hidden from all humanity, yet whose existence can be inferred. If God were so smart, why wouldn't he hide himself from our wandering minds?

Larry Delor · #27 08-23-2006, 09:53 PM

Why would he, or why wouldn't he?

Then again....does the amoeba even know my 300D exists? I doubt it...it wouldn't even know where to begin.

Kuan · #28 08-23-2006, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry Delor

Why would he, or why wouldn't he?

Then again....does the amoeba even know my 300D exists? I doubt it...it wouldn't even know where to begin.

Hush young amoeba. Do not question. Have faith, believe. The oil leak really exists.

dkveuro · #29 08-23-2006, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Siduri19

the opposing thumb is way over rated...

Tell me...when did blood realise it needed to clot...and when did it realise it must only clot outside the body ?

.

WANT '71 280SEL · #30 08-23-2006, 10:27 PM

Larry makes a good point.

Even if scientists could create a cell from scratch. Note that the cell was created from a scientist, now where did the scientist come from? The point is, like St. Aquinas argued, everything has a beginning and a creator. You cannot have nothing, then suddenly cells begin culminating to form what we believe is the universe. Then again, what gave cells directions on what the cell's function is? So, how does a cell know what it is. Someone/Something had to have given a cell a purpose. Though I keep referencing cells, it is not limited to these tiny creatures. These principles I believe apply to everything which exists in our universe, including the aforementioned universe itself.

About some of the statements some of you guys made about Catholics, I believe some of you may be slightly mistaken in your ideas about Catholicism.

Looking back I see that the long paragraph may not make sense to a lot of you but it was more of a culmination of many thought process going on simultaneously.

Thanks
David