No Plan as a Campaign Device??? - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

BrierS · #1 10-21-2006, 05:34 AM

This is not intended as a "hot topic" question. I just find it curious why the majority party accuses the minority party of "not having a plan" when it comes to issues such as Iraq, etc.

As a professional consultant preparing for court I certainly never gave my plan to the opposing party and certainly never received theirs. Why would a political party make this part of their campaign platform? Additionally, haven't outlines of how Iraq should be dealt with been discussed by both sides of the isle with sniping being the result? It seems anything the left suggests is labeled as "cut and run" yet we now are hearing the present administration is moving quickly to explore "adjusting" their positions on how we are going to move forward. The small pieces allowing us to read between the lines indicate a form of "cut and run" will be included in these upcoming strategies yet we won't learn the details until after the mid-term elections are done. One reason for not letting us know what lies ahead is there is not enough time between now and the elections. It seems to me we have had ample time prior to now to recognize changes in strategies are needed and could have been implemented. Do we learn, post-election, that we will adopt some of what the left has been saying for over a year?

When lives are being lost it just seems reality should trump political posturing and bickering.
Steve

Botnst · #2 10-21-2006, 07:24 AM

Recall in the previous election cycle when the Dems insisted that the Repos had no exit strategy and the Repos insisted that they didn't want to tell the enemy (uh, the insurgents, not the Dems) what the plans were.

Both parties are all about gaining and retaining power. They will do or say damn near anything to get in power or stay there. Believing any of their crap is just a waste of brain cells.

B

Jim B. · #3 10-21-2006, 07:33 AM

Political posturing got us involved in the current imbroglio in Iraq, and "national security" concerns will be cited in lieu of answering the tough questions.

The war over there can't be won with so few American troops around to do the dirty work of going from house to house looking for insurgents.

It's turned into a civil war with rival militias battling one another, and US soldiers and Iraqi civilians being killed at a frightening rate.

Americans aren't going to have the stomach for a long drawn out war being fought halfheartedly and with profiteering by Halliburton being the only benefit to anyone

Neither side has offered a sensible solution, about how to identify and defeat the enemy, or how to disengage entirely from the conflict in Iraq.

It's a war grounded in religious belief of fanatic militants, and "Freedom and democracy" has little import for the average Iraqi civilian who is trying to stay alive and feed his family.

BrierS · #4 10-21-2006, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst

Recall in the previous election cycle when the Dems insisted that the Repos had no exit strategy and the Repos insisted that they didn't want to tell the enemy (uh, the insurgents, not the Dems) what the plans were.

Both parties are all about gaining and retaining power. They will do or say damn near anything to get in power or stay there. Believing any of their crap is just a waste of brain cells.

B

Thanks. Your last sentence is likely the key. From a practical position, it just doesn't make sense that power can be THAT important . . . for either party. I sincerely hope either the House or Senate goes to the other party. Not both. Just one. I realize that creates its own set of problems yet some type of balance is needed. Especially at this time.

Botnst · #5 10-21-2006, 10:21 AM

A major problem of my decision on voting is this: Do I vote for the ruling party, that has severely f**ked-up and lost the confidence of the people or do I vote for the opposition party, that has done everything in its power to undermine and thwart every initiative the ruling party has taken?

What a f**ked-up choice!

t walgamuth · #6 10-21-2006, 10:30 AM

i think your characterization of the dems is wrong.

they have mostly gone along like sheep on the war from the get go. only recently have they defected as the will of the people is becoming clearly anti war.

tom w

Palangi · #7 10-21-2006, 10:33 AM

It's dinner time again....

Would you like dog turds or cat turds???

Botnst · #8 10-21-2006, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

i think your characterization of the dems is wrong.

they have mostly gone along like sheep on the war from the get go. only recently have they defected as the will of the people is becoming clearly anti war.

tom w

I think my characterization is right. Etc. Two perspectives, two opinions and no reconciling the two.

That's why we have elections, to settle the issue and MoveOn.

B

retmil46 · #9 10-21-2006, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst

A major problem of my decision on voting is this: Do I vote for the ruling party, that has severely f**ked-up and lost the confidence of the people or do I vote for the opposition party, that has done everything in its power to undermine and thwart every initiative the ruling party has taken?

What a f**ked-up choice!

My sentiments exactly.

And now with the hoorah over electronic voting machines, there's the possibility that even that "f##ked-up choice" will be taken away by someone in a back room hacking the hard drive.

I spent 20 years in the military, thinking in the back of my mind that in some small way I was doing something noble and worthwhile protecting this country and what it supposedly stands for, just so they could turn it into THIS bloody mess?

Given the current state of affairs, it's hard at times not to think that those 20 years were wasted.

Honus · #10 10-21-2006, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst

Recall in the previous election cycle when the Dems insisted that the Repos had no exit strategy...

Help me out here. Are you saying that the Dems weren't 100% correct about that?

Honus · #11 10-21-2006, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrierS

This is not intended as a "hot topic" question. I just find it curious why the majority party accuses the minority party of "not having a plan" when it comes to issues such as Iraq, etc....

I don't see how this can be anything other than a hot topic issue. I also don't understand why anyone would object to discussing hot topic issues. Those are the best kind, IMHO.

But you raise a great point. After our invasion of Iraq, Republicans should be forever barred from suggesting that any Dem doesn't have a plan. The Iraq debacle is the ultimate example of a party without a plan.

Botnst · #12 10-21-2006, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dculkin

Help me out here. Are you saying that the Dems weren't 100% correct about that?

They said it over and over. People who choose not to hear, wont.

Not saying it was a good plan.

B

Honus · #13 10-21-2006, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst

They said it over and over. People who choose not to hear, wont.

Not saying it was a good plan.

B

You lost me. Who said what over and over?

#14 10-21-2006, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst

A major problem of my decision on voting is this: Do I vote for the ruling party, that has severely f**ked-up and lost the confidence of the people or do I vote for the opposition party, that has done everything in its power to undermine and thwart every initiative the ruling party has taken?

What a f**ked-up choice!

Its like a choices you are given in the military; Soldier you have two choices you can scrub the latrines or clean the motor pool...Jeez sarge thanks for the options.

I guess the "choice issue" is why I am so pissed and upside down politically the past dozen or so years of my life I always choose what I wanted and got it, now since the weight of the current political climate is a life and death reality IMO there is no good choice. I'm not sure if you understand what I mean but if you can't its because I have a ****** clue about what the future has in store either way. When Clinton was elected I wasn't too disturbed but the choices this time around are like choosing between hard poop and squishy poop.

#15 10-21-2006, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dculkin

Help me out here. Are you saying that the Dems weren't 100% correct about that?

The Dem's had a plan, Kerry had a plan, The Repubs had a plan but when you are not the one in power its pretty easy to say that your plan would have worked better.

Kerrys plan was to double the Special Forces in two years, which is a great plan...impossible to do but it was his plan. I don't think something that is imposable is a very good plan. Bush promised more troops to stop the insurgency and boosting the VA he did neither. Therefore he is just as much of an ass.......sorry about the open mind.